Hey guys. I'm sorry for no giveaway - I'm really broke right now, but I'll make as soon as possible to thank you all. :) I need your opinions on why ecology education is important and what can we do to save the environment and keep it clean. Thanks to everyone and every little opinion is help for me. :)

1 decade ago*

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1 decade ago
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+1

We don't need to "save" the environment. The planet survided and recovered from WAY worse things than man.
We, on the other hand, need to understand ecology to keep living on the planet. WE die, the planet goes on.

1 decade ago
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Thanks to both of you, I actually forgot to mention that if we die the planet goes on without us. Very good. Thanks again! :)

1 decade ago
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myeah, but we do cause some serious extinctions of whole species. The planet might, at the present state, recover, but some species won't. If its a "problem" or not is debatable. As to the idea that the planet might recover, there is as a matter of fact a point where it might not, or where it might take a nice while to recover and in the meantime humans won't be the only ones to disappear.

The planet as a rock will survive for a while, but if you want to put ecology/environment in the story, as in things that live on that rock, then there is a lot more to it than humans, and a lot of it won't recover.

1 decade ago
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I recommend you all to watch Zeitgeist 1 and 2, also Thrive. All can be found in youtube, i hope it help something to our planet. :)

1 decade ago
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Balance of life?

What's the project? I really hope it's not a paper, or speech, that is suppose to explain why it's important. It's just common sense...it's important because it is!

1 decade ago
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It's about ecology, why we need ecology education and how can we help to save the environment. It's something I'm making with PowerPoint for school (don't think it's something annoying or something made from newbies), so more opinions would really help me a lot.

1 decade ago
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"We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children".

1 decade ago
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This is so much true... I'll include that quote in my project, thanks! :)

1 decade ago
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+100

1 decade ago
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It is important because it allows us to value and appreciate the life all around us. It is a part of biology, and hence science and empirical thought, that separates us from most animals - we can think, evaluate, and ponder the notion of being. As a higher order species, we are not a closed loop in which entropy increases. We can have an effect, possibly permanent, on the world. Our existence does not depend on a total dystopia or utopia, or extinction or survival. We can build civilizations and cause destruction or creation. We create very ideas of genesis and ask questions of the universe. It is hence necessary to learn how to control our power. Ecological education helps bend the closed loop curve by teaching how to bend it - how to save organisms and protect land. It shows us how to conserve resources and prolong our very sublime existence.

1 decade ago
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Thanks, this gave me few new ideas and actually better understanding on how does the nature work. I especially liked the part "It is hence necessary to learn how to control our power.". :)

1 decade ago
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"Our existence does not depend on a total dystopia or utopia, or extinction or survival"

Would you mind explaining this please ? It seems to me that a non negligible portion of humanity is struggling for survival, and as far as extinction goes, it is those days a legitimate question due to the global warming question. The desertification might be a useful example.

1 decade ago
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I've totally forgot I could include vegetarianism into this. This is one of the ways to help the ecosystems recover faster and save them for future. Thanks! :)

EDIT: the second link is quite long and I gotta read that information, but as much as I see it's something very important about the global warming (which is part of my project). Thanks again!

EDIT: I'll check the last links too, very much appreciated, wasn't expecting someone to help me that much!

1 decade ago
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No worries, glad to see some people interested in the subject. If its for a school project you might want to check out the World Preservation Foundation Report which i think is both concise and clear and doesn't need a degree to be understood, you can probably use the various graphics. I remember that the Stockholm Water Institute had also an interesting report.

1 decade ago
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Oooh, I thought you were being a troll with your nickname.

1 decade ago
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Rofl, no, just one of those guys who are crazy enough to actually read scientific reports full of figures and numbers and words and pages and make a decision :-) Although personally my decision was more based on health ( i'm into sports big time ) and ethics and i only discovered the ecological side many years later.

It's all about information, like the saying goes Knowledge Is Power, or Information Wants To Be Free :-)

As related to the OP question, education is useful.

