https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/zrx2e/offcourse-you-can-now-get-the-corona-virus-on-your-pc-too that one was kind of a joke, and some hated "promoting" those games.

Anyway it's starting to spread larger and larger in countries and throughout the whole world, are you scared, are you prepared or you act like it's just like the flu?

Meter/map:
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Other news/tips/prevention
https://bnonews.com/index.php/2020/02/the-latest-coronavirus-cases/
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/2020/02/here-is-what-coronavirus-does-to-the-body/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/09/can-a-face-mask-stop-coronavirus-covid-19-facts-checked
https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/03/dont-panic-the-comprehensive-ars-technica-guide-to-the-coronavirus/
https://fold.it/ Download and play Foldit and you can help researchers discover new antiviral drugs that might stop coronavirus!

https://time.com/5791661/who-coronavirus-pandemic-declaration/
"Outbreak is ‘deeply concerning,’ with ‘alarming levels of spread and severity.’"

2 months ago*

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I talked to a friend in the US, and he said that two things are in short supply: toilet papers and guns. I can't see that going well.

2 months ago
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Then this must really be hard to find.

View attached image.
2 months ago
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Thanks for that. I needed a laugh :)

2 months ago
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A weapon to surpass Metal Gear.

2 months ago
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Guns? Really?
Not that I'm surprised, it is America, after all... but what are they planning to do, help the virus if it fails to finish its job alone?

2 months ago*
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Home defense.

People do desperate things when they get scared, when they're going hungry. Crime is already up, at least in California where I live. Burglaries and robberies are increasing.

2 months ago
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Protect their toilet paper hoards of course.

2 months ago
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There was a report on it here and they interviewed some people. Apparently it's for "when the cops no longer are around they need to defend themselves."
No idea what they think Corona is or does, but yeah, basically just typical America I suppose.

2 months ago
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It's obviously for the PvZ scenario

2 months ago
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It's kinda like that one game.. WASTED.

2 months ago
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Yep, it's true. People in the US, particularly those who are religious, are starting to treat this like the end times.

2 months ago
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IDK. I literally bought bullets at Wal Mart last week. There was however a distinct lack of toilet paper.

Most of the local area stores did finally get paper goods in overnight though.

2 months ago
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did they really found a cure ? i saw that its about 2 antibiotics that are used for malaria , but is it really gonna help against the corona ?

2 months ago
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Even if that's so they need to test it on a few thousand patients first, and so much more to it for something to become an official cure.

2 months ago
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No one's sure yet. They think it might work, possibly with some modification, but for now it just seems to be an educated guess.

2 months ago
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There are at least 3 dozen old or new vaccines or medicines that have shown initial promise against it.

2 months ago
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in my country they are using a medicine (which is originally for HIV patients) on Corona positive patients. Things go pretty well

2 months ago
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no side effects ?

2 months ago
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yes, no report of side effects until now, some patients are getting better but we still need more time to review the treatment

2 months ago
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favipiravir or kaletra?

2 months ago
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The govt doesn't announce the medicine name to prevent people from stockpiling it illegally (which is happening to Chloroquine when Trump said it can cure the Corona)

2 months ago
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UK is now locked down for at least 3 weeks.

2 months ago
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I just can't believe that 16k+ people just died...I thought media was overhyping the disease ...i was wrong

2 months ago
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That is still overhyping considering how many people die every day without any pandemic. That's 16 thousand out of 7.5 billion and mainly old people who would die soon anyways. 2 days worth of kids dying from malnutrition, 4.5 days worth of tuberculosis deaths and so on to have some comparison about the actual seriousness.

2 months ago
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16k out of 7.5B?

7.5B were not infected, if they were it would be millions dead.

2 months ago
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Tuberculosis kills 1.5M per year even when nowhere near even 1% are infected with it. Lately they have been updating the estimated number of people already infected with corona to be much higher than earlier, time and better testing will tell us the actual numbers.

https://reason.com/2020/03/25/half-of-united-kingdom-already-infected-with-coronavirus-says-oxford-model/

2 months ago
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Yes I hope so as well. If it is true and the actual number of infected is much higher, due to lack of testing and patients who are asymptomatic, then we might actually have a mortality rate less than 1%.

2 months ago
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Meanwhile, the website for the American CDC informs us that Influenza has reached epidemic levels in the U.S., this year, killing approximately 50,000 people per week, about 10% of those being pediatric (child) deaths. If I am reading these statistics correctly, that is the current death rate from Influenza in the United States. In comparison, COVID-19 has killed about 2400 in total in the U.S. thus far.

2 months ago*
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There are massive differences between the traditional Influenza the new novel SARS-CoV-2 that no one has immunity too. It likely started in Wuhan China but mutated extremely worse in Italy and this is just the beginning. The traditional Influenza has a 2 day incubation period. This has a 14 day with 20% of the cases being Asymptomatic. What about spreadability? Influenza has a R-naught ratio of 1.3 and COVID-19 reported higher than 3. On a graph it would look something similar to: https://i.imgur.com/4IFPQ6a.jpg

Given the data you can input the 'lag time' we reach our peak in mid May. Imagine if we treated this like the common cold and kept the airports open. I highly recommend reading or watching once how COVID-19 attacks your body. It's very different and I am curious if ever they find Patient Zero.

