Oh no, how dare they create new, completely optional content! This obviously impacts the value of the base game.
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So... you're mad 'cause no one will play with you? You are assuming that those multiplayer players would not have lost interest in the game without the dlc, and would instead be doing the same quests they have done over and over with you. This may or may not be true. It is certainly a more valid point than most of those that have been made here thus far, but I'm not sure that it is an accurate one. The community remains active because of the frequent release of DLC, I think, at least, I do.
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Hey have you played it? I can't say I have but for all the last DLC every friend I know that played said the content was good. If the content is good what is the problem? Not as if they're milking it with crap stuff, as long the content is good, bring more I'll say!
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That's only if you decide to buy the base game, the season pass, the goty, and each dlc thats included in the GOTY and season pass separately. Which you don't.
(My math here is off, I wasnt considering the totally useless, unnecssary cosmetic DLC.) Nonetheless, I picked up the base game and season pass for a friend last week for $16. I cant imagine that any of the people complaining here would have a problem waiting a moment for the frequent sales that reduce the price to the point where you are paying pennies or less per hour of gameplay.
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GotY Edition - $60
Vault Hunter Upgrade 2 - $5
Headhunter 1 & 2 - $6
30 Cosmetic packs - $30
$101 ($71 if you don't want any of the skins). Not sure where that extra $10 came in, but remember, the GotY does include the Creature Slaughterdome as well as the Collector's Edition upgrade.
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Last week I bought the season pass and all the content dlc (yes, I don't care for cosmetics) and the 2 new character dlc, adding the amount I paid for base game on a previous sale, it totals to less than 30$. Pretty cheap for all the content you get.
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GreenManGaming sale? Yea, I did pretty much the same. With their 75% deal and coupon, I was able to pick up Borderlands 2 ($6), the Season Pass ($8), and the two DLC characters ($4) for a total of $18. The only thing I'm really missing now would be the second Vault Hunter Upgrade, the creature slaughterdome, and the new Headhunter missions, all of which I will probably pick up during the winter sale.
Sadly though, console gamers don't get the same type of deals that PC gamers get, so I could definitely understand their complaints about the pricing... But for those that want this game on PC (which should be everyone, since FPS are more suited to mouse/keyboard anyways), you'd have to be really impatient to pay full-price for the game.
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Well, I paid a total of ~40$ on pre-orders for the base game and the season pack, which includes everything of any importance so far, except for the Psycho pack. Can't call that a very bad price, especially since it wasn't discount hunting way after release.
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Uh, I was happy with Civ5. Even happier with Religion/Espionage. Then came Nirvana with BNW. If it's content that I never expected then I'm glad they made it. If it's a bug fix, then I would feel miffed. My gameplay satisfaction doesn't decrease because there's new content. That's similar to not playing GTA IV because GTA V came out.
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Actually, it is important to keep staff busy. Staff at development studios that isn't busy tends to be let go these days. That's why you always see layoffs and firings shortly after a game is released - a company is culling the staff they no longer need in order to save money. Keeping teams busy on DLC keeps them employed, and keeps content coming out to fans.
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Cash Cow
I remember the good days where they didn't deliberately take content out of the game so they can sell it to us separately and you could unlock stuff like skins in game.
One example of many, Mass effect 1, unlock new guns in game, Mass effect 2, Fuck you pay us for more guns
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So, uh, which DLC exactly did they develop before releasing the game? Gaige, maybe. Everythig else was developed at a later time and at an additional cost to the developer. And if the dozens of skins that are unlockable in-game aren't enough for you, you have some serious OCD issues that you should probably address.
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You can unlock "stuff like skins" in game. No skins were "removed," some were added later. That sounds like they aren't enough for him to me. I'd love to hear how I'm misreading that, though, if indeed I am.
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Being upset about leaving content out of the game so it can be sold separately later is not the same as thinking there are not enough skins and being upset about that.
You disagree with him about the first, but he never mentioned anything along the lines of the second. You just tossed that in so you could make your ad hominem about OCD issues.
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"and you could unlock stuff like skins in the game" You can unlock stuff like skins in game, thus his complaint is obviously regarding the few skins that are not unlockable in game.
