Looking at many bundles coming out there, and some of them are being given away here, I started to think indie bundles has lowering games value that comes with the bundle. I've seen many cool games being part in the bundle, but after bundle expires people won't trade or re-think again to buy those games. When someone want to trade one of games that was being part in a bundle: "Nah, it was on $1 before." "It was on Indie bundle. Your offer does not worth ." even they are a nice $10 game.

I know bundles are good incentives for gamers, developers and charity, but looking at the fact after it was being in a bundle people might think those games are not worth buy anymore. Because you can wait for other bundle that would come with it so you can buy it at ultra cheap price.

What do you think? Sorry for my horrible English, I hope you guys get the point.

1 decade ago*

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I agree, but to independent developers mabye be more lucrative.. , i Dunno, if isnt a good idea they not agree too...

1 decade ago
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I think Indie games drop in value faster than non-indie games because they generally lack widespread interest and/or DRM. You can buy them on Steam for $1-5 fairly frequently within months of release. I think the bundles are a great way to get a new set of sales and some more income after an indie game has already stopped selling.

1 decade ago
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I Agree too :)

1 decade ago
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I've got to the stage that I won't buy most indie games unless they're part of a bundle. Too many games that I've bought on sales ended up in bundles not long afterwards - often before I'd even installed them.

1 decade ago
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This... infact I'm still waiting to buy Dustforce and Pineapple smashing crew or whatever its title is...

1 decade ago
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Dustforce is worth Full price to me , amazing game

Just wish they released more achievements for it

1 decade ago
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Agreed. Bought it at release price (-10%), and am just happy with it. :)

1 decade ago
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apparently dustforce might be in the indiefacekick 2 i was just reading

1 decade ago
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Agree, but I don't really have any coherent/meaningful thoughts on how it will affect anything in the future.

1 decade ago
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saoidioasjdonihiuasiodjiuasjiudjwioqkdioashdiuhasn!! STOP KICKING ME OUT, SGIFTS.

Personally, I'd say yes. The Indie Royale Serious Sam pack just interfered with one of my trades. Someone wanted to give me the SS Complete Pack, worth £60+, for my Diablo 3 beta key. I would have leapt on that in an instant, but the IR bundle severely lowered the estimated worth of most of the games in that for a few months. I am having second thoughts, but they do have an impact on game values for a while.

1 decade ago
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poor D3 beta key without use; I know a possible recipient, just in case you're looking for (a poor) one

me, I mean ;P

1 decade ago
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But this is Steamgifts. ;)

1 decade ago
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it depends a lot on the bundles imo.
e.g. humble bundle and indieroyale have only a minor impact imo - the games are often aged quite a bit already and still aren't thrown out in masses.

taking indiegala otoh... they just toss out hundreds of copies for pretty much nothing - yeah, that one certainly does lower the games value - essentially because they're giving out so many keys that pretty much everyone who's into indie games should know someone by now who has at least 1 spare bundle to just give away.

so it really depends on how the bundle is organized imo ;)

1 decade ago
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Most of the games are very new such as Frozen Synapse, Jamestown. Not even 1 year old! That's a big impact

1 decade ago
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yep, those 2 are a great example. I bought 2 copies of Frozen Synapse for me and my friends just after it appeared on steam. Each was 25 €. I liked the game a lot.

But when i saw it appearing in Humblebundle just freaking 1 or 2 months after its initial release, I changed my mind on the whole indie-games thing.
Before this my thoughts were like, yeah why not support a small game company that makes stylish and uncommon products. I can skip on Battlefield 10 or COD 34 which are always almost the same games like its predecessors and they are asking loads of money for that shit. Why not buy couple of indie games instead, they probably give you more value/time to enjoy the game.

With Frozen Synapse Bundle I really got pissed and now I refuse to buy ANY indie game for launch price. Just wait a couple of weeks or months and they will probably appear in one of the countless indie bundles. If not I just take it on steam sale then.

Honestly, I think this whole mass amount of indie bundles is a big shot in the knee for the devs.