2 months ago*
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Forget it. We are too early into the 'curve' that people understand what kind of problem we are talking about. As my math teacher would put it "Exponential growth boggles the mind". Plus people really don't understand what it means to only have supportive care rather than an effective therapy against a disease.

2 months ago
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Happy Cakeday:)

View attached image.
2 months ago
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Aww thanks! Wasn't aware of my bday here, mine was on the 19th and thought it showed that at first :D

2 months ago
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I wonder how many people were saved from dying in car accidents by lockdowns. That's normally a few thousands deaths a day, so we may be winning more lives this way than we're losing to the virus.

2 months ago
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People will have harder time staying indoors during good weather, I hope lockdowns and quarantines will stay up proper.
Also I'm a bit worried about cabin fever and depression setting in after 2-3 months or so. Nevertheless, we are incredibly lucky to have such a wide array of options thanks to internet regarding information, entertainment, communication, working

2 months ago
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I think its ok to go outside for a walk etc. But not to markets, visit others, use city transport.
Just avoid ppl.

2 months ago
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Olympic games 2020 delayed by one year.

2 months ago
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funny how china's numbers barely move anymore. so they have defeated the virus!
at the same time they toss foreign journalists out of the country to deny news coverage.
i wonder why?
never ever trust a commie.

2 months ago*
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And now china and russia wages information war. Like hey always do.
https://twitter.com/taipei_weather/status/1241932022299291649 (just a little example of the massive trolling that has been discovered lately)
Trying to write new history, like russia is trying with WWII they started and colaborated with hitler. Or blame hitler for Katyn and other similar places. Nat geo or discovery has real history described there.

So ppl, form western world. Be carefull when reading sth bad about western world. Most likely its fake. Be aware of russian and china trolls.

Who believes the numbers of covid victims china and russia have ? Thats right. No one.
We need to observe, more waves from that directions possible.

Why they are trying to destroy western way of life ? Nobody is forcing them to live here. Its great that we still have free media.

2 months ago*
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Stop blaming modern Russia for everything that happened in the past. Or should we blame Poland for collaborating with Napoleon in attack on Russia, for 1919 war or intervention of 1609, or numerous attempts to depose Russian tzars and instigate coups? Honestly, you guys did as much shit to Russia as Russia did to you. Grow some balls and stop complaining.

2 months ago*
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There was no Poland collaborating with Napoleon because there was no Poland at all. Russias fault of course. Learn your history.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partitions_of_Poland

Second ona: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Soviet_War
Russia after communist revolution wanted to conquer europe, so they attacked polad but got defeated.

1609 - its the times that everybody fought with everybody, right ? It happened once.
Lets stick to XX century, the times when we get our independence after 123 years.

And pls stop, im not interested in russian fake version of history. It stopped being amusing years ago.
I know how europen history books look, and i wonder how russin looks.

2 months ago
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"russia is trying with WWII they started and colaborated with hitler"
"Russia after communist revolution wanted to conquer europe, so they attacked polad but got defeated."

Then, using your own arguments, Russia didn't collaborate with Hitler because there was no Russia at all.
After communist revolution there was also no Russia.
Who should learn history now?

Also, the Polish-Soviet war you're linking at started because Poland attacked Belarus (a soviet republic by then). Not because Russia (which didn't exist at the time) attacked anyone. It is written in the article, btw.

So please. The only fake history is the one created in the West. I'm honestly surprised you haven't come up with the idea that COVID-19 was actually created by Russia yet, to attack your wonderful western world.

And finally, if you value your independence so much, perhaps you should act like a truly independent and strong country and stop whining about everything? And please don't forget: if USSR didn't defeat Hitler, we wouldn't have this chat today.

2 months ago*
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"The first modern state in Russia was founded in 862 by King Rurik of the Rus"

https://www.ducksters.com/geography/country/russia_history_timeline.php

2 months ago
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What about Finland, did Putin already succeed in brainwashing everyone to believe that couple million poor farmers just decided to attack Russia for no reason? And there was no deal with Germany to split Europe between you 2 that clearly stated that you can have Finland?

Nobody anywhere else, well maybe in North Korea, believes any of your crap that keeps changing with every ruler, facts stay the same. But keep on being amusing little Putler trolls, since that's all you ever can be.

2 months ago
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Please stop twisting the facts. There was a 'deal' with Germany indeed, but guess what, Germany had similar deals with Great Britain and France as well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich_Agreement
That was a year before the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact. And was essentially the thing that kicked off the WWII. Why don't you people blame the Brits or the French? Oh, and Poland participated in this betrayal of Czechoslovakia too. So much for being the victim.

The reason behind those 'deals' is quite simple really. Everyone (Stalin included) realized Hitler will kick their ass if he attacks. That's why the bigger (no offense meant) countries at that time did everything in their power to delay the attack. Stalin, for instance, never actually intended to be friends with Hitler (like it is now being claimed in the West). The only reason he had that 'deal' was to win some time to get ready for war. If Hitler attacked USSR in, say, 1939 or even 1940, then poof! Hitler would've cruised all the way to the Far East in a year's time. And even by attacking in 1941 he took Stalin by surprise, because Stalin assumed Hitler won't attack until 1942 at least.