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"I remember the good days where they didn't deliberately take content out of the game so they can sell it to us separately"
Yes, there may be skins already in the game that can be simply unlocked, but his complaint is not about that; it is obviously regarding content being deliberately taken out of a game so it can be sold separately later. I'm barely changing the wording.
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Other than correcting some erroneous information he conveyed? No, I suppose it doesn't.
Most downloadable content is developed either late in a particular game's development cycle, or after it's already finished. So unless we're talking about on-disc DLC or stuff that's sold right at launch, it probably wasn't "deliberately taken out of the game," as he put it.
Personally I've never understood all the butthurt over DLC. I like the idea of revisiting a game I've shelved with new content.
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I think you addressed a point and contributed in some ways. I'm delighted to pay $3 to reinvigorate an experience I have already spent over a thousand hours enjoying. If Cumly here isn't, I hope it doesn't buy it. I'd hate to run into him in multiplayer.
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Dev's used to make real expansion packs (there is a difference between DLC and Expansion packs).. packed with content, and very little still do. Now they will sell any old shit to you. Here's a gun pack... £6!
Skins I can just about take as they are not game changing but when they start to sell game changing content that divides the community in a online game they can go fuck themselves.
It is also common knowledge (or at least it should be) that they hold stuff back to be sold to you at a later date. This is not always the developers choice but the publishers forcing them to do this kind of crap.
And lets not forget, Day one DLC!!! Yeah! just what we want!
ps. Its not "butthurt", its having some standards and not being milked like the good little consumer you are.
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Really, you'd rather go back to the days of "expansions?" You clearly haven't played Tiny Tina's Assault on Dragon Keep if you think the DLC is a "gun pack" or "the same old shit," or that it has less content then those expansion packs you mention (which, might add, usually costed as much as the base game itself and seldom went on sale.) And, while we are at it, those expansion packs certainly divided their respective communities... Whatever, if you dont mind contradicting yourself I cant imagine I can do anything to help you.
And if you are worried about being "milked" as a consumer, there is absolutely no reason you are required to play any game ever. Go plant some tomatoes. Games cost money. If you aren't willing to pay for them you have no right or reason to play them.
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Personally, yes, I would rather go back to the days of expansion packs. While I have indeed enjoyed the larger DLCs of BL2 (and also very much enjoyed the larger two DLCs from BL1), they are somewhat lacking content wise. In my experience, expansions tended towards changing core gameplay elements (for instance, the Lord of Destruction expansion added two new classes AND a new act AND runes/runewords/gems/charms to Diablo II), whereas these piecemeal "DLCs" alter the game gradually (which tends IMO to be less exciting in most games), end up costing much more than the game itself and most annoyingly require multiple purchases. If I had not been convinced (read: badgered into submission) by a friend IRL, I'd have waited for the GotY version myself, and I'd have done so thinking that I had bought everything the game had to offer. Had I found out that was not the case, I'd have been annoyed as well.
No, GotY does not explicitly mean "all the DLCs in one package" but for most large releases it has come to be such.
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I feel you. I personally prefer the a-la-carte method, or at least the option to choose which parts I would like to purchase and when, and I feel that the gameplay changes in many modern DLC are at least as large and interesting as the older ones you mention, and at a much better price, but your opinion is of course totally valid. Its only when people start telling me how "evil" gearbox is that I object. Bl1 had both a complete edition, and discs with the DLC available. While the gameplay changes in BL1 and 2 DLC are perhaps less extensive than the one you mention, I would argue that it is far more interesting than many of the old expansions, such as StarCraft's. The new characters both add totally new game styles, which for me led to more than one complete re-playthrough and each DLC offers something unique, especially Tiny Tina's Assault. At any rate, thank you very much for rising above the fray and addressing this in a rational and reasonable manner. Cheers!
