It will generally either be due to a price change on steam for one of the games that you gave (which apply retroactively because of the way the system is set up) or due to one of the games being classed as a bundle game for the period in which you created the giveaway.
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That's true, if you gave a game away before it was in a bundle, you do get to keep the CV from that game.
The thing with Darksiders is that it should have been considered a bundle game due to Humble THQ but it wasn't marked as such. If they're fixing it now because of its re-release in another bundle, they probably decided to mark it back to when it was first bundled, during Humble THQ.
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I heard theory that they left it out to try and minimize the aaa games they had to nerf(justified by fused bundle codes)
so given that I guess if its bundled now with separate keys(so they HAVE to mark it this time) they may as well fix the thq list too since it technically should have been back then anyway, and if its going to be from now on anyway...
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the bundle mark is backdated to when the bundle started
(so if you gave it before it was in the bundle(not before it was marked, cause sometimes they don't get marked right away) then its full value. so a game could be gifted without an asterisk and have the asterisk retroactively added. but only if a bundle containing it started before you gifted it)
(also i think i heard that even week 2 bonuses that didn't show when it started are treated as bundled from the beginning of the bundle for some reason but not 100% on that. (think I remember people saying that about skybuccaneers)
so maybe it was added to the bundle after you gifted it but the bundle started before?)
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They could, if the bundle date they were applying to was the Humble THQ Bundle. For some strange reason, I believe Darksiders wasn't marked as a bundle game despite being in the HB, so they're well within their rights to apply that retroactively, to the date of when the Humble THQ Bundle came out.
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This happened to me too, and I sent a support ticket about it. Darksiders is the problem. For some reason my Red Faction Armageddon giveaway isn't considered bundled, even though it's appeared in the exact same bundles. I'm led to believe that this is a mistake, but I hope they don't take my Armageddon from me too. Those were the only two non-bundled games I have, and if they're taken away I'll be back at 30 again. =\
I did send them screenshots of the key and me giving away the key, so hopefully that fix the issue.
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RF isn't considered bundled because it wasn't in a bundle until today, I believe, so they won't be taking that from you. Darksiders should have been considered a bundle game once Humble THQ hit so there really shouldn't be any complaints about the matter if they decided to finally retroactively make that a bundle game.
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Actually, Darksiders, Company of Heroes, the 2 COH expansions, Red Faction Armageddon and Metro 2033 all came on the same key. Considering this, the only way to give away only one of these games was with a legitimate key or a tradeable copy. Because of this, they weren't considered bundle games and rightfully so.
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The main argument against this is that for previous Humble Bundles, games were also given on the same key, but each individual game was still marked on the bundle list.
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That's a crap system though. You got the points when you gave the games away, how can they take points off you in hindsight when the game's value changes weeks or months later? It was worth what points you got at the time.
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Because it's too difficult to implement. Keep in mind that this entire site is designed by a single person in his free time.
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Not that hard. One extra column in the database indicating the point value at the time the giveaway was created. I'm not sure how much extra disk space this would eat up though. There are probably legitimate reasons for not implementing this
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A) CG is volunteering to do this in his free time
B) He is paying money out of pocket to run this site, so saving space saves money (I doubt the ads are covering the bandwidth required)
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Easier. Contrib is tied to the user, not the game. Contrib acquired stays as it is. No retroactive changes. Would be one field per user.
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User field: total contrib value -> gets increased every time a giveaway finishes.
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Might have been valued at 60, doesn't mean they paid it though.
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I bet you all my contrib that at least 90% of the games given away on this site were never bought for full value.
Edit:
Noticed all the X-Com giveaways? Tons of keys people received with their Bioshock Infinite preorder. They paid a cheaper price for Bioshock and got another game for free, a game that's worth 50 contrib.
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It's because CV buys you your way into most of the high level giveaways and the groups where you can raise your chances of winning immensely.
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No. I'm just saying the system on this site, as it is, is disingenuous. It probably won't be an easy fix, but it should be fixed.
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Why have a contrib value tied to the price of the game?
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The way I see it, there's two options.
Either have a CV tied to the value of the game at the time of the giveaway. No retroactive changes or decreases/"depreciations". Who cares that a game was bundled a year after someone gave it away? You get the points and you keep them.
The other option is a set amount of points per giveaway depending on type, say 1 for minor DLC, 2 for major DLC, 5 for full games. Considering that most giveaways are either codes people received for free or acquired in sales and bundles, that seems almost like the fairer option.
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So you're saying Bad Rats will be worth the same amount of CV as Bioshock Infinite with the 2nd option?
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Yes, that's exactly what I am saying. Considering that the majority of Bioshock Infinite keys given away here probably came from the AMD Never Settle Reloaded promo, it's not that far out, wouldn't you say so?
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I hope you realize that people still have to pay $200 for a graphics card to get that promo....
Let me replace Bioshock then. Bad Rats and Company of Heroes 2 will be worth the same amount.
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They didn't go and buy the graphics card because they wanted to create a Bioshock Infinite giveaway.
