Why I am not surprised anymore ? I heard that people maybe not even part of the group got keys :( But people part of the group didn't.
Another developer promising and not delivering... not nice.
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Yeah, if you emailed and begged him for one he delivered, but doing what he asked got you nothing. Dude's in full censorship damage control now, this should be fun ;D
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I am not going to beg for a key. I did what was asked and got nothing. Fire away with damage control then.
Not the best way to handle it, I think, asking for e-mails. Anyone and everyone can send you an mail. How is that a solution...?
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He's hoping to get enough fans out of the free keys to shut up the dissenters, even if most of them never supported the game in the first place. Not working so far :D
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When did it ever work ? Tell me when did this technique ever work ?
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Do we need Michael Moore on this one ?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0961117/
Quick fix, give every old, before greenlight group member a key and maybe dissent quiets down.
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well, i got my key for that game on a group chat giveaway
that hangman game on chat was fun...
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Was that the point ? So we were supposed to join, wait for game to be greenlit and then wait 24/7 in group chat until we get key :O ?
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here
the key was from the dev but not from his group
if i got it right i think that the dev was giving keys to many big group owners so that they could give them away and ask the winners to leave positive feedbacks
so yeah, buying reviews... not news around these devs
i also love this part from that announcement
"Since the success of Goat Simulator, numerous number of shovelware developers have been littering various platforms with pointless, buggy & unfinished products to take advantage of the hype and piling up profit from it. Predator Simulator is a silent protest against this trend and my personal expression of "Simulators don't have to be pointless". I hope the simulator lovers out there will appreciate and support this attempt." - Developer
edit:. speaking of the devil, i just got this announcement
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Chris Hansen would have loved this game. He would have asked every Predator to take a seat.
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Hello...I just saw your pictures and stand on a comment that i was made.You write above gone,what did you mean with that?
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The developer's deleting comments that complain about his actions, whoever wrote the article had his deleted by GameIndica. Mine's still on the group for now until he deletes it too.
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What other developer was also deleting comments ? It was also about keys not being delivered.....
Edit: http://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/Y4qPq/dev-refuses-to-give-previous-purchasers-steam-keys-bans-people-and-delete-threads
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Ha,really he delete my message?Didn't check out.Well i support the game as i say and in the group when it was still on greenlight and i told him that i say the words he wanna say "voted like a boss".The game came to steam and he deside to give keys to people who beg,make giveaway on a russian site and people who actually supported takes nothing.
Indie developers what can you say about them.
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There's actually a 50 key giveaway for it on SG too, just gotta be in the right groups to see it. I think there's three separate 50 key batches up for grabs, not sure. He's also got a batch up on Steam Companion.
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Yap he delete it this,but not the others.Well i'm not gonna pay 6€ for this s....t because its not worth it.So i'm done with him and his stupid game.I'm not gonna beg for a key that he promise to us.End of story.
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Well, I mean, Steam asked developers not too and has issued warnings before.
Plus I mean, that's not really what Greenlight is about. It's about giving independent developers that the community deems worthy a chance. If everyone just gives away their games, Greenlight will turn into even more of a crapfest.
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Heh, no honor among the thieves :) You cheated together and he didnt share the loot.
Please dont vote on greenlight for games that you dont consider actually worth it. There is enough bad games on steam already.
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He actually deleted old copy with greenlight voters to ensure only real voters are included.
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Quite the investigative journalism you got over there, congrats.
Frontline: Battleground Greenlight, promises broken.
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That Operation: Covert looks good. I'll have to add it to my wishlist next to Ronin when it makes it to the store.
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Yeah, when I first saw Operation:Covert, I was amazed by it's atmosphere, so I voted for it. After you sent me the demo, and I played through it (even though I suck at stealth games), I immediately added it to my wishlist (in my head ofc.). Just a question: Do all voters get a key for it on release? If not, then when will you open "Pre-Orders"? I mean those, who "Pre-Order" it, get to play different builds until release, and on release, they'll get a Steam key. Anyways, keep up the good work, because O:C looks promising :)
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Yes! Opium Pulses website never crashes during these kinds of give aways. AWESOME move of the developer!! It's his second awesome decision he made in a short period of time!
Congrats! developer. I wish him many sales.
It's an even better choice than letting Steamgifts handle a 1000 key give away, this is much more fair to everyone that entered the group, where a group give away were to be organized. 10/10 Would go down the same road this developer goes.
Edit: maybe the people that voted joined a specific group, hint, hint...
