+1, also on some games like Skyrim you can have multiple saves, in case you want to redo something.
Edit: also I played Black Mesa on maximum difficulty, some areas are very difficult, and if you die you have to do all other again, but thanks to quick F6 saves you can save every time you success a part of the run.
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+1.
I never met a PC gamer that didn't like "save anywhere". Checkpoint saves are a console system.
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That's the only kind of save that should be allowed in my opinion. I hate when I have to redo an hour worth of game play because I had to quit and couldn't find a save point.
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+100000
I agree. I have terrible luck finding checkpoints.
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Exactly. Sometimes (often) I need to put down the game and go do something more important. I don't have time to look around for a checkpoint or savepoint and there is nothing I hate more than a game wasting my time.
Having to backtrack or lose progress simply because of a crappy save system is inexcusable.
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Look at games you mentioned. Almost all of them are older titles. It means that anytime save is quite uncommon feature nowadays but 10 years ago used to be a standard. Since multiplatform games became so popular we mainly get checkpoints system and most older players don't like it.
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"Look at games you mentioned. Almost all of them are older titles"
But these games have had modern sequels, and I'm not talking about the single games I'm talking about the series in general.
"It means that anytime save is quite uncommon feature nowadays but 10 years ago used to be a standard."
I'm not talking about every game I'm just talking about games that have branching story paths, tons of sidequests, and consequences for your actions.
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Oh wow, you came up with 6 titles in about as many years and you still feel it's a problem? That's just sad.....
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Off the top of my head that had it for sure: Fallout, Fallout 2, Fallout Tactics, Duke Nukem 3D, Blood, Shadow Warrior, Doom, Doom 2, Doom 64, Morrowind, Shadowrun Returns: Dragonfall, Baldur's Gate, Baldur's Gate 2, Planescape Torment, Icewind Dale, Icewind Dale 2, Serious Sam First Encounter, Serious Sam Second Encounter, Legend of Grimrock, Quake, Quake 2, Quake 3, Quake 4, Unreal, Might and Magic X Legacy, Wizardry 8 (probably the whole series), Starcraft, Starcraft 2, Far Cry, Half Life, Half Life 2, Dragon Age Origins, Dragon Age 2, Crysis, Jagged Alliance: Back in Action, XCOM: Enemy Unknown, Command & Conquer, Command & Conquer Red Alert, Command & Conquer Red Alert 2, Command & Conquer Tiberium Wars, Command & Conquer 3, Command & Conquer Generals, Max Payne, Max Payne 2, Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising, ArmA 2, Rune, Aliens vs. Predator, Aliens vs. Predator 2, Counter-Strike: Condition Zero Deleted Scenes, Gothic 2, Gothic 3, Company of Heroes, Delta Force 2.
Not including games where you can save anywhere but it takes you back to some sort of hub.
Basically every RTS and Western RPG I've ever played and most PC FPS have save anywhere.
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So you've brought the tally up to about 70 titles in 20 years and think you're proving a point? All you've done is strengthened my position because that's a pathetically small amount VS all the games released during that period.
And yes I know there are still (even in the 6 year list originally mentioned) more but not enough to make the odds change a significant amount.
And save anytime anywhere specifically means that you resume at that exact spot, not 5m away, and certainly not at some sort of hub which usually means repeating a stage so you would have been daft to mention those.
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That's just off the top of my head and games that I've played and for sure remember them having save anywhere (a lot of them I can't remember for sure). As I said, most western RPGs, RTS, and PC FPS have save anywhere, even today. Though FPS is starting to use checkpoints more often, RTS and RPGs still maintain the save anywhere function on the whole. Old school FPS on PC was basically nothing but save anywhere.
And as I said, I didn't mention any where it takes you back to a hub.
And if you think I'm making a point against save anywhere, I'm not. I prefer that system, but I'm simply pointing out that it is a huge percentage of games that use the function and dismissing it because he only listed 6 (or mine because I didn't start googling lists of games to argue with you) is silly. If you are only a console gamer, I can understand you having that perception because save anywhere was (and to an extent still is) a largely PC-only feature.
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I'm a PC gamer and ever since console ports became the norm games which allow you to save anywhere anytime have almost entirely vanished. And it doesn't matter that you never mentioned all titles (and I'm aware of a whole bunch you didn't) that use the function because you extended the range all the way to 20 years and beyond to try and prove your point also introducing thousands of titles which relied on checkpoints so it's still far from a huge percentage.
I will give you that pretty much all RTS games do though, but checkpoints would be ludicrous there because there is nothing you could hang them on and you might be losing an entire day worth of progress if you didn't build this or that which. I'd never play another RTS again if they used checkpoint auto-saves because my time would be spent more constructively trying to juggle a tractor given how much gameplay I'd keep losing.
And I'll give you CRPGs as well but they had to because you could spend decades exploring and never doing anything of note in them and thus not being anywhere near a save spot, they'd need about 2 billion checkpoints to try and give you a reasonable chance of only losing 10-20 minutes of progress thanks to a checkpoint.
