In my opinion, it was a mistake developing Spacebase past Amnesia Fortnight. It just didn't seem like a Double Fine game and I thought it was quite generic (mind you, I've only played the prototype). I think Double Fine's been biting off more than they can chew as of recent, with Broken Age, Costume Quest 2, Grim Fandango Remake (?) and Psychonauts 2 (one can hope) on their plate, it's no wonder they decided to finish off the more 'boring' game in favour of saving funding and manpower for their other games.
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tell that to people that paid 25$ for what you call "quite generic" and not worth continuing. I did not but nonetheless it was a dickish move. As I mentioned before - if they were to be straight forward that they will not develop all, but will enable modding people would be modding it for months now. In current situation - any useful and seriously developed mods can come when the game will be totally dead.
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Kerbal Space Program is the only EA game I've bought, and one of the very few I've considered. Its a fully functional game, so if they abandoned it tomorrow, I'd still be fine with it. Its already got a bunch of amazing user mods. Although, achievements wouldn't hurt.
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Aye, you're correct. I can see how EA might cause confusion in general use, but I figured since this discussion was about Early Access and not Electronic Arts, people could figure it out. :)
But seriously, I'm gonna use this opportunity to pimp Kerbal Space Program again. Its so much fun with physics that even NASA approves.
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The devs are planning to release the code to allow the community to take over so that's something I guess.
I suppose they will only release the code though, not the assets. So the community can't do anything with it other than make engine changes and such. And that means you will still need to buy the game from DoubleFine in order to get the assets.
If that is true, then the game is truly dead. You can't do anything without having the assets.
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What other EA or indie games have developers abandoned? I think the other one was Towns or something.
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Starbound isn't abandoned. It just feel like it because no patch for a long time if you didn't opt in for nightly build in the beta tab. They always post updates on their site and have updates to the nightly build (the "deepest beta"). The unstable build don't have updates for a while too.
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Towns got semi-abandoned when it released on Steam. It was in a similar state as DF-9. They released and said, we're done. And a lot of promised stuff didn't get in the final game neither update. After community bash, they hired 1 guy to work on it, then the guy bailed at that Towns 2 thread. Then they said would do some update and all they did was some bug fixes and a tutorial, not what community expected.
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Monsters and munitions, no update since January I think.
Actually, from what I can see on the News/Announcements tabs, it looks like this game only ever received one update.
Smashmuck Champions - also abandoned, apparently
Steel Storm A.M.M.O. - No update since october 13, devs mention on the forum that they might resume work on the game within 6-12 months.
There's probably many more but I don't have the patience to dig further at this point.
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I was thinking for a while that Double Fine bit off more than they can chew. Hack 'N' Slash, Massive Chalice, Costume Quest 2, Grim Fandango remake, helping with another indie projects like Last Life - and all that while leaving Broken World unfinished. They were dizzy with success, it seemed that they're one of the greatest indie developers... but to be honest, their projects weren't THAT great. Ok, we have Lucas Arts ancestry, that's classic. Psychonauts is a masterpiece, ok. Then we have Brutal Legend - a game that does not quite live up to its potential. Next are Costume Quest, Stacking and Iron Brigade - just good games, but neither is a masterpiece. So how did Double Fine get that perfect reputation? Using great PR skills of Tim Shafer.
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I know something was fishy since they put the game on sale multiple times before. Oh well.
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Guys, stop buying Early Access. How many times does this need to happen before it sinks in? If a dev doesn't have the funds to make their "dream game", then they should make what they can or seek out a publisher.
Early Access doesn't work in theory because 80% of the money the game will ever make will come in during the first 3 months. After that, it slows to a trickle. Why keep working on a game that no one is buying unless you put it to 75% off? It's a nice idea with horrible flaws and the bad outweighs the good.
Also, don't forget: "You should be aware that some teams will be unable to 'finish' their game. So you should only buy an Early Access game if you are excited about playing it in its current state." - Steam Early Access FAQ.
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As customers we are voting with our wallet and if some of us want to support an idea of a game we gonna support it,risk some cash and face the consequences. Sadly EA is often being abused now by devs who are in it for the money not for the game.
EA is working for devs who are dedicated to their games. Yes,often saled copies might be low and game may need to be on sale 25-50% off but sometimes the sale is not for extra cash but to reveal itself to customers who didnt even know about the game(publicity).