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I'd suggest a better way: People actually have to send a photo proof, that they have voted (screenshoting the "Items you have voted for" page, where both the voted game, and the account's name visible). It's a manual way, and it can take up a lot of time, but this way, real voters will be able to grab keys, not just those, who are lucky, because of OP. Also their site always gets overwhelmed by users, if they are holding a GA. Second: Do you know about Who's Gaming Now!?. I've been using that site for like a year, and there were a lot of giveaways there. You have to contact Carlmundo, and WGN!?'s system ensures that every entrant gets a key. Or if you want to give them just 1000 keys, then it chooses 1000 random people from the entrants.
Or you might just make an invite only group, where you invite the ones, who have voted.
Anyway, even if I won't get a key, I'll buy the game, if it fits in my budget :)
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Yep, I voted and never got the key. Scumbag move yo.
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Really well done article. Someone has dope detective skills.
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After reading everything, that was seriously low of him. It just proves that even indie devs can be awful people. Giving out free keys in excahnge for greenlight votes is a massive red flag. Not giving out free keys in exachange for votes is just criminal.
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Fun fact: I saw a video yesterday (linked from another thread here) about "devs" that sell Unity games with nothing in it but a few assets they bought for cheap. I'd bet a tentacle that Predator Sim was one of the games shown in the video (english is not my native language, and automatic subtitles are not perfect, so I can't tell if that game name is used in the voicing).
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Well, my experience with this dev was rather different.
I sent him an email telling him how I was one of the greenlight supporters and that I understand that he cannot distribute the key via Steam due to the restrictions so I'd appreciate him giving me a key via email.
Naturally, I was polite and was not attacking him in my email, only explained that I have heard of the current situation with the keys and I put a link to my Steam ID so he could check that I indeed have supported him and he was really polite and kind and sent me a copy.
I'm enclosing a part of his email just so you guys can see how nice he was:
My name is xxx(not sure if it would be ok to share his name), I am the developer & founder of GameIndica Entertainment. Thank you so much for writing to me. Appreciate your kind words. We are out of supporter keys as 500+ keys were given out on the first week of launch. But I have a press copy for you :-) Hope you enjoy the game (...)
Keep in mind that he never once told me to leave a positive feedback or asked for anything in return.
I understand that people are upset about the whole situation with the keys but I always try to keep in mind that mistakes might happen and that people can pull back when being attacked.
How about giving the guy a chance and not getting swept up with the negative hype?
It's obvious he doesn't have a problem with giving keys to the supporters, all it took was one email.
TL;DR: How about trying to contact him yourself instead of getting swept up with the bad hype? I did, he was very nice and happy to deliver the key. No begging, no nothing- I was just polite.
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His actions speak a little too much for me to ignore them, he was warned by several groups where he promoted the free keys that doing that as a way of upvote buying was no longer allowed, yet he kept on doing it. Now when he's called out, posts showing he knew what he did was wrong and didn't care have been deleted by him.
There's screwing up, then there's trying to cover up. I have zero interest in a copy of his game at this point, free or otherwise.
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Well, I can understand how you would think that. I'm not trying to say that what he did in that moment (if the situation is as you describe it, I really haven't been following the events much, only saw that there was a problem with getting the keys through Steam and his announcement that he'd give the keys if you contact him) was the right choice, but I certainly can understand someone getting defensive after being attacked.
Again, I'm not saying that the attacks too were not understandable in the situation described in this topic as the web is a harsh place, but then again he's new and it's easy to attack him. CDPR was even getting a lot of support after going back on their word, downgrading Witcher 3 and then making up excuses as if the downgrade happened on its own... I still wonder how people could stand up for them and say things like graphics don't matter and all that (I don't care too much about the graphics, it's the matter of principle in my case), but I digress xD
Anyway, my only point was telling my experience and maybe reminding people that an aggressive reaction is not always the best choice. As it turned out in my case, I gave the dev a chance to prove all the negative hype wrong and he did :)
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Have you perhaps edited your original review? "DEVELOPER IS NOT TO BE TRUSTED!!" seems very antagonistic xD
Anyway, I do understand your point of view when taking into consideration what you've said you're basing your opinion on; I am merely saying that short tempers are often found on the web and almost always result in a far worse outcome than a calm approach would. Politeness and understanding, in my experience (further supported by the case in question) will often lead to a satisfying result.
We are all human and make mistakes, and often, when confronted in an aggressive manner, tend to switch to our fight mode instead of honing up to whatever mistakes might have been made and to which we might have honed up if only the initial response was more calm/polite/forgiving.
Disclaimer xD : This last part is me speaking in general and was definitely not meant as calling you out or anything like that as I find your manner of speaking in this thread most reasonable and calm, especially under the circumstance the way you perceive them
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Oh I was just teasing a bit, I saw that the review's been edited :)
As I said, I was not, at any point, talking about you when I wrote about tempers and reactions. I do find your reaction appropriate for the occasion. As far as I've seen you've not been impolite or abusive or anything to that effect. It's just that the whole situation made me think about people's reactions and how easy it is to make one error into a full-blown disaster.