But yeah, i use my alias for the purpose of something like "what does it mean ? -checks a dictionary ? wait what? that exists ? omgwtf ? and he's Alive ?" rofl. And i dare hope that one person in a thousand will follow it with "Why ? i'm gonna check out some research on this weird thing"

1 decade ago
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Because my country had no winter this year due to global warming and pollution, it's also very likely to have a very dry spring. What's even sadder is that stupid people are happy there was no snow not realizing that the crops will be fucked this year and food prices will be higher. I saw one idiot on TV who said he was very happy and that he'd been waiting for global warming to get here.

If people actually learned about this stuff in school maybe the planet would not be in the state it's in now. Like someone above said, it's even stupider that people think we're saving the planet, we're not. Even if we manage to make it so bad that we can't survive on it any longer, the planet will recover, it has recovered from major extinctions and cataclysms before. We're just a blink of an eye considering how old the planet is and how much longer it will continue to exist after we're gone. We need to keep it clean and in good shape so we can continue live on it.

1 decade ago
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We've also missed winter this year (Bulgaria) and we probably won't have spring too. This is very sad and your arguments are very right, I'll include most of them in the part for global warming. Thanks! :)

1 decade ago
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Because Nature's Prophet can kill you if you dont respect nature.

1 decade ago
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PRAIZE NAITURE
IF YOU DON'T YOU'RE GOING TO BE DECOMPOSED

1 decade ago
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Not if you're Skeleton King :3

1 decade ago
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Skeleton King wasn't always a skeleton. (MindFuck)

:D

1 decade ago
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Because that way people will keep believing "scientists" who are wrong since 1980.

1 decade ago
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I didn't really understand what do you mean. Could you explain? Sorry and thanks for your time! :)

1 decade ago
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Everybody thought that we would have no fossil ressources left in the year 2000.Ecology education only helps spreading non proven theories whoch are very common.

1 decade ago
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Yeah, this is very much right. I'm not including any non-proven theories, just the most known and actual problems right now and how to help to not ruin the environment. Thanks! :)

1 decade ago
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Just a point, it's impossible to prove a theory. That's why it's a theory. Gravity, as accepted as it is, is a theory.

1 decade ago
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I know, I mean some theories that sound crazy and ones that sound non-serious.

1 decade ago
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That does not mean we will not run out of fossil fuels in the very near future, they simply did not have adequate information and technology to properly predict such a thing. Only an idiot(just to be clear i'm not calling you an idiot) would believe that such resources are endless and with the constant growth of the earth's population they are not being consumed at an ever increasing rate. Also, if you think i'm wrong just compare international oil prices of today with the ones in the 80s.

Just because some people don't believe in global warming does not make it any less real either.

1 decade ago
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Oil prices are based on the decisions of oil/gas companies. Of course, fossil fuels will run out one day and we need to prepare for that time. Just saying though, oil prices aren't related.

1 decade ago
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Don't mix up random ecologists with Ecology. A scientific study of the matter is needed.
The non proven theories you talk about are spread by random ecologists who themselves know little of Ecology.

Also don't mix up estimates with foretelling. As a member of SG you should know how estimates wins have little to do with how much you'll actually win. :D

1 decade ago
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wuut? not sure if troll or just religious nutjob

1 decade ago
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When a scientist is wrong, he or she simply smiles and says 'well, I helped advance scientific understanding!' The scientific method is a process, not a 'such this then that' definite way of thinking that other ways of thought propose. Science puts forth its best theories through empirical evidence, and then lets it stand the test of time. Scientists almost never say that anything is 'correct', and neither do they say that someone should 'believe' something. They simply give their evidence in an official paper and let the scientific community challenge them. Nobel Prize winner Peter Mitchell even said that he was often in joy when his theories were disproved, as he would have then contributed toward the scientific method.

EDIT: Just remembered a few examples of how scientists disprove each other. As far as we know, the very laws of science are even 'wrong' since they only apply in a specific circumstance. Richard Feynman bet Stephen Hawking or someone like that one time over naked singularities. Evidence was then found that there could be naked singularities (without a black hole) and a t-shirt was happily awarded with the line 'Nature abhors a naked singularity'.

EDIT EDIT: found it

1 decade ago
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This is a pretty good documentary about ecology, and what we can do to help the environment :)

1 decade ago
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Honestly I am of the belief that none of it matters -- that even the biggest of "disasters" (things like the massive BP oil spill) can ultimately be fixed. Even global warming can, in theory, be reversed over time. I'm not saying we can disregard the environment forever, but I think that if we genuinely put effort into the optimization of renewable energy that we can mostly disregard the environment until those projects reach their ultimate goals.