1 decade ago
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I have to disagree with you here.
Sure it's a little of a pain to see the game you just bought for a lot being sold for way less now, but there's the same issue with AAA titles.
just check deus ex: hr for example - it has a retail price of 50€ here and was on sale for 7.50$ already.
and something to also keep in mind: indie games have to actually fight with such prices in some sense.
a way bigger issues than most bundles out there are the dirt cheap price tags and crapload of deals even AAA titles have especially in the US zone.

1 decade ago
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doesnt matter, i cant afford any nearly anyways.

I think steam de-values them more than indie bundles do.

1 decade ago
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even when on sale, the price on Steam is way higher that the one you can find in bundles.
If you are a cheap ass you can get most of the bundles for 1 $ or even less.
Just think about the HIB 4. The BTA was less than 5€, which was the sale price of cave story alone.
How can Steam de-value them more than that if steam is selling those game at a higher price?

1 decade ago
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Steam goes on sale alot if you wait 6 months top you can buy the game on sale. Indie bundles sells 2 weeks only.

1 decade ago
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wow and some people buy the bundles in masses and trade away the keys cheap later on...

1 decade ago
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except you can buy them on steam for 0.50 USD usually more like a dollar or two, but still, most indies are worth 15-20 dollars are are base priced at what? five dollars?

1 decade ago
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Yeah, once a game like Frozen Synapse has had a bundle (within a year of launch) I doubt it will sell all that well after that. Which is why I think they shouldn't throw in their games too soon, unless sales have become stagnant anyway.

1 decade ago
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1 decade ago
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Just a sidenote: That blog entry was made BEFORE his Gratuitous Space Battles was taking part in the HiB4.

1 decade ago
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1 decade ago
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I know there are several games that I would never have considered playing were they not part of a bundle, but that I ended up being pleasantly surprised with. I think being in a bundle increases a game's exposure, which is key.

1 decade ago
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Does it lower the value? No, it lowers the cost/price of the game. However, with a lower cost, people are more willing to spend the money to get and try a game they would probably never have tried. If the game is good, then it goes on to sell more copies as word of mouth spreads. If the game is crap, then it probably wouldn't have made much anyway.

1 decade ago
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Well, if I count them correctly I've bought Osmos at least 5 times and World of Goo 4 times now. I've bought Frozen Synapse on release on Steam and later again in it's bundle. Most of the games I've bought more than once. I also never give away keys of a bundle that I use for myself (so I keep the HiB3 keys from HiB4 - although I already own an HiB3), which is illegal, even though nobody cares about it. Many of the games I didn't play a lot, yet I can tell somebody, if he may like it. I can advertise them.
...so the bundles are a really good opportunity for game devs and I don't have the feeling of lowering their value.

Then on the other side I've seen in trading forums, that many people won't trade anything for "Braid", "Frozen Synapse", "World of Goo" etc, because "they were in a bundle and aren't worth a shit". That really hurts for those excellent games. I mean they aren't in a bundle by now! Also I really can't understand, how so many people are complaining about the Humble Android Bundle, which had some very excellent games in it. It seems like they mostly hated it, because they already had those games, which is ridiculous, since they don't have to buy it.

1 decade ago
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how is it illegal to give a key to a buddy?? are you mad bro?

1 decade ago
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Most bundles tell you plain as day that the keys are for your own use only.

1 decade ago
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are you even more mad? most bundles have the option to buy it as a gift and it's clearer than clear that youre supposed to hand the links out to friends or other people. On the other side, I paid for all of the keys in my bundle, if I already have one of the games nobody can stop me from giving a spare key out.

1 decade ago
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re whether bundles allow you to distribute keys by themselves

The Humble Introversion Bundle, on the Steam keys tab, says:
"All keys are for your personal use only."
On the Desura keys tab, it also says:
"All keys are for your personal use only."

The first Indie Gala bundle, however does not mention whether I am allowed to redistribute keys. (Don't ask me for keys; I used all of them myself anyway.) Then again, Indie Gala is kinda notorious for changing their text content in the middle of their sale periods, such as adding "only available on Steam" only several days after they started selling Indie Gala 2.