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see with BL1 all the DLC is proper new content smallish expansions but expansions nonetheless whole new areas, with BL2 it seems to be the death of 1000 cuts, yeah i could ignore the DLC but i am too ocd to ignore it so i dont buy the game at all
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Bl1 dlc had level cap increase, game play changes... Bl2 dlc doesnt have new areas? The hell are you talking about? nevermind I can see you are not interested in a rational discussion, go turn on every faucet in bioshock infinite or something
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my point was most of the DLC for BL2 seems to exist solely to make some more cash of the players, increasing the lvl cap, character skins et, as opposed to BL1 where all the DLC adds meaningful content true expansions that seem a bit more justified, this is all my opinion its not an attack on you per se just making the point theirs differing viewpoints and for me buying bits of a title is a deal breaker, i want the whole package and in this case ill wait till theirs a complete edition i imagine, as for bioshock i played the first on 360 and its an ok FPS that i enjoyed completing and have never been tempted to play again, at some stage ill get 2 and infinite but im in rush modern pure fpses just dont do it for me anymore dunno why as i still play doom and dukenukem 3D which are hardly the deepest of games
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The kind of games that typically had full-blown expansion packs were usually sims, RTS' and RPG's. Guess what? They still do. Dragon Age had Awakening, X-Com has Enemy Unbound, SimCity has Cities of the Future, Civilization V has Brave New World, etc. If something like Batman: Arkham City had been released in the 90's, in all likelihood it wouldn't have featured any post-release content.
There's also the matter that games now are cheaper than they've ever been. When I was a child, I'd get one, maybe two SNES games per year, because they were around $90 each. $90 in 1992. Adjusting for inflation, that's around $130 in 2013 money. Can you imagine paying that much for a video game today? No! Of course not. Most of us don't even pay full-retail price anymore due to Steam sales, resellers like GreenManGaming, bundles and the like.
So does it bother me that a publisher wants to charge $3 for a costume pack? No, not at all. Even if it did, I could just, you know, not buy it. There's no gun being held to my head forcing me to BUY ALL OF THA CONTENTS!!
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Perspective? I don't know if they are ready for that...
+100!
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The GOTY wasn't all the DLC in the first place which prevented me from picking up so far as I expect down there road there will be an Ultimate GOTY or something. Hopefully anyway, I do like my games complete and Saints Row 3 taught me never to buy early!
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Is not getting some skin DLC and a $2.50 level upgrade that you won't need for a long time into the game (if ever) really keeping you from buying a game?
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Well the backlog also makes it easy to wait! I am in no rush to pick it up because I know it will go lower over time and odds are it will be like other must have games I own... still have not played. Too busy working 2.5 jobs...
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That is a perfectly reasonable position, and I imagine there will be a complete edition released sometime down the road for those in your situation, I just hope the multiplayer community is still alive and well by then. I know I sound like a complete dick in this thread, but Id love to play with you when you finally join us!
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Ugh it was horrible if you were playing with random people (also sometimes really funny; I wish I captured gameplay back then). There were 3rd-party patches but for some reason Gearbox thought it would be smart to leave everyone with an open mic that you couldn't turn off and other odd bits =p.
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Yes. I didn't get Saints Row III until the complete package. I won't get Saints Row IV until they stop churning out DLCs and give me a complete package. I got Borderlands 1 GOTY and it is complete, but now Borderlands 2 GOTY is still only some of the content. The trend towards a constant nickel-and-dime stream means I am disincentivised to buy it at launch knowing that not only will later buyers get it for cheaper, but also get more content for that cheaper price. The more games move to selling dozens of DLCs, the more I wait for games amd pick them up for less.
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SR3 Complete didn't even include all of the DLCs!
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I don't get the outrage at all. "company supports their game, grr arrgh"
They announced the new headhunter DLCs alongside the GOTY so it wasn't like the expectation was ever that they'd be done with the release of GOTY.
Nor is this the first GOTY not to include all DLC.
Slow news day or something, I guess.
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No one's writing it off, we are just okay with it. Because, we like their behavior. If you don't don't support them. Adding to this conversation is really just giving them free advertising. So, stop.
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So... what part of "Game Of the Year" means "complete"? Maybe your language works differently than mine.
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If it was called "complete edition" I would without doubt join you in your outrage. As it is, I recommend you read the fine print before making such assumptions.
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There are plenty of "complete" packs that also don't include all of the DLCs
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GotY is just a premium edition of a game, usually including bonus content, at price close to it's original release price. It's existed since long before DLC was a thing, to get a game that has received recognition back into the public eye and encourage people who waited or heard about the game because of that recognition to pick it up.
