How much CV should they get?
It's odd how you are so concerned about Chrono.gg, which grants about one game every two months with these free coins, while you don't mind spamming giveaways with the free games you got from Lootboy, in far greater frequency?
So imho blacklist those abusing the system with multiple copies but the rest is quite okay the way it is.
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They try to ban them. But they are so unsuccessful they had had to abandon their Streamcoins multiple times, simply because they failed to handle the bots.
And you can work for those diamonds but you don't have to. All I do is use the codes I occasionally see here and that's enough for one free game about every two weeks.
So sorry, I disagree. There are masses of bots, it's free, it gives far more games and those potentially can be unbundled games just like with Chrono.gg. It makes absolutely no sense to be "alarmed" about one platform and to ignore the other. The only difference is that we can pretty much identify games being given away from Chrono.
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https://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/dPcHZ/edna-harvey-the-breakout-anniversary-edition
https://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/qLDGq/chaze-alpha
Both of these are unbundled and I got them from lootboy.
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they have some unbundled ones like Knightin'+ (sold out now), someone with 5 accounts get 5 copies and voila $30 of unbundled CV and the effort you need for that one is lower than lootboy.
That's the side problem, unbundled games from Chrono.gg don't last too much because those with 10 or more accounts get multiple copies. If they were treated as bundled or 0 CV, more legit users could have a chance to get those games.
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sadly even if you put it 0CV, we still have the issue of key resellers and whatsnot.
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I fully agree, that users making GAs of games gained in illegitimate ways (which INCLUDES getting multiple copies of games using multiple accounts on sites, that prohibit this) should be banned from SG. This would, however, need to include a rule, that a user can't make GAs for multiple copies of games gained from trades (otherwise, using multi accounts on trade sites, user could always show a proof of "legitimately" acquiring the games).
If it's done, then I would vote for marking those games as "bundled". With current state of affairs, they should clearly (indeed, including Lootboy loots) be marked as "no CV".
I believe, that you've missed a word here.
"you don't mind spamming giveaways" gives quite a different impression than "you don't mind people spamming giveaways", which I think, is what you've wanted to say ;)
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Bundling them should be enough. Striker's Edge is not even bundled currently, but it should be. They have given games like Dead Cells away in the past, but I never had enough coins. People will always find ways to abuse the system.
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idk it seems like a lot of work for little reward. one click a day is easy enough, but the free games you get aren't worth much cv. you can get more from $1 bundles and skip all the clicking.
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i guess man. it just blows my mind that someone would do all that for some free bundled games and a little bit of cv, for what? so they can enter in more giveaways they have a minuscule chance of winning? idk, i don't understand it. just buy a $1 bundle and give that away.
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Knightin+ from 2 weeks ago and Striker's Edge from two days ago are currently full CV. That's why they sold out so quickly.
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well in those cases, they should absolutely be brought to a bundled status. i don't think anyone can argue against that.
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But... I had one level!!!!!!!!
Yeah, that's a good point. I guess it's not an easy decision to remove volunteer staff from their positions though, unless they've gone completely inactive or volunteer for removal.
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I thought stuff like this was added to the bundled list eventually by support? And retroactively from when the external site giveaways/mass key drops went live?
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If you're a normal user and don't use bots, the keys from chrono.gg are quite limited and if you choose to claim them to gift, it's still points that you could have used for yourself, waiting for a game that you would have prefered ? But instead you chose to use them to gift ?
But it's just a random thought in the end, because anyway, i don't really care if you set them to full value or bundled or zero. Or even if you remove the full steamgifts CV system in fact (with all bots tracked down and fired of course !) That way everyone would give just for fun, there would be no more punishment if the key doesn't work and everyone would have an equal chance to win ! It might be healthier ! :D
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People complain about bots farming multiple copies for CV if it's bundled or full CV.
People complain they get no CV for giving them away if it's 0 CV.
Since people will complain either way, I vote for 0 CV. This may at least cut down on some of the bots farming the keys and give users who actually want the game a better chance at getting a copy.
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not everyone can afford to spend real money on giveaways. instead, people spend their time on all these multi-accounts. although they could not give out anything at all, which many are successfully doing.
btw, it’s funny that many are still worried about the distribution of others on this site ; )
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They don't spend time, their bots do the work.
I don't want to calculate how much money i gave here away in the form of the bought Games.
And i don't find it funny to see that Multiaccounters with Bot armies are level 5 for free or nearly free.
One of the reasons why i, nearly, don't do public GA's anymore.
I don't think that all this "fun" is healthy for this site...
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well, then they spent time creating these bots... a person will always find a loophole. for example, half of the high levels received them thanks to free keys from developers. let's all get depressed together about this. or maybe you should stop doing bullshit and start enjoying this place ; )
and of course there is nothing funny in spending your time looking for negativity. especially in a place that is designed to get positive emotions.