USSR did indeed attack Finland, nobody denies that. That was (again, no offense) basically a tactic drill to see whether the army is ready for the war with Germany. And the outcome made it clear it wasn't ready. That was an ass move, as were many things done by Stalin (towards his own people in the first place). Nobody denies that really. It's just that history is a more complex thing than most people want it to be. There's most often some hidden motives behind everything and sometimes great evils led to greater good. Again, most of us are alive now because USSR and Germany had that 'deal', because without it, USSR would've been crushed and Allies would've never won the war on their own). Although you probably would be alive either way, because Finland, unlike USSR, was actually allied with Germany from 1941 till 1944 (and probably would've remained allied with them in case Hitler were winning). Not blaming Finland for that really. Everyone has their own survival to think of in the first place. And everyone had their hands dirty at some point.

So, I've no idea what kind of propaganda do you listen to but thankfully, I know a lot of people in Finland (go there often and have good friends in Helsinki, Turku and Ekenas) who don't share your sentiments.
And please refrain from calling people 'little Putler trolls' as neither I'm little (older than 90% on this site, according to some poll held here some time ago), neither I'm a Putin fan really (always voted against him). Just a person who makes his own judgement and doesn't see the world in black and white and hopes everyone can be friends without any prejudices and misconceptions towards each other. Peace.

2 months ago*
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USSR did indeed attack Finland, nobody denies that.

Except your own government controlled media trying to rewrite history. I guess it has been going on since the war so nothing new there.
https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/6qv0xt/russian_staterun_tv_station_zvezda_rewriting/
https://www.ft.com/content/68710418-2d69-11ea-a126-99756bd8f45e

Finland, unlike USSR, was actually allied with Germany

Yes because they were the only ones helping us against the Soviet invasion in a large scale. If you hadn't invaded there would have been absolutely no need for that alliance and we would have just waited in peace with Sweden, so that is your fault as well.

And please don't forget: if USSR didn't defeat Hitler, we wouldn't have this chat today.

And how well did that turn out when UK/USA/etc just gave the eastern half of Europe to Stalin to destroy who still was far worse than Hitler. I guess for that we can blame USA who just loves to come up with an enemy, ally with enemy of that enemy and then when the first enemy is defeated make a new one from the former ally. USA stopped the 3rd Reich only to have it replaced with a cold war with the Soviet Union.

You're the one reading propaganda, not me. The actual facts have staid the same all these decades and have been verified by people who actually lived in war times like my grandparents, no amount of rewriting will change that. I also know several Russian people who have moved here who share my knowledge of the facts. I guess they can't share them in Russia because they would just be sent to Siberia like always.

If you share the opinions of trolls who get paid by the government to spread misinformation all the time then it's not that far fetched to classify you as one, but I'm sorry if you actually believe that you have free access to all information and are making your own judgements. There is literally only one thing stopping Russia from being friends with other countries and that thing rules you. If your rulers force you to belong in the evil communist country trying to invade every neighbor category then there really is very little other countries can do. Or if they take control of all media to ensure only their alternative facts get spread people, that doesn't change actual facts any more than Fox News does.
https://kampanjat.hs.fi/media/FreePress/Freepress%202018.html

To stay on topic, what's the latest corona news in Russia? Still claiming only 2k or so infections in the whole country with a long land border and heavy trade with China?

2 months ago
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Heh. Basically you do exactly what most Western countries do. I've been friendly and reasonable towards you, but you still attack me.
Same as my country, when it's trying to be friendly with others, is met with hostility and accusations of being aggressive. You're saying the other countries would become friends with Russia if we replace our current 'ruler'? Don't make me laugh. You said it yourself. USA just loves to come up with an enemy. And almost everyone is USA's lapdog now. It's not our rulers they don't like, it's Russia. Its very existence.

Answering your questions, Zvezda is a small channel most people in Russia don't even have on their TV. Their coverage is probably less than 5% of Russian population. I live in the second-largest Russian city and don't have it, and don't even give a damn about it, although I can agree the article you linked at is bullshit. But there was a series of programs on Russian First Channel (which everyone in Russia has access to) last year dedicated to Russo-Finnish relationship which told the truth about the matter.

So yes, there is propaganda and misinformation. So what? There's as much propaganda and misinformation about Russia in Western media. The issue is that it sells. We have a writer Nikolay Starikov here, who was pretty decent and fair at first, but then he realized he can make huge money with insane propagandistic theories. I'm not denying that. But I can name you a hundred cases of Western media twisting and rewriting history in the same way. We just don't really care here. As we don't make a fuss over NATO aircraft violating our airspace as much as 30-40 times a day, spies being discovered on a weekly basis and so on.
We take it as a given, unlike the western governments and media that are hysterical over every single Russian fault.

Also you're talking like my grandparents didn't live in times of war. Oh sure they did.

My grandfather was delivering messages to partisans and was once nearly caught by the Nazis. He was carrying a basket of pies and the message was in one of the pies. A German officer stopped him and tasted a few, and it was only by luck he didn't get the right one. Later he was assembling Hurricanes sent by the Allies.

My whole family on my mother's side was driven by the Germans to Latvia for manual labor. My grandmother's brother died there.
I hope your grandparents didn't have to suffer as much during the war, and if they did, well, I can relate.