It's just that these days, that "bonus content" tends to be post release DLC. It's something that originated as a marketing tool, and it basically is still just that, except that people have gotten increasingly spoiled by them over the years. It's like a "Platinum Hits" edition or an "Ultimate Edition" - a bundle thrown together to generate buzz, sales, and cash in on accolades a game has received. Nothing more, nothing less, and certainly by no means ever assumed to have every piece of content related to a game.
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Just because one company does that doesn't mean they all do. You can't expect to be given content created after the GOTY edition is released. The description for the GOTY is pretty clear on what it includes. If not getting a couple of skins is stopping you from playing I'm not sure what to say.
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A "GotY" edition never promises to have ALL THE DLC EVER, just the DLC released up until the point of that release (and even then, not even that - there's a lot of GotY and Collection packages that lack smaller DLCs). It's just like the people who complain about season passes not getting every single little piece of DLC - no one said you would. The devs are well within their rights to release more content after a collection is released, and anyone who enjoys a game but doesn't support it because "it's not moral" or "reasons" is pretty much a complete moron.
It's not nickel and diming. Nickel and diming is stuff like paying to unlock cheats or skip having to level or whatever. This is just more support and optional content for a game that you don't have to buy. God forbid they continue to support a game while they work on others! Get over it.
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I want to buy a full game, not a bone that looks like a game but without the meat on. I don't want to buy every chunk of meat one by one for the price of 2-3 fullpriced AAA game. Expansions after success are OK, preplanned DLCs are not OK (and these are planned, otherwise they cannot release so much and so fast). You guys just againt your own money!
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What is "just against your own money?" Honest question. After thinking about this far too long, I am starting to wonder about this GOTY thing though- it came out in 2012, most DLC in 2013- just what year is it the game of?
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GOTY came in 2013 and as far as i know this and one more DLC will come in this year. So it's definitly not a GOTY.
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Its my top game of 2012 certainly and still the one I've enjoyed most in this, the year of crap releases, so it can be GOTY every year as far as I'm concerned, but I'm really not sure what they mean by it.
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Have you played the game? I've logged ~60 hours without touching any of the DLC. Just because there is more content later doesn't mean there wasn't enough content to start with.
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You realise almost all DLC is preplanned, right? They don't just go "Oh, let's do this!" one day. It's not that simple nor that easy. But just because something's preplanned doesn't mean it was "withheld from the game to be sold as DLC" or "cut content" or whatever buzzphrase you want to use (and the Borderlands 2 DLC most certainly was not simply withheld form the main game).
Also what games are you getting that are "a bone that looks like a game"? Most of these games are still full experiences with or without the DLC, particularly Borderlands. I do say most intentionally, some aren't - but the majority are. Don't let the existence of DLC create an illusion of incompleteness, because most games are very complete - they just get more added after the fact. Just because you feel you have to ahve every piece of everything ever doesn't make the base game less complete.
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So... they should... not make more content? Not get paid when they make more content? I feel like you are being a bit spoiled here. I'm pretty close to broke, but I paid full price for every DLC and I feel that I got much more than my moneys worth. Its entitled attitudes like yours that drive developers to the odious and experience-ruining "free-to-play" business model. Nobodys demanding you hunt turkeys. You can play hundreds of hours on the base game alone and you wont feel that you are missing a thing. If a brand new experience isn't worth four bucks or whatever to you, don't buy it. We won't miss you.
Also, learn English before you try to use it. Plzkthx.
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Maybe you are right but I don't see how else a company could "morally" continue to develop content for a game, if we accept the precept that it is "wrong" to continue to develop content for a game after release, or after releasing a price-reducing bundle of whatever kind.
Edit: I suppose the alternative is "not making more content," and while that is an excellent decision for games like, say their terrible Aliens game, life without Tiny Tina's Assault, Mister Torgue and my Swordsplosion would be a slightly less awesome place.
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People buy the GOTY because they want the complete game without paying a premium and getting it piecemeal. For that they give up the first day experience, telling the developer this game is not that important I am willing to wait. It is not spoiled to chastise a business for something you see as greedy. It is a little fanatical to come to the business' defence with vitriol and blind loyalty. I would suggest the constant release of new content in a primarily multiplayer game is along the lines of pay to win, and is exactly why people have an issue with it.