1 decade ago
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That nobody stops you doesn't mean it is legal. Do you really think, you get 5 shareable versions of each game (Win-Installable, Linux-Packages, Mac-Installable, Steam-Key and maybe Desura-Key)?
It's called humble BUNDLE because you buy a set of games in 1 bundle. You can gift bundles to other people, sure, but it is not intended that you rip that bundle into parts. A bundle is for your personal use only.

Actually that is even why they have a gifting option.

1 decade ago
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Their trade value, perhaps, but trade value isn't everything...
Still I traded sr2 for the ball... and the ball was in Be mine...
Saint's Row 2 - $14.99
The Ball - $19.99
So maybe not a good example... But if I understand correctly, Sr2 would have been popular anyways and The ball not so much when compared to their prices, so I don't know.

1 decade ago
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Whenever I see a game in a bundle the overall price I would pay for a game in there drops significantly.

Ex: 5 games in a bundle are on sale for $5, the game I was interested in is normally $5, but I would buy it for $2. Once the bundle comes out I would only get the game for $1 or not get the game at all. Even though it was the game I wanted the most in the bundle. It may be different for others, but once a game is in a bundle the overall price I would pay for it drops.

Ex: Planning on buying a game, instead see it in the bundle and buy it instead for a lower price overall.

Think keeping keys are perfectly fine, but gifting kets without trading them are fine.
Though gifting it to people you know would be for the best.

1 decade ago
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Not really, steam traders just use that excuse to get the game for the cheapest price possible. In reality, most indie games are worth more than their original price because they are so damn beautiful.

1 decade ago
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1 decade ago
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Basically, people have no idea how much effort and time goes into these indies, they just want to expand their steam library in teh cheapest way possible.

1 decade ago
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effort + time =/= value. I could put 12 years into making a game and still have a shitty game thats not worth anything. I could also put 72hrs into a game and have people think its god's own design. Perceived value is different from the intrinsic value. Value will always be differnt from person to person. You might think just because its indie its worth more then X, while someone else might think a AAA is worth more then Y.

1 decade ago
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Well, that still means you done something wrong, not enough effort turning those bad points into good.

1 decade ago
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For me? Not really, for me it merely makes them affordable.

1 decade ago
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Yes

1 decade ago
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Probably yes but games which are sold in bundles often don't sell very much by that time, otherwise anyone will probably prefer to sell them for full price.
I think at indie bundles as the last attempt for a dev to sell a game who doesn't sell much at full price anymore.

1 decade ago
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i think just the steam trading devalues it.

1 decade ago
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Not really, people might want to not buy those bundle games at full price after bundle promo ends.
I am hoping to get Cave Story+ but realizing CS+ has been on HIB before, I nor my friends said we should wait for other bundle or sale, featuring those games.

Well, maybe bundles can gives exposure to games but the problem is sometimes highest-rated Indie, say, WoG, CS+, Jamestown, Shank etc. can be taken at low price. Thus people think those indie gems are worthless to buy at full price.

Just my two cents.

1 decade ago
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I think bundle do lower the price I'd expect to pay for these games, but they get me to spend more on them than I would have otherwise (which is typically zero).

1 decade ago
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Anybody ever tell you your avatar is one crazy dog? Where did you find that bitch? (Or is it a male?)

1 decade ago
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In the game Jolly Rover.

1 decade ago
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Bundles doesn't lower the price for 1 simple reason: how many of you guys (ok, WE) will buy an avarage indie devellopped game for, let's say, 15 bucks, without knowing what is about, if it's good and if it worths its price?I throw a number: 5% (and I'm generous). Indie bundles are "promotion" or, if you like, opportunity to help devs and to enlarge your game experience with something new. So, for devs, it's better to sell 1K bundles at 1$ instead of 50 full price so they can spread their work and maybe create something better in the future. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think that's the way devs think at the moment.

1 decade ago
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1 decade ago
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profitability
outsold another version of the game

Question though: Did it exceed the sales in terms of profitability? Bundle sales generate much less revenue per individual sale. In the case you cite, though, the sheer number of sales probably does make up for it, though.

1 decade ago
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1 decade ago
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Actually, Introversion is one of the two least successful (in terms of revenue collected) HIBs; it had the lowest average price at US$4.09 and the second-lowest total revenue at $0.77M (the Mojam had only 0.45), according to Wikipedia.