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seems like everybody just missing this fact. Lots of high levels didn't spent a cent to gain 20000$+ worth on their accounts and people complaining about 10-50 cv gain
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and how does one contradict the other? if there is an opportunity to protect yourself and your gifts from all kinds of fools, why not use it. but, as you can see from your example, even this does not always help.
and if, besides the arguments "you yourself are such", there is nothing more to say, I propose to end this emm discussion...
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If it was possible, I would say "full CV for the first giveaway, and zero CV for any subsequent giveaways."
But I don't think that's technically possible... and in that case, I definitely think Chrono coin shop games should be considered "free" and should give no CV. After all, no actual money was spent to get them.
Great topic! I never really considered that some people might have 10+ Chrono accounts. I guess it shouldn't be surprising. People will do just about anything for free stuff.
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I check from time to time the games that give full cv and are around at different (free) sites.
And all that give 5+ copies at that day(s) get a BL.
In the end far from enough because one BL more or less reduce their ability to enter GA's only a bit... but better as nothing.
And i look into my BL when someone want to enter my group, discord and places i work for.....
So it have maybe a bit more impact as such guys think -but still not enough-.
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reduced CV at minimum. I see 0 cv to be a bit much, maybe? It seems like swatting a fly with a sledgehammer--overkill.
1st try reducng the CV, if the same people still flood this place with them, consider lowering it to 0. But try the intermediate step first. Those who want to spend all their coins on this--but don't use bots to acquire said coins--can waste their coins on reduced CV if they care, but I can think of much better uses.
Now, I don't use the site, so idk what chrono sells for coins. A user of that site might tell me if they ever have "better" games than these available for coin-purchase.
This convo reminded me of my bigger HB Monthly gripe... if we aren't allowed to buy from certain 3rd-party sites, and if HB's price (price per game/price of bundle or w/e the formula) is such that the game--if acquired from the HB monthly--wouldn't be bundled, leave them unbundled for the first copy given per person. Subsequent copies by that person should be bundled to prevent cv-farming, as HB themselves only allow one account per person and other legit sites (BundleStars, Wingamestore, GMG, etc) might start getting keys from the devs for bundles once HB has featured it in a monthly.
This would catch those trying to game the system by purchasing from grey-market sites, while rewarding (or at least not punishing) those who did it right and avoided those sites.
After all, besides the inherent risk of those sites, why not reward/incentive-via-no-punishment those who do it right?
TempeteJoachim (Super-mod, Rank #2 on the site) said when the reduced-cv-for-monthlies went in that (paraphrased) "this would be done on a case by case [game-by-game] basis". What we see today seems far more like "oh, it was in a monthly? automatically assign it reduced CV!!!!"
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A lot of people didn't like that it was decided on a case-by-case basis for HB Monthly games, so we quickly switched to bundling them entirely (which was a lot easier tor us anyway)
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Thank you very much for your reply--I appreciate it. The information contained therein was news to me, as I had not previously seen it anywhere that I recall.
In my mind, it is a shame that the switch was made from case-by-case to bulk, but I can see that it would be easier for support. (Back then, I was never upset if a game or eight lost CV, I was glad that there was a chance of a few the games retaining full CV!)
Please note that my previous comment above (#DiayJAV) was not a criticism of you, or any particular support person, but had largely been expressing unhappiness with the distance between what had last been communicated (that I knew of) and what was the current practice, coupled with regret that the-sites-which-shall-not-be-named had to be factored in to the decision at all.
I do not prefer the outcome, but the rules are the rules and knowing that behind the scenes the (publicly-seen) actions weren't being inconsistent with the official decision (as I had previously thought) makes me much happier with the situation than I had been. 😎
I shall try my best to shut up about the matter, unless feedback is requested in the future for site updates/improvements etc. I don't 100% promise anything, but I will try.
Thank you again very much for straightening me out and I hope that you--and all the rest of support--have a very good day and week!
Finally, I do wish to say that I do appreciate the work that Support does here! It is a largely thankless job, but you all do it anyway. Having looked at sites without moderation or other staff, I appreciate the fact that this site has them!
PS: IF none of a monthly ever showed up on a grey-market site would it still be bundled?
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Hello, see this situation a little bit different. To collect so many coins need a lot of time. And reduce the CV to 0 would not make any sence. As a rule any job cost your time. This people pay with the time for the games too. It's not just a simple gleam or humble giveaway that anyone can participate in a few seconds. I think the CV can't be steel the full too, but it's still not on the bundle games price. So probably it should be one more level between the full price games and those from the chrono and Alienware with highher level giveaway.