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And when they buy the GotY edition, they're still getting the majority of the content that matters at a severely reduced price - Borderlands 2 + all the DLC in the GotY edition would cost nearly $105. You're still saving 50 on the GotY package. Just because they decide to release more afterwards doesn't invalidate the massive savings in the collection.
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I guess entitlement is a strong and pervasive disease. I would say keep fighting the good fight, but actually I'm thinking it might be better to save ourselves before we descend into howling madness with the rest of them. :)
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Well you are both on the wrong side of a pretty standard attitude and customer base, it's certainly not the only one but it is common in most every market. To think that your perspective is somehow special or correct, and that you need to proselytize it, is where you have failed. Also you seem to have a lot of angst about people misinterpreting the behaviors of a game developer then misinterpret the discussion and message of those you are arguing against. Being so often and so drastically incorrect is bound to frustrate folks. Everything I said stands on it's own, if you want to convolute the message to better argue against it you are welcome to, but then you will be missing the point, and likely frustrate yourself. The attitude and intent to keep businesses in check is a great one. Those that argue against it are often doing it for the wrong reasons, even if in that instance they are correct.
Just for clarification, even though I know someone will miss this completely and come up with some strawman/ad hominem crap that I will simply ignore, I am not taking an active position against the behavior of gearbox, they seem to milk their franchise a bit too much, but they are not doing anything overtly misleading or malicious. However the position that gearbox and 2k are benevolently providing for people because of their altruistic motives, and that an entitled attitude is the root of this scorn is obtuse at best.
Not too surprising the most vehement argument comes from those most vested into the game, do you honestly think your viewpoint lacks an inherent bias? I own BL2 I bought the season pass when it first came out. I think $90 is plenty to spend on a game, hell I bought the GOTY edition for BL1 for $15 and is was certainly worth it. I also bought Terraria when it first came out for $5 and they keep updating that game and adding content 2 years later.
To accept their behavior is one thing, to reward or encourage it is something entirely different, and wholly foolish as a consumer. Entitlement certainly is a pervasive disease, we definitely don't want businesses catching it.
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How is new content milking? Milking would be putting exclusive content in the GOTY so early adopters had to buy it just for a small piece of DLC.
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Don't buy it. It's stand alone, you don't want ,no harm done. Clearly there are people that think it is worth their, or their parents, money. Would you call it milking if the HH stuff was originally included in the GOTY but it was $10 more expensive? If you don't think its worthwhile then why would you have a problem with it not being included in the GOTY edition? You're not being mugged, giving them your money is voluntary. If you feel compelled to buy it all that's not an artifact of the game or the studio.
What you're saying is that if you could make something that people wanted to give you real money for you wouldn't let them? Under this definition every sequel is milking. Heck, if a studio has a successfull title trying to make another is milking.
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Milking is also the soft touch. If the company came to the public and said "Hey we've got this great new game with all these features! It yours for the low, low price of $150", lots of people wouldn't buy. But if they cut that up and off it in small doses, there's lots of buyers. Essentially, they're putting they're hand on your teet and softly stroking more money out of you. Until you've given out $150 dollars without even noticing how much you spent.
There are two main issues with this particular business practice. 1) It preys heavily on the weak, those who don't or can't understand sales methods, and there are people who hate seeing the weak exploited for extra profit. 2) While there are a lot of people unbothered by manipulative practices, there are some who absolutely cannot manipulation. It makes them feel all icky inside. But since they're the minority, companies regularly write them off.
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There's no way they could have released a game with the scope and content now available through the DLCs for $50 at launch. It took another year of development to produce these DLCs. They gauged their audience, saw that we were hungry for more content, and continued to produce it for us. If thats not a good business practice I don't know what is. You are assuming that all this content could have been in the base game, and wasn't. That is a totally unrealistic assumption.
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Their entire production team didn't work on that content for a year, particularly those skins. Had they kept full production for a fraction of the year, you could have had all that content in one package.
But that's actually beside the point. The point is upfront sales versus manipulative sales. The DLC game is basic psychological marketing behavior applied to games. And it's quite effective. It does, however, rub a number of people the wrong way. Companies write those people off, though, because they're the minority. And the loss is more than made up for by the weak.
