The point is simply to postpone the games being cracked. The most important time for a new games are the first few weeks after release. If Dunovo can keep the game uncracked in that period, it has done its job, as the sales will increase in that period. That is why you see it being used, even if it is cracked a few weeks after launch. You even see it get patched out once it's been cracked. But as long as it postpones the release of a cracked version, it's worth it.
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Still 3 days where people might buy the game instead. But it's not just that. Before some games were cracked and on the internet before the game actually launched. That cost a lot of sales too. Companies don't necessarily do this for politics. They do it because it pays off.
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only in the eyes of the lawyers that convinced the company bigwigs the price of the drm was worth it. drm is generally puched by lawyers trying to keep their otherwise cushy jobs, it has no effect on piracy.
never has, never will.
...and no, i dont support piracy - quite the opposite, im just not some simple muppet. I own IPs, ive worked in the game industry. ive had to do DMCA takedowns (never needed a lawyer either).
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Nonsense. I agree 1 download != 1 lost sale per se. But the companies have tried with and without dunovo at launch. And it has an effect at launch. A month down the line, not so much. That's why you see games like Doom having it patched out the second it's cracked. Companies are more focused on the bottom line than what a lawyer says.
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Except there's no proof it has an effect on launch or at least what that effect is, it might actually be causing the sales to lower. Games in some series have sold better when they released without Denuvo, but i would also not use this stat to assume Denuvo actually lowers sales. The matter of fact is there are many factors that might affect the sale of a game, so it would be impossible to know if it has helped or not.
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Actually, a new DRM, before it's been figured out, does impact piracy and by extension, a small amount of sales gets gained StarForce was especially hard to crack when it was new, it ended up taking over a year for them to crack it.
But that's not why it gets used.
Nor is it for lawyers. Lawyers don't care if a game gets pirated or not, as long as their company stays afloat.
What it's for, is to keep shareholders and investors off your back. Fredrik Wester, the CEO of Paradox had this to say when he got asked why companies use DRM:
I don’t know. I think there’s a lot of politics, especially in bigger companies. It’s simple for me being the CEO and half-owner of Paradox. I can basically call the shots I want to call, and if the board wants to ask questions it’s like ‘OK, we can take this into consideration.’ If you’re a CEO, you need to cover your back. And the people who ask, the board, know nothing about games. They’re there because they’re some investment company or something, and they ask “So what are you doing to protect our game from pirates?” And then they can reply “We’re buying this solution from Sony.” So I think it’s been a way to cover your back, previously.
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Ultimately its the lawyers that push them though, Cpt. Hagbard. usually because the shareholders complain about piracy, and then ask what the legal team is doing about it.
(you know me and my history well enough to ken im right lad - we've had this convo once before in another land on the continent of internetia)
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I doubt they provide any form of guarantee. They probably only boast to be the best, while however, not promising anything.
Like any other service, the client pays for the service that is being provided, and if someone manages to crack a game, it isn't the company's responsibility as they don't claim their service to be 100% absolutely uncrackable.
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AFAIR Doom had denuvo removed right after it was cracked and I read "somewhere on the internets" that it was due to the contract: early crack = (partial?) refund on the condition of protection removal. No idea if that's a standard thing but I would assume so, as a dev I wouldn't pay for a protection without any form of guarantee.
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From what i've seen, companies stop using denuvo immediately after a crack is released.
This leads me to believe perhaps the contract is nullified after denuvo fails to protect their game from pirates.
Perhaps denuvo is paid a percentage of sales during the time that the game was still secure or a flat fee hourly/weekly/monthly.
For a huge AAA game every minute your game is not cracked can be an insane amount of money and would be worth paying to secure.
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from what we know, the premium option of denuvo costs only 100,000$ flat. no percentage (there are options for that as well, though). there was a reddit post from someone who pretended to be a dev studio and asked for prices. if that is correct, denuvo is actually super cheap. and i get why publishers use it, even if it gets cracked very fast lately. 100,000$ is nothing for a big project.
EDIT: found it. https://www.reddit.com/r/CrackStatus/comments/4mtb46/conversation_with_a_denuvo_employee/
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i was trying to answer regarding the percentage MtvYoloSwag mentioned. so, i think i did that.
inconvenience is a very subjective thing. most people don't even realize when a game has denuvo. you can see it on the forums. there are often people who are surprised the game they played for a week already has denuvo. also lots of people (including myself) don't feel there is anything directly inconvenient about it. performance is fine (Rime was an exception). the activation limit is nothing a normal user will ever be hindered by. most people simply don't notice denuvo at all. the people who boycott denuvo games are usually doing it out of principle. and they have a few good arguments, sure. like the question what happens to denuvo games when their servers shut down (won't be a problem, devs will just remove it then; still a valid question). but direct inconvenience - no, not really.
don't get me wrong, i wish it would just go away. of course denuvo is not good for us customers. but people post a lot of shit about it (and even lie on order to hurt denuvo's reputation). and that's not the way we should discuss these things. we should work with facts.
regarding your question: some devs remove it, some don't. there's not a general rule that it gets removed as soon as cracked (unfortunately).