And if you really want to, by god, make a distinction between indie games and AAA titles. 3 points for Bad Rats, 5 points for COH2. I think it's fairer that way. But someone will always find a way to game the system and/or complain about it.
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They bought the graphics card because Bioshock Infinite was being offered with it. I see no difference. And you have to admit there is no way to provide a cutoff for what is AAA.
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Personally I like the idea that your giveaways depreciate.
It encourages those who get excited about contrib value to keep giving, rather than sitting on their laurels.
Don't stress, Ness...
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Then why have contrib value at all, if it's seemingly arbitrary?
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Because back then they didn't have contributor value, but people were complaining there were too many leechers. It's still in development, but I don't really care personally, heck I'd give you some contributor if you really want it that badly.
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Meh. Some people care about it. That's why.
I can see how it encourages and potentially rewards generosity, but it also creates a lot of bad blood (ie this thread).
There is no way to operate a non-honesty-based contribution system other than applying an arbitrary value to games anyway. Who is to say whether a game was purchased on Amazon, Gamersgate or Green Man Gaming, and at what price? Do you seriously expect Steamgifts Support to pore through a mountain of emailed receipts to assign actual values to games purchased? Even more ludicrously, do you actually expect all users to honestly disclose the price they paid for a game when the benefits of lying are clear for all to see?
The system MUST be arbitrary if it is to exist at all (and the value of it is up for debate). On one hand, it discourages leeching. On the other, it gives rise to some of the soul-destroying diatribe which populates threads like this, and runs contrary to the core tenet of generosity which I see as being central to Steamgifts and its operation...
IMHO some people need to lighten up and ditch the penny-pinching mentality. Who gives a sun-dried shit if their contributor value dips a little, especially when that value is vastly in excess of the price paid anyway.
I await the inevitable flaming...
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"Who gives a sun-dried shit if their contributor value dips a little"
OP for one. And this kind of thread pops up weekly :P
Also sometimes "a little" is more than you think. For example, when I got to $2000, I dropped back down to $1800 literally the day afterwards because some prices decided to change right when I reached that milestone. Usually I wouldn't mind too much, but it just had to happen right then!
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Haha! Point taken, but still more people care that DOTA 2 isn't available to give away.
That doesn't mean the site would be a better place if DOTA 2 was back on the list, and cg personally rubber-stamped every single giveaway to ensure that the value credited to the gifter's account was a true reflection of the money and/or resources expended in obtaining the gift.
Also, celebrating a milestone twice means two parties...
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Actually, I had to celebrate it 3 times. Dropped another $20 when I got back to $2000. Unlucky me >_>
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I neither expect SG to keep track of all sales and prices, nor do I expect users to disclose what they paid. It became clear to me about 5 minutes after I started using this site, that the absolute majority of giveaways were bundle leftovers, Steam sales, complimentary and promo keys. It's to be expected.
But then there has to be absolute consistency. How can you justify someone who gives away Darksiders 2, who has actually paid a few bucks for the bundle, to get minimal CV, while someone who gives away a Bioshock infinite key they got for free with their new GFX, gets the full whopping 60 points? Yes, you don't buy a new GFX every day. But still. The game might be from a bundle? Screw it. It's still a giveaway, people will still enter, someone will still win.
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Contributor values are inevitably flawed. The only way around the situation you described it for Support to vet each giveaway and assign a contribution value based on the price paid. It's impossible to tell from when/where games were purchased and for how much. as you acknowledge. If a contrib system exists, it must be arbitrary and, as it stands, the arbitrary values assigned almost always dwarf what was actually paid for the game.
Contrib values often seem to be a cause of grief and bad blood on the forums. I wouldn't really care if they were axed altogether, as they seem to bring out the very worst traits in some people.
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I'll tell you what creates bad blood.
I don't think it's the actual existence of CV, but the way it is used. It's how it buys access to all these 'exclusive' little groups and private giveaways, where chances of winning are much higher (don't tell me anyone who's on this site doesn't want to win anything). It's how people with low or no CV are being called leechers.
It's how every time I read a reply that states the site is about giving, and CV means nothing, it almost always comes from someone with high CV, who has had most of their wins in private or group giveaways.
Again, show me someone who says they're not here to win stuff, and I'll show you a hypocrite.
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MoneyhypeMike eagerly awaits your devastating exposé of his avaricious hypocrisy...
Joking aside, I agree to an extent, but the whole issue of contributor value, and people getting upset about it IS obviously that it relates to more than just virtual wang size, but I don't think anyone is trying to pretend otherwise.
It's still CV causing the bad blood. CV cannot be divorced from the way it is used, and it is foolish to think of the two is anything other than two sides of a single coin.
Also, I'm not saying that this site isn't about winning games. That's a big part of it, and what draws most users to the site initially. I do, however, think that CV is a divisive stat and because of the way it is used, and the bickering it causes, Steamgifts might be a better, more harmonious place without it. Many - maybe even most people would, I imagine, disagree with me.