Now regarding Stalin being worse than Hitler and him destroying Eastern Europe... I don't really know whether to laugh or cry here.
Yeah, sure, he destroyed Eastern Europe so much that half of Soviet people were going to Poland, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Bulgaria and even Romania to buy stuff because those countries had it all while in USSR most people had nothing, because all the money went to those countries to keep them happy and pacified.
Same goes for traditionally unhappy former Soviet republics like Estonia, Latvia or Lithuania. They had so much more than Russians, Belarusians or Ukrainians in Soviet times. Even in the times of Perestroika, when over here in Leningrad the stores were empty, we could (and did) go to Estonia to buy everything we needed. My late godfather had a car then (not many had), so we asked him to drive us there.

"I guess they can't share them in Russia because they would just be sent to Siberia like always."

Yeah and we have bears playing balalaikas and drinking vodka on the streets here. :D

As for the latest corona news in Russia, well, I personally believe we have way more than 2k infected, but the issue isn't that our government hides something. It's just that Russian people generally don't go to a doctor when ill. So I assume there's a lot of people who actually have mild symptoms of covid but don't give a damn. There's also plenty of idiots who didin't quarantine themselves after returning from abroad (Italy, Spain etc) so they could infect plenty more people. Sadly, quite a few Russians are like that.

Still, I don't believe the number of infected here is too high either. Definitely not as high as in Italy or Spain or some other countries. That's because we actually closed the border with China back in January (did they tell about that in the media you're following?), and also because Russian people have a habit of washing their hands and change out of their outdoor clothes after returning home from the street. Many Europeans don't do that.

Anyway. How about we stop hating on other people and entire countries for whatever stupid reason that happened in the past?
Here's another story from my family history to finish this all.

My great-great-grandfather was close to Nikolai II, the last Russian emperor. He served at the court and even named his own daughters after the daughters of tzar. After the revolution he was forced to flee to Central Asia (modern Uzbekistan), where he eventually died. His wife, my great-great-grandmother, then returned with her kids back to Petrograd. They got a small.. well, can't even call it a farm, just a small house and a few domestic animals, and my great-grandmother, who was a kid back then, used to deliver milk to Smolny Palace. She met Lenin a few times and even sat on his lap. Since then she was always calling Lenin "her grandfather" and got mad at me everytime I spoke bad about him, communists or USSR in general (and I did that a lot when I was younger). She had the fondest memories of a person who ordered to murder tzar's family, including the girl she was named after. Always told me he was a good person.
Now I got much older and I realize she was right. It's only our own memories and experiences that matter. Not the stuff we read in the news.

So good luck and stay safe, dear neighbor. Hopefully the situation with corona resolves soon enough and I'll be able to once again visit your lovely country.

2 months ago*
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You can come up with fake reasons for this assumed hate all you want. That doesn't change the fact that I dislike USA as much as Russia for the same reason, stupid leaders imagining they rule the whole world instead of just their own country and waging wars to cover the shit happening there. Russia just is right next to us and USA is fortunately an ocean away and we don't have oil. Most Americans I talk to just agree that their country sucks without making excuses.

That was just the first hit on Google in English, to us they all look like Russia Today, do you trust that one? Find me misinformation about Russia in Finnish media if it's that common? Protip: https://rsf.org/en/ranking

We're not part of NATO and if anything we have been much more lapdoggish towards Russia in the history. There is the problem, you can only see this as Russia vs the rest of the world when to us it looks like Russia vs USA cold war, both are bad and should leave the free world in peace. We're not picking sides so don't try to do that for us. How many Finnish aircraft or spies have you caught recently?

Sorry for your grandparents, don't really know how much mine suffered. 1 died in the war and rest lived long lives after. Most of the suffering came from the years after the war when we were the only country that paid war reparations in full. That is actually one positive side to it, before we had just poor farmers and suddenly we had to build an industry from scratch to pay them.

So you claim Soviet Union invaded and occupied half of Europe just to give them free money and goods? Really? Just look at the economies of those countries today to see the actual truth, West and East Germany being a perfect example. We used to travel to Soviet Estonia back then too but for different reasons.

You closed the border in the end of January, it would have had plenty of time to spread before that with all the millions of tourists coming and going. That makes it more likely that there simply have been no tests and all the deaths get classified as regular influenza or something. Washing hands seems to be the best preventative measure or maybe it's all the bears and vodka giving you immunity since 60% alcohol can easily kill the virus :P

I still don't have any hate for the Russian people, just the country and what the leaders have done in history and are still doing. You need to separate these two just like saying Israel should stop putting Palestinians in concentration camps isn't antisemitism. The worst thing most people in Russia and USA are doing wrong is voting for the wrong people to power, be it a former KGB agent trained to kill or a former reality TV performer trained to entertain.

I'll tell you a happier story of my own then. We were having a BBQ with couple friends and a Russian man wandered there. He tried to ask us something but we didn't understand anything and he didn't seem to speak English either. So he just sat down with us and we only needed 2 common words to have a great time. Vodka? and his eyes lit up with a happy da! Later his son came and explained that his visiting father was just waiting for him. So that's how much I hate Russians that I'm even willing to share my vodka with them.

2 months ago
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He's a Polish russophobe, it explains everything he writes.