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won't be a problem, devs will just remove it then
Sadly not necessarily, there are many games that still have their old DRM and studios never bothered removing it, even if it causes problems for some of the people trying to play the game.
but direct inconvenience - no, not really.
There are some that might no affect most, but there are. If you happen to go offline before launching the game you won't be able to play it until you can go online as it needs to verify the first time the game launches, also not entirely sure how long it is (seems it might vary depending of game) but if you don't use it online after a while you won't be able to play the game as it does a check after a set amount of time.
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Sadly not necessarily, there are many games that still have their old DRM and studios never bothered removing it, even if it causes problems for some of the people trying to play the game.
but how many games that are actively sold on steam have a non-working DRM in place? i agree for very old titles this might be a problem. but since many studios remove denuvo anyway after a while, if it really happens to a game in the future, it will be an exception.
There are some that might no affect most, but there are. If you happen to go offline before launching the game you won't be able to play it until you can go online as it needs to verify the first time the game launches,
but doesn't steam drm do the same thing? nobody is complaining about that. i am actually not completely sure about that, since i have internet all the time. but i think every steam drm game needs a one-time activation with the first launch. nobody cares, yet it is one of the major complaints about denuvo.
also not entirely sure how long it is (seems it might vary depending of game) but if you don't use it online after a while you won't be able to play the game as it does a check after a set amount of time.
i think i read it's every 2-3 weeks. but i am not sure and i would prefer an official source for that. because the internet is full of people who don't know what the are talking about or even straight out lie about everything regarding denuvo. so until i see a trustworthy source, i am not even sure this really exists. but even if it does - again, for the overwhelming majority of gamers this is not an issue at all. of course it's bad that there even is something like this. the whole copy protection via drm thing is stupid and shouldn't exist. but let's be honest, for almost all people it really doesn't matter. it's more a discussion about principles, not about actual practical downsides (with very few exceptions).
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I can speak as someone who had NO internet a few years ago that none of the games I ever played off steam needed to be played online. Hell some games I've put over 20-30 hours in, but Steam shows me as not playing it at all since it was all offline. Though I did buy TWH II when it launched and I forgot it had denuvo so when I downloaded it and took it back home it wouldn't launch and I couldn't play the game for a full week after I had bought it because of this issue. If it wasn't for the fact I really wanted to see if I liked it I would've just refunded it there. I want to buy the new Star Ocean, but to me it's a matter of principle now and it's just the whole "What's the point in paying for an inferior version of the game?" NIER Automata runs great cracked, but when I bought the game it wouldn't play for more than 15 minutes before CTD and it was really aggravating to me to think I payed $39 for this and couldn't get the same experience I got when I got the game for free.
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Meanwhile, I wonder how many people avoid buying a game because of denuvo's reputation for adding stability/performance issues.
Given that there's no way to precisely predict launch sales, or to fairly compare two launches, there's no way of validating if denuvo measurably helps (or hinders). Thus, in the long run, it ends up being a security blanket for a company (and presumably, is added more to appease a board or owning company, over being a high priority inclusion by the developer or even the publisher): It makes them feel like they covered their bases, and for many, that alone is enough to justify a purchase of something.
That said, piracy (when not engaged in for economic, logistical or ethical reasons) and pre-order/launch purchase both appeal heavily to a self-gratification mentality, so it's certainly feasible that there's some overlap. The real question is, is it $100,000 of overlap. :P
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Gaming
More than 300 days! That is how long one of the latest Denuvo-protected games has gone without being cracked. This is simply unprecedented and a testament to one of Denuvo’s core principles: always keep innovating.Our Anti-Tamper solution allows publishers to reap the benefits of stamping out all piracy attempts in the crucial first weeks of a title’s release across platforms including Desktop, Mobile, Console and VR.
Our Anti-Cheat solution adds run-time application self-protection over the whole life cycle of the game far beyond the release window.
They are so funny
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I can say I still do it occasionally (Shadow of War is my most recent example and before that was. . . I think was No Man's Sky) simply because I want to try out the game and see how it is if I am sketchy on if I'll enjoy it (IE I'll probably do it for the new Star Ocean game coming to PC) but I'll gladly pick it up if I know I can trust the publisher or port company (IE i'm picking up Lost Dimension day 1 due to lack of Denuvo and the fact Ghostlight games rarely give me performance issues and they've fixed the FPS issues that plagued the PS3 and Vita version.) or if it intrigues me enough to warrant the full priced purchase.
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I read this article yesterday:
https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/10/denuvos-drm-ins-now-being-cracked-within-hours-of-release/
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