3.What are the horrible flaws? The fact that customer spent money on a EA game without knowing the risk? Or the dev/publisher risk their reputation with abandoning the software they are working on? Apart from this 2 I can't think of any other so if possible tell me about the other flaws.Will be grateful.
On personal note about Steam EA FAQ and some of my EA purchases:
I completly understand the risk and I take it if I find it worthy.
So far I bought only 3 EA games: Akaneiro:Demon Hunters(got my money worth it but game is abandoned atm), Starpoint Gemini 2(waiting for dev to add the story) and World of Diving(money worth it if you want to relax) . I think I learnt from observing EA scene and games released on them: If a game is a first project of a studio and promised features are ambitious or should I say.... way too ambitious then you better avoid buying it unless you really,really,REALLY want it.
Now I'm not big fan of DF games but tried some of them and prolly play them when feels like but this move prolly will put quite a lot of black spots on their name. It seems they simply just went too ambitious with Spacebase DF-9. If we are optimistic that wont repeat.If we are realist : "God help DF."
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I don't think steam is a good platform for early access games. In contrast it is like buying a non finished piece of furniture at IKEA where the maker promises it will ship you the rest of the parts once they're done. Ok, a little silly example but its accurate.
When the early access games stop selling even after a few -75% off discounts, it is likely the devs will just stop developing it and say its done (basically lie). They are working under the profit motive after all. They earned their money with a non finished product and it is likely they won't earn anymore since all that happens once you "release" the game on steam, that blue early access banner will disappear. The customer gets fucked in the end. Paying customers voted with their wallets in hopes of seeing a finished product.
All early access should provide is: EARLY ACCESS TO THE GAME. Not a way of funding the game development in hopes the devs actually complete its development cycle. The dev should already have the funds to complete it. If their business plan consists of "yeah we'll fund the rest of it through early access, even though we dont know how much we'll get", it is flawed.
If you need money, ask for it on kickstarter, indiegogo, your own website. Offer supporters the full game once its out. Dont sell unfinished games in hopes of funding them on the end market where millions of people buy and expect completed games.
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Agree that steam isnt a good platform for EA games because of the lack of quality control and filters.
As said different devs are coming with different motives but we mainly see the one looking for the profit and they are the one who will stop developing if they start losing money or simply dont get enough sales. While there are also developers who are there for the game itself and if they dont get enough sell they will just develop the game in slower pace. Also are you sure that once(if) they manage to finish and release their game nobody is gonna buy it because the one who want it bought already it during EA? Don't forget about customers who don't feel like risking their money on EA and simply follow the game to see is there any date for release.
Sadly time changes and Early Access(alpha) isnt what it was before. Early access works like kickstarter but instead of giving money and wait for a miracle you get the chance to also play the game while being developed with the flaw that you have no idea how much cash is funded and because of that you take a risk. DF proved that even a successful kickstarter doesn't promise a 100% finished product.
EA is a place where a customer may find some specific product he was always looking for (example: I am waiting at the moment for Dragon to appear) . AAA companies are sticking to their own tested and working tittles and most of them don't seem to try to achiev and conquer new grounds.
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I suppose this major hit to the reputation of DF is the price they should have been ready to pay when they started a shitload of projects (while being a not so large indie developer) and then failed managing all this shit at the same time.
Cookie-cutter small games like Costume Quest, Stacking and so on is a risky way to dispense resources on, they might be a hit, and then they might not.
IMO, they should have been concentrated on heavier stuff like Broken Age, that would bring them moneys simply by being good. Yes, it's usually that simple.
Seems like they have no real choise now but to drop Spacebase. Well, if that's the case - they have poor management, if that's not - then they are assholes.
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The core is ok, need bug and ai fixes and could use some more features to polish it other than that objective thing and tutorial (for new players could be helpful), but it's not bad I enjoy what we have in game so far.
What bothers me is the lack of transparency and communication. It's a 3-4 guys team. I'm not a Notch fanboy, but even Notch when working alone would keep communication, transparency and interact with community often(leave alone updates every week) at that time.
Sure they read forums, would reply to some bugs or other posts eventually, but didn't have much interaction with community. Plus, 1 month ago when JB made that post saying they're not a "fly-by-night" developer they knew they would be cutting the game off soon. He talked like it was all fine, like things would be good and addressed the complains about communication, but kept doing the same thing.