So yeah, their saves can be exploited, but it's up to the player to do so. These games always harp on about their decisions and consequences so they'd much rather you face the music after choosing to be a jerk but that too is one of their choices.
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It goes that far back because I replayed older games a lot more (because they were all I had) and they're more cemented in my memory. Recent games I tend to play through once and I have no real recollection of their mechanics. Like I played Crysis 3 somewhat recently and I can't remember at all how the save system works. Or Portal, which I kind of thought did but I really can't remember. Hell, I played through each Mass Effect game at least twice each and I can't even remember if it uses checkpoints or save states. There's dozens and dozens of recent games I've played that I just don't remember for sure so I avoided listing them.
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Because they all use checkpoint auto-saves :P...you can't really remember something that's not there.
(well not quite as far as your list goes since Portal and at least the first Mass Effect actually used almost anywhere almost anytime saves (certain stages have restricted saving)).
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I like autosaving, but I also like having a separate no-auto-save file, just in case.
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Though i sometimes feel really nostalgic about games, checkpoint saves are are somehow lame.
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^This!
I have 4 kids, a spouse, a job, real-life friends... and can't always play an extra 30 minutes to the next save point.
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What you said was for Fallout i guess XD Well about the path you choose, i think saving anywhere we want is actually a good thing, it allows you to see what would happen if you do things differently. It also allows you to go crazy and do shit that might get you killed just for the fun of it ! In other words, no fucking up your progress XD But then this kind of system fits some games, and it doesn't for some others. For example, in a game like Duke 3D, i think that this system is perfect. You can save before you've ended a level in case you missed a secret instead of doing the whole thing again ! Or before a dangerous room, a boss even. In a game like Resident Evil though, well that's different ^^ Save points are really for this game instead of saving anywhere, because it can be tough to reach them, it reaches the difficulty of the game :) But that also implies pissing you off, as you might die when going to a save point and you didn't save since the last hour XD
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No, I HATE checkpoint saves. Case in point: Halo and Halo 2 on Legendary. Having to redo the same section over and over due to one mistake, being flimsy as hell, or in Halo 2's case, getting insta-killed in the foot by a Jackal sniper. Once I get through half a section, I should be able to save and not have to do it again because I failed later.
Saving anywhere, anytime is the only way to go.
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One time during an auto-save before the last boss fight in arkham city. The electricity went out and my save files became corrupted. So i had to start over the whole game. And it wasn't just a few hours because i almost had all the collectibles.
On the other part... i played dragon age origins a few years ago. I wanted to play it on my native language. The subtitles were usually incorrectly translated and when i thought i'm going to talk with someone i just sliced him up. Also there are path of dialogues like accepting a quest that doesn't allow you to talk to the quest giver again but you could and wanted to ask specific details.
Because of these i don't really like autosave. Autosave is for rogue-like games imo.
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One game that did it fairly well was Hitman 2 (not sure if the others had this too) on easy you can 7 saves, usable at any point but once you're out, you can't save anymore. Normal is 3, hard is 1 and think expert is 0 (though can be awarded a save in some spots rarely on missions)
While you can reload old ones to gain back your saves, even on normal you had to ration them.
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You can switch on Ironman mode.
That gives you exactly one save for the entire playthrough, and the only way of saving is leaving the game.
To further combat save scumming, the state of the randomizer is included in the save game. So no matter how often you reload, if you do the same thing you get the same outcome. (That is standard in all Firaxis games since around Civ 3 though).
It's also something more games should include ;)
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Ironman mode was beatable by actual save scumming, as in people would get out of the game and let it save after every move they were happy with, backup the save, go back into the game and rinse and repeat till they beat the game. I don't know how anyone can finish that game like that and not go insane or kill themselves, but I know one streamer on twitch did it.
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Urgh that would take a decade to get through!
You can do the same with FTL as well though (backing up your savegame that's created when you quit).
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I prefer the save style to be like this, because it allows choice.
For one player that doesn't like consequences, they can just save and reload over and over.
Personally, I like occasionally screwing something up, so I just don't do the save and reload.
With the save system as it is, it allows for both players to play how they like. Also, it's nice to be able to save whenever in case something IRL comes up. One of my favorite things about Savestates with my emulators.
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Oh hey, I worked for a long while, then screw up or die, now I gotta spend another half an hour just to get back to the same spot. Yeah, totally much better than saving anywhere anytime, right?
OP, I disagree. Sorry.
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It's cheap, it's usually found in games that have consequences for your actions and/or branching paths.
"Oh man I had to kill that guy while I was doing a no kill run. Oh well good thing I saved three seconds ago"
or
"Man, I didn't want that to happen. )-: Good thing I saved before I progressed the quest!"
I know it's up to the players on how they decide to use/abuse the save system, and then there's the whole "this playstyle isn't any less right or wrong than yours" debate. I could keep going on how it devalues the purpose of having consequences and branching paths but then again that falls under the "my playstyle is as valid as yours" thing.
So what's your opinion about it?
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