1 decade ago
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... Because all the species we kill off in the meantime (including ones we don't even know about yet), and the irreparable damage we thus cause to biodiversity, and potentially eco-stability, doesn't matter, right? We can totally reverse extinction of species, and all the unforeseeable (and often immeasurable until much later) domino-like consequences such an extinction of even one species or subspecies - of whatever form of life, be it animal, plant, fungal, or bacterial - might have. And there's no such thing as toxic waste, or irreversible ecological damage that can be done by chemicals, or radiation, or practically irreversible damage, in the case of, say, radiation that would take many millions of years to dissipate.

Yeah, no. Your comment is truly asinine.

1 decade ago
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But the gone species can't be fixed. It might be true that new species will come someday, but why should we kill the ones that we have now?

1 decade ago
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I believe the late George Carlin had some enlightening statements on the matter:

"The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles … hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worldwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages … And we think some plastic bags and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet isn’t going anywhere. WE are!"

"The planet’ll shake us off like a bad case of fleas."

Full Source

1 decade ago
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It would make difference, because if everyone does it - the planet would be WAY, WAY more clean and we would save billion worth of resources. At least I think so. :) Thanks for your reply!

1 decade ago
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He was arguing the whole "plastic lasts forever" as a pollutant argument. It is said that if humanity was wiped from Earth this very moment, the only thing that we would leave behind a million years from now would be all of our plastic.

1 decade ago
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Why is ecology education so important ? it isnt, the world is doomed, prepare for fallout instead ^^

1 decade ago
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Who says it's important? This question is suggestive, education shouldn't be suggestive (after all, that's pretty much what the NAZIS did, and you don't want to become a NAZI do you?).

1 decade ago
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Loaded question ftw.

1 decade ago
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I dislike shock treatments, and I think the ecology education you talk about is that, a way to frighten people in order to get them to do what you tell them needs to be done. It's not a bad thing per se, but it can lead to dogmatism, sticking to what people tell you is bad, not looking at the bigger picture.

General ecology, how organisms and their environment interact, that's an interesting subject, and it can be extended to discuss mankind's interaction with the environment, for example by comparison to other animals which displaced another's population, the effects of over-population, that kind of thing.

If by chance you meant the more general aspect of ecology, then yes, I'm for teaching that.

Personally I don't think we can "save the environment". We can try to hurt it less, but "we" are the small percentage who form the rich part of the world, where we have the spare time to give this some thought and energy.

1 decade ago
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We are destroying the environment, that's a fact. Destruction has limits. There is simply a point at which we cannot destroy something because it already is, or because we have destroyed ourselves in the process rending us enable to continue the process, unless we made the process such that it continues without our intervention.

Unless the point of non-return is passed, we can save the environment from further and possibly irreparable destruction. I insist on irreparable, which does not necessarily mean total or forever nor excludes any kind of changes/replacements/evolutions in the environment.

1 decade ago
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Yeah, because humans had nothing to do with this whatsoever, or couldn't maybe come up with a better way of doing things:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch

"The Great Pacific garbage patch, also described as the Pacific trash vortex, is a gyre of marine debris in the central North Pacific Ocean located roughly between 135°W to 155°W and 35°N and 42°N.[1] The patch extends over an indeterminate area, with estimates ranging very widely depending on the degree of plastic concentration used to define the affected area.

The patch is characterized by exceptionally high concentrations of pelagic plastics, chemical sludge and other debris that have been trapped by the currents of the North Pacific Gyre."

"Estimates of size range from 700,000 square kilometres (270,000 sq mi) to more than 15,000,000 square kilometres (5,800,000 sq mi) (0.41% to 8.1% of the size of the Pacific Ocean), or, in some media reports, up to "twice the size of the continental United States""

That's a lot of garbage!

We treat the Earth like a dumpster. Like living in trash? Then don't bother giving a fuck...

Fortunately there are still some beautiful patches left on this planet, for now...

1 decade ago
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I didn't knew about that. Neither I've seen it in any schoolbook. That's something interesting and very dangerous, I would be happy if you know more things like that and share them. Thanks!