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I think you're confusing "dlc milking" done by companies like EA (with pre-release dlc's) and "creating more content post-release". If you buy a game at release, you re only entitled to what you bought. If more content is created afterwards, you can choose to either expand your game or ignore the dlc's.
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Yeah, what he said. (Every time you buy anything there is "marketing". Especially if its something you want. That does not invalidate the value of your purchase. Even if it makes you super duper sad. The fact that you want it means they have done their job effectively, not that you deserve to have it free. Maybe your mummy will buy it for you if you cry real loud)
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Under the new marketing methods - and we're talking BASIC intro course stuff here, the goal is to extract more money for the same amount of product. And one of the techniques that is taught is essentially the DLC method, breaking something up into more palatable chunks, preying off of the general inability to relate value in different numbers. Games are actually behind the times. This stuff has been common practice for many years now in other industries.
The manipulation enters in the method, not in its announcement. If you charge $100 for additional content, people will expect a lot of content. But they don't expect much at the $5 and $10 level. So, if you sell a bunch of tiny striplets of game at $5 and $10, you can sell less real content, but still get $100. Thus doing less work for more money.
As for confusing Gearbox with EA, no. While their DLC policies are similar, the scandals plaguing them are very different. Gearbox has art theft and potential accounting fraud instead of douchy labor practices.
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That would be a valid point, if there was "the same amount of content." However, this is clearly not the case, no matter how you would like to see it. It is additional content, both in that it was developed later and at additional cost, and in that it adds potentially hundreds of hours of gameplay. On disc DLC is one thing, and this is clearly not that.
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So, the people who buy all the DLCs as they come out will eventually be paying ~$150 for the entirety. That's the equivalent of three WHOLE games. The question then is - will they have received three whole games worth of content?
Yeah. There's no upwards push on price for the same amount of material in there at all.
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I've never encountered another game I can sink more than a thousand hours into, so for me, the answer is obviously "yes." If your answer is "no," wait for a sale or don't buy it at all. Apparently I'm far from the only person who feels it is worth the full price, however, so I don't know why i'm bothering to talk to you, except to assure you that you might enjoy it if you get it.
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Do we really have to constantly defend the dull knives? At a certain point you have to let people live and learn for themselves. If you think you have to have $30 worth of cosmetics then you aren't being manipulated, you're just stupid. It shouldn't be up to the people selling us things to balance our checkbooks.
If those are the only 2 options, $150 or chunks, please give the chunks every time. Then I can ignore the faff, i.e. cosmetics, and just get what I want. Frankly with the speed that games go on sale you could call putting games on sale for full price "manipulative" with this logic.
"Patching" incomplete games with paid DLC is manipulative. Putting one piece of exclusive, major DLC in a GOTY is manipulative. Putting cocaine in the box with a game is manipulative. Nothing they've done with BL2 is manipulative, and in fact they've been pretty clear about what packs will include what content.
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Ah the morality dilemma. Cool! The question posed generally goes something like this. If your uneducated little old grandmother is about to be bilked out of her life savings by a huxter because she doesn't understand the hidden terms and what is really being sold, do you A) Let her get taken because she should know better, and now she will have a valuable life lesson and will know better from here on? B) Prevent her from getting taken, but let the huxter go on his merry way, because you protect your family, since the ties of family are the only important thing? Or C) Call the police to have the huxter arrested, in order to prevent his from damaging the community?
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Yeah they are totally bilking your grandma out of her life savings. Actually, its more like Hitler... yeah sure buddy. If someone is dumb enough to buy anything without knowing what they are getting they deserve what they get. Welcome to capitalism. If you object, find someplace socialist. Im sure you can get some nice state-funded video games.
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they are quit ridiculus...i mean if u buy the goty, u miss at least 2 major dlc..1 is the level cap augmenter...now another dlc...of course i bought it on greenmangaming...i bought borderlands 2 for 5 euro..i would buy the story dlc sooner or later...but only in sale
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Did you... have you heard of BL1? If you didn't expect a similar DLC situation you probably should spend your precious cents elsewhere.