When the 0.6 update came out, he made a video talking like it was all ok and addressed once again communication issue, nothing changed. People had hope and expected more thinking they were working on the game and something good was on the horizon.
In the end we will have a core game that could use a bit more work and not much extra content after 1.0. It wil get somewhat boring if ppl don't work on mods.
If only they had released LUA code before so ppl could be working on mods or even fixing the things they were taking time to fix, the interest in the game could have raised or kept higher, who knows.
Now to hope they get the bugs fixed and maybe add Steam Workshop support to make it easier to submit and download the mods, and that ppl actually want to do cool mods, otherwise it will get boring soon.
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well.....early access is not a good idea most of the times.
i even would say preorder or buying on release is a bad idea with many games released half-done and full of bugs.
i recommend waiting 2 weeks after release to check the first reviews - helps to avoid crap ;)
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This is the perfect exemple of why i think alpha release should not be allowed to be sold. Well, not that i care much, people do what they want with their money, but still, where in the world you are allowed to sell something, promising it will be one day much better, and then, finally dropping your promise. Legally, i'm pretty sure there could be something done, you can't just take people money based on promise and runoff with something half done.
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Typical lazy money-grabbing indie dev early access alpha jew bullshit. Not giving any more of my money to these crooks.
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Jew bullshit? What the fuck is wrong with you? What are you even talking about?
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I read that as Alpha Jew, which goes around from being horribly racist to being awesome again. Alpha Jew! Just let it roll off your tongue. Behold the Alpha Jew!
Alpha Jew! Save us from these Early Access shenanigans! Teach these Double Fine mashuganas how to develop a game!
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So they are basically cancelling the game but they do so in a way that it's called a "release" so they don't have to refund anyone :D
Not even mad xD
What other games you guys think could've been "released" instead of being canned? Things that come to my mind are Battlefront3 and Starcraft:Ghost :P
But again, you can't do this kind of trick without Early Access/Kickstarter ;)
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So, they had a kickstarter for Broken Age. They ran out of money for that and had to resort to a humble bundle. They still didn't have enough, so they did Early Access. This was for one of their flagship projects. What's the word on Massive Chalice? How were they also doing Hack n Slash, Costume Quest 2, and Grim Fandango HD at the same time as well?
Doublefine is not only a game developer, it's a business. And it looks from the outside that Schafer & Co. don't know how to run a business effectively. Spreading projects far and wide, relying excessively on consumer funding... It'd have been fine if they dropped DF-9 if it hadn't already received money from consumers. As it stands though, it looks like they're burning whatever goodwill they have left. I won't be surprised if they get bought out soon.
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edit: Towns 2.0, amirite?
oh wow, it was considered an alpha... alpha to final release, that's always a winning strategy /sarcasm
according to the things I've read (i haven't checked the store page for awhile before this happened so I can't confirm), if they really did list a ton of possible new features and then didn't add any of them, I think that's at the least, misleading to potential EA buyers, I mean I understand if there are like 2-3 features that are listed as possible features, but when you have a game that is barebones and you list a lot of features as possible, there is sort of a (justified) expectation that at least some of those will be implemented...if that makes sense :p
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This is a really scummy move. I had a certain amount of respect for Double Fine, but everything they seem to be doing recently has been greed oriented. How long is it going to be before they have their greedy fucking paws out again in another Kickstarter? It's so tiring when a dev you had respect for turns out to be just as bad as the rest.
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Wait.... was this a kickstarter? Not like I told you so....
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First they don't respond at all, and when they finally do, instead of owning up to it and making amends, they try to deny what happened and bury the story by deleting their previous communications. What's next?
These guys are looking more and more dishonest at every turn, wtf happened to you DoubleFine?!
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Haven't checked this thread since that post till now.
Reading through DF forums, that thread someone told me was missing (which I tried to access and it was asking for login, but even ppl logged couldn't access it) was apparently merged with other threads. Their mods keep popping in and merging and separating threads saying some discussions don't belong here or there, messing up the threads and posts, making everyone confused.
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I'll wait for costume quest 2 to get bundled. I didn't care for this crap anyway so it's no loss to me. B)
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Link
Link to the forum shitstorm
Another one bites the dust, I really didn't expect that from DoubleFine. From what I understand the game was still officially in alpha and there was a whole bunch of planned features. I wonder in what state is the current build?
The devs are planning to release the code to allow the community to take over so that's something I guess. Still a major dick move to all those who supported them...
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