1 decade ago
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I'm not saying that we shouldn't do anything or not talk about it. Sure, making students read about it, or spend an hour or two on it is a good thing. For example, it takes less than a minute to read what you wrote here, which is valuable information.

It's just that I always suspect what will happen. People will talk for hours on CO2 and warming, and not discuss the plastic pollution, for example. In the end, it's up to policy makers to decide how to deal with environmental issues, and because policy makers also tend to affect what's being taught, the result may not be that great.

I'm just a little pessimistic about the good it will do, and a little pessimistic about the good that feeding young people facts has vs. providing them with a way to understand (which also involves facts, but also learning from them, seeing similarities and differences, ...).

1 decade ago
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in the midst of all the shit that going with planet earth, i dont think ecology is the highest priority.
sure its important, but the effect of our action as individuals wont even start to bend the pollution we started with the industrial era.
so unless we start making law to stop all the non eco-friendly production and factories, and forcing few law on the citizens. nothing can change

1 decade ago
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China is going to be number one and two in most polluting countries in maybe ten years, it is so bad.

1 decade ago
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Collectivities are made of individuals.

1 decade ago
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Every little step for us is big step for the world. :)

1 decade ago
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you guys are really optimist, i just hope you are right :D

1 decade ago
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No, I'm not gonna write your paper.

1 decade ago
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To show people how dirty they are to their own future. Especially those 30liter/100km guys and you know what i mean

1 decade ago
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Yeah, I've actually written that example :D

1 decade ago
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The best thing we could do is implement better education on the subject and maybe even teach our future generations to be more self sufficient.

There should be more "environmental taxation" on companies that exploit / hurt the Earth for profit. Then the money should be allocated towards reparations for damages done.

Instead of the working class and good samaritans having to clean up the mess, especially from big corporations which profit huge from such destruction.

1 decade ago
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Why is the rich always on the hook for all of man's problems? How about you, personally, clean up all that junk you see and not depend on the government to do it for you?

1 decade ago
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Because the rich tend to make a much bigger mess than regular folk, and more often than not pay their way out of cleaning it up.

1 decade ago
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Sounds like an issue of laziness. Better knock on their doors then.

1 decade ago
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1) Govt funding and subsidies to Amorphous solar cells, none of this crystal solar cell crap that takes 30 years to net any gain in energy from the energy required to produce it.

2)create tons of amorphous solar cell sheets for a large portion of homes (these can be printed on sheets of paper or metal roofing materials. (these cost 1/50th approx price of mainstream crystal solar cells to produce)

3) require energy companies to purchase excess energy at wholesale prices from individuals who produce more energy than they consume. and levvy large taxes on those who consume more energy than they produce.

now we have a large, easily produced portion of the population generating energy at 10-15% efficiency across all homes who get paid for it for minimal 500$ investment as opposed to the 30% efficient crystal solar cells that cost 15-20k to set up.

modify wind energy power plants to sail on kites, reducing the maintenance on their bearings from differentiating wind speed (because slipstream winds are relatively constant across the whole surface of the windmill. (windmills based on the ground require nearly the same amount of energy to run consistently because of maintenance and repairs that have to be frequently done on the bearings which get destroyed by the change of windspeed close to the ground and up high.)

Utilize hydro power wherever possible because it is the most efficient of all green energy sources.

use nuclear power. (more deaths are caused by coal burning power plants in one month than have ever been caused by nuclear power ever.) hybrid nuclear reactors create minisucle amounts of waste due to the repeated use of the same radioactive materials. once waste is produced, shoot it off into the sun and forget about it, don't bury it in the ground.)

once large amounts of clean energy are being produced, climate changes will take effect because you are essentially taking energy that would be used to heat the earth, or rotate the earth (from tidal energy) and transporting it to cities, or hotspots. over thousands of years, this will cause dramatic effect on the climate (slower than global warming, but it will effect weather patterns) this can be resolved by venting off heat into space somehow. now in a billion-ish years the sun will engulf the earth as it grows into a red giant. out two options are to either move elsewhere, or move earth elsewhere via planetary engines that alter our orbit around the sun as it expands. once we overcome that hurdle, if we are still in our solar system, the earth will become uninhabitable and probably be destroyed when our sun goes supernova in 3ish billion years. that will require us to escape to another homeworld, or live the rest of our lives in spacecraft harvesting asteroids rich in minerals to produce energy and materials to sustain ourselves.