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And which increase the level cap, isn't that his complaint? I'm assuming that's what "incrasing" means, at any rate.
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Man this totally optional, additional content that breaths new life into a year old game is the worst. Never mind that I don't have to buy it or that GOTY absolutely doesn't mean you get all the future content. I demand that I get more for free or it just doesn't get made at all. There is literally no justification for whining about this. The Headhunter DLC was announced before/at the same time as the GOTY edition was launched and it was made clear that it wouldn't be included. To get all the content you just need the $60 GOTY (Ive seen it on sale for ~$30) $10 UVHU 2(on sale for <$2.50), and $6 for the 2 current headhunter packs. I don't remember how many HH packs there will be but by Christmas most will be on sale for $1.50 I'm sure. This is a non-issue.
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Yes, how dare they keep adding new side content which you don't even need to enjoy the game. And how DARE they charge us so little for it (and probably put it on sale soon if you wait for a while). Even worse, how dare they make this abundantly clear with their development schedule. Everyone knows "GOTY" secretly means "Complete Pack" as stated in our own mental dictionaries. How Dare They, Indeed.
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Funny, but lately GOTY actually meant "everything inside". And that's what 2k hopes for - we'll quickly believe their GOTY means "no more stuff will be added" just to throw lots of new stuff at later date, knowing there are people who won't be able to play game knowing they don't have everything.
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GOTY have existed long before DLC was a thing... to quote those above, far more eloquent than I,
"GotY is just a premium edition of a game, usually including bonus content, at price close to it's original release price. It's existed since long before DLC was a thing, to get a game that has received recognition back into the public eye and encourage people who waited or heard about the game because of that recognition to pick it up.
It's just that these days, that "bonus content" tends to be post release DLC. It's something that originated as a marketing tool, and it basically is still just that, except that people have gotten increasingly spoiled by them over the years. It's like a "Platinum Hits" edition or an "Ultimate Edition" - a bundle thrown together to generate buzz, sales, and cash in on accolades a game has received. Nothing more, nothing less, and certainly by no means ever assumed to have every piece of content related to a game.
Ashilyn
There have been GOTY editions since before DLC existed. It means nothing more than "this game was successful and critics liked it, so we're re-releasing it in a special edition."
movac
Just because one company does that doesn't mean they all do. You can't expect to be given content created after the GOTY edition is released. The description for the GOTY is pretty clear on what it includes. If not getting a couple of skins is stopping you from playing I'm not sure what to say.
AHoopyFrood"
edit: and if you CANT play the game until you know you have EVERYTHING, you have some serious mental issues and should probably stop playing video games altogether before you descend further into this madness born of greed and envy.
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And 60 years ago, if I'd call you gay you wouldn't think that's an insult (FYI: in times of Bambi it meant happy).
Language evolves, meaning of words change. When DLC appeared, GOTY started to mean "everything inside".
And 2k knows typical gamer understand GOTY as "everything inside" and they use it for their profit, simple as that.
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Then, as now, I would ask you what you meant by it before jumping to any conclusions. As a consumer, I'm aware that people who are trying to sell me things are in fact trying to sell me things, so I tend to read things before making assumptions.
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Yes, some consumers do their research. But most doesn't. And if B1 GOTY meant "all stuff", most 'casuals' (gamers not doing research) will buy it right away, thinking they will get "full version" - and 2k and their bank accounts will be more than happy to prove them wrong.
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Those poor, poor fools. God knows their idiocy is my problem. I think you have too little faith in people, but frankly, I dont see why it should concern you, unless you yourself were tricked by this vile, odious trick. Many companies are tricky, if consumers are that dumb this is gonna be far from the biggest error they make in their purchases, no?
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Except it didn't. There's still lots of GotY releases that don't have all, or even rarely ANY DLC (instead including other bonuses). There's no underhanded thinking or conspiracy going on with 2K here. They simply released a well received game with all of it's major content addons using a common moniker for game rereleases.
"Ultimate Edition" is closer to consistently meaning "everything inside" than GotY, I would wager. And even that's not always true. Things don't happen in absolutes, and people should stop expecting them to.
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You are right. Everyone's own choice to be a cow.