That said, I haven't been able to find exactly how the sales figures break down between the various recipients (developers, charities, and HIB organizers). Cliffski's post about GSB being in HIB4 suggests that at least some of that information is confidential and not publicly released.

In any case...

So from a business perspective, bundles are best used to get one last chunk of money from a game after interest has mostly waned. Putting a newer game in a pay-what-you-want bundle is a sucker's move.

Totally agree with you there.

1 decade ago
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Ok the perceived value may be lower then real value but I think that if a game (indie or not) is enjoyable for me worth a lot even if his price is 1$.

1 decade ago
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Isn't this like saying "Steam Sales lower the games value"?

1 decade ago
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lol +1

1 decade ago
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+1

Yeah, people kinda know to wait until the summer and winter sales.

1 decade ago
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It is and quite frankly: They do.

The last time I paid more than 10€ for a game is quite a while ago and I'm not the only one. And this is mainly due the cheap steamsales. Why bother with a 50€ game when there are plenty of good and unplayed game out there for less than 10€?

1 decade ago
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Well, that's a different issue, though--you're comparing prices between different games. That's not the same as different prices for the same game, at different times.

1 decade ago
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The only times I pay more than $5 are if I buy for gifting.

1 decade ago
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You has a point there....but in bundles you can get 5 indie games for only $2 even. Same as lowest Steam sales price. Even lower.

1 decade ago
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I think only trades "lower" the value of games (and i mean "lower" because they only see price, not quality).

It only lowers the value for those who let themselves carry away for the price tag, i know MW3 is priced at around 60USD, that doesnt mean i think its worth to spend 60USD on that game.

Quality before quantity, i think this could be applied to games and their value, instead of bundles alone.
(hell, a quick example, just because Amnesia was worth a cent in the humble bundle it doesnt mean the game is worthless, its actually more scary than Fear2 and 3, which together are priced at 55USD.)

1 decade ago
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And I add this: if someone says "Nah it was 1$ before" or else, he's right...You can't trade Shank for a 9.99$ game...You are just wanting to trade something you got cheap for something that doesn't...it's the same if you want to trade Civ V, that was 7,99, for a 30 bucks game...it's insane...get over it...

1 decade ago
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On the other hand, I think that people should stop taking list price so seriously with trades. When I make a trade, I ask myself, do I want the game I'm expecting to get more than the game I'm giving away? If the answer's yes, I'm generally okay with the trade.

Though it probably helps that I'm generally not interested in big-budget titles.

1 decade ago
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You're right!If I don't give a s**t of Skyrim (It's an example!!) I may accept Assassin's Creed Brotherhood even if his price is not 50 bucks just because I like AC very much...I know that it's insane...but price list is not so important (Come on you seriously spend 80 bucks for a beta access?!?!?)

1 decade ago
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I have to say that it alters my response to buying indie games even when they are on sale. The last indie game I bought outside a bundle was Dungeons of Dredmor and about a month later it was in a bundle. Now Orcs Must Die! is on sale for 5 dollars with the DLC but I am debating on holding off since it will likely be in a bundle itself sometime soon (the DLC however may not unless it is Indie Royale)

1 decade ago
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To be honest, the only value that goes down is the "Trade" value. If you look in steam forums you will never come out happy with x trade. The notion of trading "new" games is a silly concept still. Everyone wants more money than they invested, which is a normal thing. Indie games don't have exposure as big franchises do and the Indie bundles, like it or not leave indie devs a small portion to invest in future games etc. The real questions is, how much is the game worth to "YOU"?. if you want games for trade then yes it hurts the value, if you want to play the game however it does not. (think about it. why would you purchase a retail priced Indie game for trade? nobody is going to trade you for the price, they can just buy it themselves. Most indie games are bought at discounts to trade later on when the sale is over. the bundles just caps your game and laughs at you while chanting "you cheap **** you just wanted more didn't you?") In the case of you wanting the game the value you set for a game will be close to the retail because you want it, perhaps barter the price down to half. On the other hand if want to trade your extra copy that was released in a bundle your value is almost 0 unless you find the right person. Well there go my 2 cents in the matter :).

1 decade ago
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Closed 1 decade ago by RanTH.