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Technically speaking, the game developers are most suited to decide this. Consider this, if a game given away on Chrono.gg are considered of no value then it will significantly reduce developer's chances of having a future sale because even after the keys given on Chrono.gg are exhausted and nobody will purchase their games to make a giveaway or otherwise because it is of no value. As for me, I am guilty of giving away the key from chrono.gg but it is from the chrono coins collected by another member of my family. If you consider this cheating then it is much lesser offense than earning from illegal means (including offenses like theft and murder) and using the money earned to buy a Playstation or XBOX (You would be surprised if you knew how many of PlayStation or XBOX owners are like that). So go on booing me or blacklisting me. I have no complaints. Have a good day.
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I don't understand why this has gone ignored for the longest time. If games that have appeared in Alienware giveaways (which have required a lot of grinding & far more than Chrono frankly) have counted as no CV then so should all of these. The lack of consistency makes one scratch their head. At the very least they should be reduced CV, if not zero CV.
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This exactly! If Alienware, which is more than just 1 simple click a day is considered 0CV then Chrono should be as well!
It's 1 click a day, done in seconds, that doesn't really count as doing something for it and the games are all free, so yes 0CV for sure.
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i think in principle the way they're getting the games is nothing of your business and the cv shouldn't be affected. if i'm a billionaire i can afford to throw AAA games to give away like it's nothing. should those games have lowered cv value ? if i'm in some job that gives me reduced prices for games or free games, should those games have lowered cv value ?
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You are able to BLACKLIST users that have multiaccounts.
I do that AND i name that ones to friends or at different places.
All above 1 copy of that sources should be calculated as 0 CV
And as a sidenote...
Steamgifts should PERMA BAN/SUSPEND such users.
Because Multiaccount users are a big problem and should be treated as the scum they are !
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If SG would suspend for having multiple accounts on chrono, then they could do that for being rude on facebook or not activating games won on r/giftofgames. (This is absurd just days after SG cut ties to Steamtrades because "it's a different site")
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There's nothing in Steamgifts rules about having multiple accounts on other sites, nor should there be.
You set the CV for those giveaways to 0, removing the incentive to farm them for giveaways, and the problem goes away.
I see NoSenses said the same thing below, but it bears repeating.
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Did they set it to 0 cv in the last year(s) ? No
That's why the OP made this discussion, to propose possibilities. It's in the title. Regardless, there's a far better chance of SG setting those giveaways to 0 CV than there is for them banning multi-account users on another site. That's simply ridiculous.
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I don't think it's absurd because it is very clear to see that different users use multiaccounts at, as example, chrono AND it is very clear that they exploit here the cv system with that GA's (prefered for full CV games...). The latter is the important part at it and it is because of that connected with this site!.
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I don't think it would be "more work" because that users aren't soooo much (i would bet under 100) and fast dealed with.
Because the "general solution" need work too. They must check the games and put them on a list.
I don't expect that something happens. Not the one, not the other.
The support members aren't enough and aren't motivated enough. That's a clear fact.
And it looks as cg don't want to change it because new staff members or a "we search for helpers thread" don't appear.
All that isn't first in this situation since a few months and that is the reason why i am not interested at the new rules discussions. In the end the same staff members should enforce them and that is sad and laughable at the same time.
Don't get my words wrong, i like most of the staff members and a big part are at my Whitelist but they aren't very active (i surely give reasons for it, that is no question and not our thing) and i know that different ones aren't motivated. I would name it as burned out.
But a change is nowhere in sight.
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Some on, look at the archive for the last chrono games that sold out in a few hours and you will see absolute clearly which ones use multiaccounts, without a doubt (only when you close both eyes you can't see it). I don't speak from people that give 2 copies away or maybe stretch it over months. That specific day, 10 copies, maybe more as one of that special days, each time a other game that is up at chrono and it is absolute clear.
It is very unlikely that you will buy that 10 copies of that games at exactly the same day as it appears, in this case, at chrono.
If you bought it, you can proof it with a screenshot and it will be solved.
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Thats no question but first of all, how many users give away 5-22 copies of a game that is EXACTLY at that day for free or "nearly free" at a site that needs for each copy a new account ?
I don't think you will find much of them.
Second the chances for a false positive encounter are in this cases nearly zero (i would say zero) and as i said it, the ammount of that users aren't big.
I see always the same names that give "free" stuff, in such ammounts, away that you only get, at that day, with many accounts.
So i would bet there are under 100 accounts to handle with.
That would be less work, fast done. And if there are really one false positive then this one can proof the purchase for sure.
I know, as example, 2 (german) guys that grab at each of such sites (Kinguin, Indiegala, HB and and and...) 20+ copies of free games with a lot of accounts and the help of scripts and bots.
They don't do it 1x, they do it since over 1 year (for sure much longer but i don't know them longer)
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Considering you get daily coins for free and there are several members with ten or more chrono.gg accounts to exploit the CV system.
Update: a Super Mod has confirmed this games should be considered bundled. Most users have voted for that option in the poll so I think this is the best solution.
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