2 months ago
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da

2 months ago
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There is no such thing as a russophobe, it's a made up thing your rulers use to justify their evil deeds. It's like saying that if someone beats you up, that didn't really happen and you just have beatupphobia.

2 months ago
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And another one. No, there is a russophobia, it's a well known phenomenon researched by science, in Poland it was created and spread by political propaganda since Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth when they fought for domination in eastern Europe with Grand Duchy of Moscow, and the Catholic Church tried to subdue the Orthodox through Unitarism. Majority of modern myths were created 500 years ago, spread in pamphlets and brochures. It was a planned and funded work. When Poles lost everything their russophobia become a part of national identity. Same with you, Finn, but the major part was made by Polish propagandists.

2 months ago
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well known phenomenon researched by science

:D

How many scientists did it take to figure out that other countries don't like being invaded? So Polish people predicted the Soviet Union and Winter War 500 years before they happened in pamphlets, beware Nostradamus. Or whatever myths were you talking about? You do realize that we live right next to you with a long history of even being part of Russia so we have no need for myths when we know the facts? People here share the same hate for Sweden for the same reasons but for some reason they just laugh it off instead of making up swedophobias or whatever and now it's more of a friendly rivalry.

2 months ago
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One thing I know: sane people discuss Corona virus in a thread about Corona virus. Obsessed people discuss how they hate Russia in literally every thread. You both are like this.

2 months ago
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Where do you see this imagined hate of Russia reaching the level that it has become an irrational fear?

We were talking about how Russia and China love to spread misinformation about corona and then some factophobe Russians come in to defend their corrupt leaders with even more lies just like always.

2 months ago
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It's bullshit based on prejudice, and the prejudice is based on russophobic myths. Epidemic in Russia started later than in other countries, and now everyone can see that clearly, looking at the numbers, we're going like Italy 2 weeks ago. Math models does not lie. All your conspiracy theories were bullshit. Sometimes people obsessed by myths, propaganda and also memes remind me of people sick from flu - they just can't stop to spread the viruses until they're healed (or dead - see banned), but the viruses are not physical, but informational. And there is absolutely no connection of "defending country leaders" with analyzing the situation with the sane mind, free of myths and prejudices, for the sake of knowledge. Think about yourself and what's actually happening in your head, I've said enough.

2 months ago
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Sure it is, since that's what facts are called there. Why is it that you don't have any problems basing your opinions of every other country on far worse myths and prejudices?

2 months ago
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I don't. Tired of your stubborn stupidity, don't want to talk with you.

2 months ago
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You are obviously just suffering from finnophobia, it's nice that we can agree on that

2 months ago
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I do not care about you at all. Go find some Swede to whom you're totally "not prejudiced" too, and pester him with your trolling. Not interested.

2 months ago
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Aww, yet you imagine that someone is interested in your trolling? That anyone outside Russia believes any of those lies?

2 months ago
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2 months ago
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You don't want to talk with me yet you do nothing but. There is a very easy solution to your problem: just stop.

2 months ago
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Poland right now with Duda and Kaczyński and PiS...

People who die from COVID-19 don't die from COVID-19...

Our main TV channel called TVP sponsored by government:
Coronavirus that causes severe viral pneumonia was not the cause of death because the cause of death was severe viral pneumonia:
https://www.facebook.com/204759553053165/videos/692418724899695/
(News only in polish, sorry)

2 months ago
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An acquainted of mine just died due to the effects of the COVID-19 this very morning. He was a bit past 40 years old. His problem was that he had a mild asthma condition that was severily agravated by the pneumonia caused by the coronavirus. He remained intubated for lung ventilation for a couple of weeks.
May God rest his soul in eternal peace.

I think one of the problems about COVID-19 is that it was massively cathegorized as a "flu-like virus", which led to a lot of people thinking "well, a flu is not much, so I'll probably have no problems at all". It would have made those people think twice if it had been cathegorized as a "pneumonia virus" (sorry for the bad english regarding medical terms).

2 months ago
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"People" will always minimize important things. Why? No idea.

It's really sad. The longer you are on a ventilator, the less likely you are to come off of one. The average length on one is four days or less. COVID patients are more like 14-20 (or more) days for severe cases. That is an insane amount of time.

Sorry it hit so close to home.

2 months ago
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I think a lot of the problem came from the fact that it has been characterized as a virus that is as contagious as a flu virus - actually a very bad thing - but people misunderstood that to mean that it was the same thing as common flu and therefore less dangerous than SARS. Would have been better if it was simply described as a highly contagious form of SARS in the first place - that would have gotten people's attention, I think.

So sorry about your friend. Hope you won't lose anyone else. Stay safe.

2 months ago
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The problem is that if this virus was as contagious as a flu we would not have to change anything in our life and no quarantine would be needed. It is 10 times more contagious.

I think this guy explains everything in a great way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWzbArPgo-o&t=2s

2 months ago
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But it is far less dangerous than SARS v1 and MERS that killed 10-40% of infected. Current estimates for SARS v2 are somewhere around 0.5-1.0% and going down all the time as more people get tested. It's less contagious than flu and less lethal than v1, but also more lethal than flu and more contagious than v1. It's also the 7. corona virus to spread to humans, there are 4 weak ones that just cause a regular seasonal flu because we already got used to them and hopefully this one will drop to that level as well as soon as it has caused enough havoc among the old and sick.