kinda bleak when you get real far out there.

really the big thing to consider is that all energy is nuclear, it all comes from the sun, even coal, oil, natural gas, it is all part of a ongoing gigantic fusion reactor. Once you are producing enough energy for the entire world to live off of then you can focus on raising quality of life for everyone across the world, energy is the root of all problems, and the lack of it is the only thing that causes healthcare issues, food issues, water issues, all of this is rooted in lack of energy.

once the whole world no longer has to fight to survive, there is a huge pool of human knowledge at your disposal, all of us can then put that power to solving the future hurdles I had mentioned.

1 decade ago
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Very appreciated for the reply! Especially the part where you explained the Earth heating and Earth rotating was very good, I never thought of that. Thanks again!

1 decade ago
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I Agree with everything you have said except the last part. Earth isn't nor will it ever be a utopia. What does that mean? It means that as long as people are around everyone and everything including the Planet is...how can I put this...FUCKED. That is because so long as humans exist then there's alway going to be that one SOB that ruins it for everyone because of their ambitions. Remember..."Some men just want to watch the world burn..." - The Dark Knight

1 decade ago
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True, which is why I view the human race as essentially doomed, what I was proposing was the ideal way to sustain ourselves in the future, because if we don't do it within the next few decades, it will most likely become impossible. The longer we wait, and the longer we use quick and dirty triage methods to get energy its just going to make long term problems exponentially harder to overcome. all forms of energy collection will come with their problems, but we should always be striving to use the energy that has longer term problems rather than shorter term problems. That is the issue with fracking, while it gives us sustainable natural gas and oil pretty much anywhere in the world, it is not stretching the timeline before disaster. It is a great patch fix for the interim, but if we are not using this time to devote large amounts of our brainpower to longer term energy sources, its a fruitless endeavor.

of course that wont be done however because of idiot politicians that don't know their head from their ass, and the lobbyists that pander to politicians already inflated egos. as you said, stupid humans and their ambitions will always get in the way. alas, all life is, and always will be parasites. life is programmed to think very short term, it is part of evolution, and too many of us still think in the very short term because of our incredibly rapid mental development, it outpaced natural evolution. If we all thought very long term we would all be so worried about the sun expanding, we would be focusing all of our energy towards that end.

maybe, as Ronald Regan suggested, we just need a race of asshole aliens to attack us. That way the entire human race would put aside differences and petty squabbles to in the pursuit of our survival. that would be a utopia too I think. at least until we screwed our planet.

if only people wouldn't freak out about nuclear energy :/ that's the most likely, safest, and easiest solution to our immediate energy needs. but stupid people curse it to the heavens because the soviet union didn't have regulations. that, and they listen to all the idiot newscasters who like to fear-monger.. and the idiot celebrities who don't know a thing about physics generally.. annnnnd well yeah, idiot people listen to idiots generally.

1 decade ago
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Because without it, pot will stop growing, and nobody wants that.

1 decade ago
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this planet was better off without humans, we are like a plague of locusts and consume everything

1 decade ago
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kill yourself then

1 decade ago
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One person killing himself would have no impact. He's talking about the entire species.

1 decade ago
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+1
I would willingly kill myself if I could take a guaranteed minimum 1 billion with me.

Eco-terrorism ftw!

1 decade ago
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I promise to give your corpse one billion.

1 decade ago
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Read Watchmen and everything about why Ecology is important will become clear.

1 decade ago
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A book i would recommend is Endgame, 2 volumes, by Derrick Jensen. He is basically against civilization as we know it. The first volume explains the issues, the second volume tries to find solutions. You don't have to agree with him, but he is nevertheless i think a necessary read for anyone interested in ecology. You might also want to have a look at the E.L.F.

1 decade ago
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To make people more susceptible to allow inflated prices, taxes and policies. People need to be behind the fake reasons for cash being used and taken :)

1 decade ago
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It's not.

1 decade ago
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Closed 1 decade ago by DeadlyCreeper.