In the case of private groups, axing CV would simply mean that these groups would want applicants to have given away "a few decent games". The criteria would basically be unchanged. These groups wouldn't suddenly start accepting people who hadn't given games away, or had only given away a couple of bundle games when they wouldn't have done so in the past.
I stand by my earlier posts that CV is a major cause of grief and bad blood amongst Steamgifters, as evidenced by scores of identikit threads batting the same issues back and forth.
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That guy has won some decent shit. 8 wins in 200 entries, I have 3 less than that and zero wins. But yeah, I can see how he'd make for a good exception to my above statement :)
In all honesty, the groups irk me more than CV. They're like having your own COD server, where you kick an people who don't play by your arbitrary rules (or are simply better than you), just so you can boost your own scores without having to deal with any of the frustrations.
Leave CV as it is, but do away with groups and private giveaways - if you want to pick a winner out of 10 of your friends, use random.org. Alternatively, reduced CV from group giveaways with less than, say, 100 entries. If nothing else, it'll reduce a good deal of the hypocrisy.
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To look at things from a different angle, it also encourages people to give away DLCs and small value games that will never drop in price. Then they can just sit on it without worrying.
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...or super-cheap indie games that cannot conceivably drop in price. You're right of course, but it's difficult to conceive a system that fairly rewards users based on the funds they actually spent, which doesn't involve gargantuan amounts of micro-managing and intervention by support.
Alas, no system is perfect, and there will always be a balance between creating a system that is fair for all, a system which cannot be abused by the rump of users who seek to do so at every turn, and basic manpower constraints.
One suggestion might be to depreciate gifts at a monthly rate, or to discount them altogether after a year, but it would no doubt create even more resentment amongst the user base, and all seems like a whole lot of work for a problem that IMHO isn't really a big issue to start with.
Some folks seem to have an unhealthy obsession with their own contributor value. Relax, people!
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And to look at it another way, it never drops in price.
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+1
contributor value should be static. why devalue over time, especially just because it happens to be cheaper now that its been out 5 years than when it was new and aaa. otherwise they're discouraging aaa gifts and instead encouraging gifting only old stuff thats already been devalued or items so cheap they can't be.(I know cv isn't the point of giveaways, I mean for those who care about their score it'd be discouraging, and even a little bit for some average gifters too)
maybe a static total takes up more server space or something so its cheaper to calculate through steam for such a big site somehow?
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This makes me a little worried, because I just gave away Darksiders 2, which has a $50 contributor value. I was going to buy 2 of the Humble THQ weekly sales until I read this and learned that CV can actually be taken away.
Taking away CV doesn't encourage people to give more games, it only encourages to give away less.
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Whenever I see a reply like this from someone who has almost exclusively won giveaways that are either private, for contribs only with high CV, or group giveaways, I can't help but think that there's just a little bit of hypocrisy involved.
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Most of those group giveaways only have ~10-20 entries. If there's so few people entering, it'd actually be easier to make a list of names and use random.org to choose a winner. There's an obvious reason why people use this website to make giveaways, and of course, we both know it's contributor value.
Does anyone actually give away games on this site "out of the goodness of their hearts"?
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Can't speak for anyone else, but whatever I give away is stuff that I don't need. I just bought a new GFX and got the promo keys for Tomb Raider and Bioshock Infinite, but guess what, I'm a selfish bastard and want to play those games. On the other hand, I bought the indiegala dwarves bundle solely because I wanted Warlock, so why let all those other keys go to waste?
If I could give away steam keys for games I have finished (something like 2nd hand keys), damnit, I would.
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VICTORY! Check your contributor values, everyone!
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What o.o. Why are they all removed from the bundle list now?
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that doesn't make any sense, it seems to undermine their bundle asterisk rule and opens it up for probably the biggest cv abuse( for $40 $1).
maybe they just didn't want to have to track all the weekly things humble is going to be doing now, like not counting galastore?
I prefer to assume they just took it down while fixing or discussing it or something rather than that this thread somehow got an exception made and declare victory lol
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It might also benefit from some sort of musical accompaniment...
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If a price on steam changes, it applies the contribution value retroactively? LOL. There goes all my motivation to create giveaways for anything worth more than $10.
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Your constant stream of >$10 giveaways will be sorely missed by the Steamgifts community.
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I knew that's the response I'd get, so I planned for it. Look at my inventory (you can ignore the Dota 2) and forget the chance of winning any of it. Just because I've not been able to do much so far doesn't mean I never planned on it. I really enjoy Steamgifts.
Goodnight, asshole.
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Your Steam gift inventory is private. o_O
I'm not involved in any gifting dispute you or anyone else has on this site, but if you've got any surplus copies of Dota 2 that you don't want I've got a great big farm where they can roam free with their own kind. (✌ﾟ∀ﾟ)☞
I'm always willing to take in more stray Dota 2's. (ノ^_^)ノ Add me on Steam.
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id say check
www.steamgifts.com/bundles/list
maybe the games u gave away were added there, and ur giveaways lie after the date of the giveaways
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for the last almost month, ive had 125 contrib, now i dropped almost 24 dollars.
just wondering if there is a link i can click to see what changed?
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