2016-17 seasonal flu was a particularly nasty one and the vaccine didn't work well, so it managed to kill 200k more than usual flus in EU alone. Currently v2 has managed to cause a spike like that in just one EU country and that's Italy.

http://www.euromomo.eu/index.html

2 months ago
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Sars caused about 800 deaths worldwide in 2002/2003. That might be 10% of the infected. And seems to be more dangerous. COVID-19 has already caused a multiple of deaths within a shorter timespan only because it's more contagious.

COVID19 is also more contagious then the normal flu. 1 person infected with the flu infect on average 1.3 other persons. COVID19 is over 2 others. See at this way, At the same rate this would mean that in the time for the flu to reach 200/300 infected, with COVID-19 it has gone up to more then 2 million infected.

The other problem is, no medicine seems to work so far. And it causes lunginfections. With the limited machines to help you breath, this has caused many deaths as well.

2 months ago
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SARS v1 and MERS were easily contained just because they were so deadly. If people get very sick and drop dead in couple days, they aren't traveling around the world spreading it without symptoms. Current estimates put it roughly as contagious as the 2-4 seasonal influenza pandemics we have per year. It has caused so many deaths in so short time because it's kind of new unlike the older flus that have been around for ages so there is no immunity or tested vaccines against it yet. Still the death numbers are nowhere near even a weaker influenza as shown by no spikes in mortality rates in most countries. It's important to note the difference between regular flus with the 1.3 and seasonal influenza pandemics with 2 infected per person, latter are the ones that kill hundreds of thousands every year without there being much panic about it, like the 200k more than usual in 16-17.

There have been several medications with limited success that are used to treat other similar diseases, we're just waiting for them to be fully tested to see how much they really help. Some estimate that it doesn't kill you on its own, just destroys your lungs so other viruses and especially bacteria resistant to antibiotics can move in and finish the job. This could explain the high mortality rates in northern Italy for example where antibiotics are used without any care for farm animals and people eat them with their meat.

2 months ago
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"This could explain the high mortality rates in northern Italy for example where antibiotics are used without any care for farm animals and people eat them with their meat."
???

2 months ago
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The conclusions you draw from these links are only conjectures. We aren't even at the end of the crisis and it can already be seen that Italy won't be the most affected country, we only started earlier.

2 months ago
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Where did I draw any conclusions at all? I said that some medical experts estimate that it could be one reason for the high numbers and since you seemed totally oblivious to horrible overuse of antibiotics there I googled some links for you instead of sharing news in Finnish.

Italy also has one of the highest average age in EU as well as a culture of several generations living together to explain the higher numbers since it's still mainly old people who die from it.

2 months ago
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Elderly and people with pre-existing health conditions.

2 months ago
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Yes, the elderly usually have one or more such conditions on top of age. The majority of people dying still seems to be >60yo and kids dying have been very rare exceptions.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8142005/Being-obese-raises-coronavirus-risk-Medics-warn-patients-high-BMI-likely-die.html

UK says 37% of critically ill are <60yo, but what makes that news bit silly other than the media is that a 2/3 majority of the patients there have been overweight while only a small 2/3 minority of the whole population is overweight.

2 months ago*
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Some dutch expert said the same about overweight people. But that you should't crash diet, because that can cause more harm to your immunesystem.

I also heard a lot of the (young) people who end up in hospital smoke. But I can't find if this is true or not.

2 months ago
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No denying Covid-19 is less deadly than SARS, the point being it's far more contagious. A lot of factors contribute to that, not least of which is a high degree of shedding during asymptomatic phases. With SARS, patients were only contagious while showing symptoms, which made it much easier to control and avoid. Agreed, influenza is an extraordinarily lethal and contagious disease - especially when we are inadequately protected from it, as you observed. But that is precisely the point - we are completely unprotected from Covid-19, just as people were unprotected from the Spanish influenza in 1918, and yet, unlike SARS or MERS, it is even more contagious.

Based on calculations, the authors of the larger study estimate the novel coronavirus has an R0 of 2.2, meaning each case patient could infect more than 2 other people. If accurate, this makes the 2019 nCoV more infectious than the 1918 influenza pandemic virus, which had an R0 of 1.80 (interquartile range: 1.47 to 2.27).
http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/01/data-suggest-ncov-more-infectious-1918-flu-what-does-mean

2 months ago
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Some doctors have said that there have been very few of the usual influenza A deaths that happen all the time, almost as if they just got replaced with corona now as shown by very little spikes in deaths vs before in many countries. This can of course change at any point and time will tell.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/09/health/coronavirus-is-very-different-from-the-spanish-flu-of-1918-heres-how.html

Maybe most alarmingly, a majority of those killed by the disease were in the prime of life — often in their 20s, 30s and 40s — rather than older people weakened by other medical conditions.

That's what a really horrible pandemic would require in my opinion, killing lots of kids and people in their prime instead of old sick people who would die from something or the other sooner or not much later.

2 months ago
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Things are looking a little different in NYC since March 9th, and the US is now staring down the barrel of 100k - 200k deaths atm and that's with containment. Younger people are dying - all it takes is something as minor as light asthma to put a person in danger. The virus has already mutated a few times - no one knows where it's heading, but hopefully not in the direction of the second wave of the 1918 pandemic. I find the parallels drawn between the two outbreaks in this article very instructive https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/journal-plague-year-180965222/.