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Yep, and that's why I won't hold it against you. ;)
Anyhow, sarcasm aside- to be honest I find Gearbox's DLC policy with the Borderlands series to be one of the better ones in the gaming industry. The bigger DLCs add a LOT of stuff to the game (something which I question you knowing, seeing as how you don't have it). I haven't tried the new ones because I always wait for sales but looking at their prices and the fact that they are completely optional I have to question why exactly you're so angry about them not being included in the GOTY. As stated multiple times in the thread, GOTY is just a repackaging of the game and has no obligation to include all the DLCs. Same with Season Passes that state exactly what they include.
I'd say the occasional small cheap DLCs is much better than the "amazing" practice of selling a few multiplayer map packs at 15 bucks each and then jumping to the next game which some companies deploy. Personally the only (not cosmetic) DLC for Borderlands 2 which I feel is overpriced for what it has to offer is the Creature Slaughterdome and it's both optional and included in the GOTY.
TL:DR- Either those DLCs don't offer enough for you to be pissed off about them not being included in the GOTY or if they do, they are damn cheap for it. :P
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Right! And I hear some of them eat food! How dare they eat food! They should give me their food! After all, I bought something else from them once!
Okay maybe that's a bit over the top, it sure was fun to type though.
Edit: You weren't joking? My god, what has this world come to!? If you are willing t play their game it seems pretty messed up to wish that they go out of business. You seem like kind of a terrible person. I hope you know what it is to be hungry some day.
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The thing is they false advertise as a GOTY edition, that is not complete. I don't care about them making new DLC and not include it in the GOTY, but at least call it a "Premium Edition" or something like that. Or you know, make another goddamn game?
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I'm gonna drop out of this pointless conversation, and I do apologize for my vitriol (although my butt feels just fine, thank you Mr Mabry) but I would recommend you see the replies to MajorNewbie's comment above- nothing about Game of the Year means, implies, or even suggests "complete." to quote Ashilyn above-
"GotY is just a premium edition of a game, usually including bonus content, at price close to it's original release price. It's existed since long before DLC was a thing, to get a game that has received recognition back into the public eye and encourage people who waited or heard about the game because of that recognition to pick it up.
It's just that these days, that "bonus content" tends to be post release DLC. It's something that originated as a marketing tool, and it basically is still just that, except that people have gotten increasingly spoiled by them over the years. It's like a "Platinum Hits" edition or an "Ultimate Edition" - a bundle thrown together to generate buzz, sales, and cash in on accolades a game has received. Nothing more, nothing less, and certainly by no means ever assumed to have every piece of content related to a game."
edit: I didn't drop out shameface
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The description of the GOTY edition told you what you were getting. Nothing more, nothing less. All those games are probably dead. The developers have moved on to their next project. A bunch of people had to put real work into making this content. That cost the studio money. Why should they give it away for free? As a consumer the way you tell a company how yo feel about their practices is with your money, not complaining on some random forum. If this post-GOTY DLC doesn't sell well enough then you can bet they won't do it in the future.
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So... workers... "do something" for free? I would dearly love to meet these workers, my lawn could use some free attention
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The GOTY included all the content dlc's that were released at the time GOTY came out. Are you saying that developers should abandon their game and not make anymore dlc's after GOTY came out? When you bought GOTY, did you expect it to include future dlc's?
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I hope you can live with the disappointment. Actually, I could go either way.
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Your are not a brick, but your actions supports this method of releases, and it will be worse and worse for customers.
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It's sure cheaper than a movie these days, lasts much longer, and is probably at least a bit less vacuous. If that isn't $2.50 well spent I don't know what is. I've thrown away plenty of things I paid more for without a second thought if they did not please me.
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Why support shit companies that release GOTY versions and don't allow ealier purchases to upgrade cheap just like Deus Ex HR Director's Cut did, or like what WB did for Batman AC.
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No one asks you to play this great game. Go play some cod!
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"omg I'm so smart and funny, when someone complain about a game I tell him to play cod"
Why everyone say the samething? "You are not forced to play it, play COD instead", you guys give me cancer...
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Wow I didn't know we had accomplished something so wonderful today. You are welcome, world!
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Bye bye GOTY. From now on you cannot be sure you have the whole game or just some bone. People are simply against their own money with supporting this!
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