For me all pandemics are horrible and I value the lives of older and infirm people, especially considering that many who have died may have had a good number of years ahead of them if not for this disease. Also to consider are people living in impoverished and war torn countries who live without the safety nets and infrastructure that western countries enjoy. They will get slammed by this - same as in 1918-1919, where death rates were much higher than average in such countries.

Covid-19 has just hit Yemen, Syria and Libya (and is ramping up in other African countries as well) where thousands of people are living in camps with no amenities. Saw this today on France24 - it's terrifying. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INsfxkoa7A4

2 months ago
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There is a significant oversupply of humans already and personally I value nature more than having 100 billion humans living in a barren wasteland. We're not meant to be immortal, death is just other side of the coin of life to being born so one of the most natural things. Sure it sucks to lose loved ones but if you look at humanity as a whole, we will always come out of situations like this stronger.

Meanwhile there have been estimated hundreds of thousands of deaths less in China etc because they can see through the air for a change without having to cut it with a knife. Also the climate change has been slowed down much more than was even previously thought to be possible. Those same poor countries would get hit by it much harder as well killing millions and drowning entire countries under the sea.

Back when there were 500 million people 200 million dying was almost an extinction level crisis. If 200 million would die right now, they would just get replaced with 500 million more in couple years. And we're still only talking about hundreds of thousands, not millions.

2 months ago
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It's still unacceptable to me that people die needlessly in a pandemic that could have been prevented. Everyone values their own life. Every single person. And it seems to me that a pandemic is not a solution to the problems of pollution and overpopulation. Those are problems that can and will be solved by human ingenuity and genuinely progressive ideas. The questions of global supply chains, just-in-time delivery and the vulnerability of nations that no longer produce what they now desperately need is a discussion that is taking place all over the world. I guarantee you, the post pandemic world is going to be a very different place - maybe even a better one.

2 months ago
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What would you say is an acceptable reason to die then? The value of a life isn't defined by asking how much sentimental value the owner gives to it but rather by their actions to improve humanity. There is a never-ending supply of new lives but very little demand outside the insane capitalist idea of infinite exponental economic growth. We're just part of nature, not some holy beings given the right to destroy the Earth by old men living on top of clouds, so the value of a human life is equal to the life of any living being.

This pandemic would have never even started if poor people in overpopulated areas didn't eat raw bats from illegal food markets because they can't afford anything better. Bit oversimplified but that's how most pandemics start and mostly in Africa or Asia in poor overpopulated areas. So they are just nature's way of thinning the herd to keep it healthier and Darwin's way to reward people for stupid behavior.

2 months ago
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Mexico just declared Sanitary Emergency, ALL non essential activities are stopped by a month, got my anxiety at top, many people like me doesn't have a regular income and will hit us very bad, can't stop simply as that, let's see how this ends. I hope is for the best.

2 months ago
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This is my 14th day of lockdown and I must admit that I like that, I don't really enjoy going outside so I'm perfectly fine.

2 months ago
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Yeah. I've got a few days under my belt now. Pretty chill. Plus, we're still encouraged to go outside and walk/walk the dog, for a half hour every day (at the least), but of course to avoid human contact. Which we do several times a day actually (plus I've got a wolf pup, and she gets pissed if she is forced to stay inside all day and night lol)

2 months ago
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Oh, I see, you're from US, in France we are heavily discouraged to go outside but our country is more overpopulated than yours. You can't go outside just to get your morning baguette. I've been outside only once since the first day.

2 months ago*
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Do you have any means of exercising? In NL we are still allowed to go for a walk. For now.

2 months ago
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Because our goverment said we "behaved" last weekend because it was such crap weather noone wanted to go outside, this weekend 20c, lets await the reactions.

2 months ago
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Yeah. You are given an hour once each day in France to do the same though as long as you stay within a kilometer of your home. Exercise outside, but only solo or with your children. You just cant gather, or beyond that, travel without proper papers showing a legit reason ATM. At least, that's how I read France's lock down specifics (some of them anyway).

2 months ago
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1 km? Well that would suck and makes no sense if someone lived in the countryside where you might not see anyone and even if you do you can stay far enough away from those 2 people you do see. Here in the UK they only gave guidelines but said the once a day exercise can be what you'd normally do. They said 'for most people' that would be a 1 hour walk or 30 min run.
I don't consider myself fit but I can easily walk much more than 1km from where I live and back every day.
Edit:
If I had to stay 1km from home that'd mean walking the loop in the village a few times which would mean I would come across 10x as many people so it'd be much riskier.

2 months ago*
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I'm so happy right now that my dad (64, diabetes, hypertension) works at home, it's an unexpectedly welcome result of his diabetic foot (I mean, who would have guessed?).

2 months ago
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so we just hit 42 000 deaths on https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/.
this is gonna be a looooong year.

2 months ago
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Iceland has done the most corona tests per capita in the world and they report 3% of the cases requiring hospital care. That's a long way down from the initial 15% and thus far the mortality has been 0.17% there. Norway has done the second most tests in Europe and their mortality is 0.8%. The more we know the less we need to panic.

2 months ago
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Iceland has, or South Korea has? First time I've heard about Iceland related COVID stuff.

2 months ago
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Iceland has like 300k population so it takes only couple tests to reach top per capita.

2 months ago
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:)

2 months ago
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Hope everyone is dealing with the restrictions and not getting too bored. Here's a simple video to show what good we're doing by staying home.
https://twitter.com/aljwhite/status/1241859943017349126

2 months ago
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Serious question: Why didn't western countries lock down during the SARS outbreak but they are now?

2 months ago
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They were not forced to take action as a very limited number of transmissions occurred in 2002-2004 and even less casualties. Probably that coronavirus was weaker to survive in the wild.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002%E2%80%932004_SARS_outbreak

2 months ago*
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Interesting. I suppose I could have googled this but I appreciate you doing it. I thought SARS was much worse than it was.

2 months ago
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SARS v1 was far more lethal and less contagious so it was easier to contain to Asia. SARS v2 most people don't even get any symptoms from so it spreads far easier before lockdowns and heavy testing.

2 months ago
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https://imgur.com/a/n9vbrY8

Today, the small Republic of Mari El banned the sale of alcohol. The window - 4 hours. 14-00 - 18 00.

Я не выпивающая и мои друзья тоже., но вот сам факт сказать мне НЕТ, когда я хочу ДА.

Today I bought 2 bottles of whiskey. 20 bottles of beer. 10 bottles of vodka. Write me down as an alcoholic, only get rid of tests and viruses (masks), disinfection (I asked for them ?)

1 month ago*
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I don't think many will follow this in non english.

1 month ago
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If you understand what I'm talking about-be a friend and translate it into normal English.

1 month ago
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To me, it reads as follows:

There is only a 4 hour window to buy alcohol, so you went out and stocked up.
I think you asked for disinfectant, but the vodka will work fine for that lol.
Not sure what you mean regarding the masks.

1 month ago
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A Swedish TV and radio celebrity died today. He was 51 years old and had no other complications aside from being a bit overweight and a (possibly former) smoker. We're all a bit shaken up about it.

One of my neighbors also died a week ago, he was however 80 years old and had some other illnesses.

1 month ago
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Remember to never believe any of these lies: https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-and-china-promote-coronavirus-conspiracy-narratives-online-says-eu-agency/

There are already morons burning down 5G masts in Sweden and Finland because of that trolling.

1 month ago
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Best sounding treatment thus far: https://arxiv.org/abs/2003.12444

1 month ago
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huh nice post

3 weeks ago
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Some interesting data I found on Twitter lately. First graph is from this ONS thread, the other compares tests, cases and deaths per capita.

View attached image.
View attached image.
1 month ago
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Honestly, I'm looking through this again and I'm confused to why people are saying it's not a problem and comparing it directly to the flu. The major difference is that global action is being taken. It's the same reason why coconuts killed around the same amount of people each year then sharks. Not because they're more dangerous, but because people are more cautious around sharks, thus leading to less deaths. Of course flu would kill more people every year, most people don't take precautions against the flu more then just the bare minimum for health. People still walk and talk, sneeze next to each other, go to public places, shake hands, etc. Just kinda bugs me since if there was the same amount of precaution to corona as the flu, there would be a lot more deaths.

4 weeks ago*
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Wait, coconuts kill people? And more people than sharks?
That's kinda crazy.

4 weeks ago
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tl:dr unconfirmed, but possible. And yes, they do kill people, but not very much. Sharks kill so little that it barely makes a difference (Only around 4.5 deaths per year in 19 and a half years worldwide. Since coconuts kill people, they could totally beat out sharks at one point)

haha, not exactly. It's very hard to find coconut deaths, they're extremely low and the 150 death number is almost def an exaggeration. That being said, shark deaths the past 2 decades were only around 85 deaths and there was one study with a legitimate 5 coconut related deaths a year, so there was probably a year where coconuts killed more people then sharks, especially when you take into account that there might be a year where a shark only got a single kill (And some of those shark deaths are unconfirmed too, so it's actually less then that.)
However, since most of these injuries and deaths involve coconuts and coconut trees doesn't mean that they were the direct cause, just that they were part of it. Like how vending machines do cause more injuries and maybe deaths then sharks because sharks rarely go after people and people rarely go after sharks or live in water (Funny how that works) while vending machines both everywhere and also aren't directly involved (like someone bending down to get a drink and injuring their spine) Also keep in mind coconut allergies exist and also cause death, although I suppose shark allergies exist too.

That being said, I edited more to around the same, it could be more but I don't want to use potentially incorrect numbers. Thankfully didn't change my point, that would've been sad

4 weeks ago*
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This comment was deleted 4 weeks ago.

4 weeks ago
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Well it was initially like a flu but the difference here is how fast it spreads and how many people it kills in a short period of time. Flu isn't taken seriously by people because there is supossed to be a vaccine for it but each 2 years or so, the flu virus changes some of its proteins and they have to make a new one so it makes sense a lot of people die eevery year because of it.

3 weeks ago
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Well, yeah. I just don't like flu comparisons using infection and deaths when the Flu isn't taken seriously enough for a global lockdown and temporary laws to stop human interactions. I'm not denying the flu is dangerous, just also think this virus is also actually dangerous as opposed to certain beliefs

3 weeks ago
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