It was very nice of you to share your opinion and the information, especially as it was based on evidence and not pure emotional response to things that cannot be verified. I just wanted to do the same thing- offer my view of the dev based on personal experience.
I try not to judge people based on how they've treated other people (except in cases when there's no room for discussion and the offense is severe) but rather on how they've treated me as it's the only situation in which I have all the information I need to make an informed opinion. We're talking about rational stuff here, not checking to see if an axe murderer is indeed against sharing his morning coffee with you xD
Anyway, to avoid further digressions (to which I'm getting more prone as my sleepiness gets stronger), I do hope you won't find yourself in such a disappointing situation again :)
It's such a shame when indie devs get a bad rep based on those who are, I hope, exceptions to the rule...
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Ooooh I wanna live where you live if people treat others nicely because they wanna keep their job. No such luck in Croatia xD
You wouldn't believe the egos and the attitudes of people here, the more polite you are to others the more they feel like they can kick you around.
I've never heard that saying but, under the circumstances, it just makes me giggle. You should have seen the waiter in one restaurant when I took out some of my friends for lunch for my birthday... May god help you if you're under 40, dressed casually (but still very appropriately) and have a smile on your face when entering any "mid-level" restaurant xD
One waiter even hit me in the head with his tray "accidentally" because I asked him to bring my mom and me our bill while he was sitting at the bar and smoking. You'd be surprised how much time a polite person who doesn't like getting walked over spends talking to managers and sending complaining emails... xD
That's why I judge people based on how they treat me, and I promise, I'm really really polite and kind when approaching people, no matter their profession.
But, I do know what you mean and agree that it's important to watch how people treat those who are in a "weaker" position. It can tell a lot about a person :)
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Hihihiih, yeah, I know what you mean :)
Maybe we should organize a "hug your waiter" day and see how that plays out xD
Or, maybe, make everyone get a puppy or a kitten? That's guaranteed to make people nicer :D
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Dafuq Luxy? Did you even read the proof? People caught the devs lying. THIS IS NOT A WITCH HUNT. People are right. Thats like you winning something, and you have to ASK for it , to be given to you.
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Have I said that they falsified the proof or that he didn't do what they said?
I just shared my experience, which was quite lovely.
Bear, sweetie, relax ;)
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And that's dumb and had nothing to do with the subject.
"Oh yeah that guy killed thousands, but he was polite with me, so he must be cool'
Your experience was irrelevant ._.
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Only he didn't kill thousands. And its not as if others gave him a chance to be polite. Just, forigve and forget, ya know? He fucked up, anyone can make a mistake. I'm with Luxy, maybe we shouldn't make so much negative hype for him.
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I was an example ._.
And its not as if others gave him a chance to be polite.
Polite about what? My argument was that a positive experience, which was made by contacting personally the dev and he randomly decided to give 1 key away, doesn't change all the proof. It was already proven that he was warned that he could NOT give the keys and he kept announcing it to make his game go through Greenlight, devs used us. And tried to ban every single one that tried to warn or to call out them.
That's a big no-no for me. They made the negative hype by themselves x)
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I believe that his behavior has very much to do with the subject as people are claiming they had to "beg" for the key, while all I did was ask if he would deliver one as I was one of the supporters. Maybe they're over-exaggerating a bit with the whole "begging"? I couldn't say what happened in their case so I shared mine...
Also... Me sharing my experience was "dumb"? You really wanna use words like that when talking to me? You know I'll consider anything you have to say but please try and not be insulting. You know I really don't like that.
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Ok i will do with your way,i will be polite with him,send him friend request and i'll wait to accept it.
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I haven't sent him a friend request, I sent him an email.
Also, I provided the link to my Steam profile so he might check that I indeed was one of the supporters and a member of his group.
I hope you'll have the same pleasant experience as I did. As long as you're polite and show the man some understanding I'm sure he'll be the same to you as he was to me :)
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Check my reply to Venhiem.
Cmon Luxy dont take it to personal. Your input added nothing to the matter. Begging, asking, its the same thing. They should delivered the keys, they knew that they couldn't, kept using the community claiming that they would indeed give keys to make profit on us by making the game go through GreenLight.
Exaggeration has nothing to do with arguments, did you saw people being banned for exposing what they were doing and handing out proofs? Thats not overreacting, that's real.
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I agree with you but lets try with his way :-)
Give him the change that he didnt give to us.
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Eh, I'm not salty or anything, just pointing an argument, there is really nothing we can do about it (:
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Begging and asking is by no means the same thing.
I'm not taking anything personally as it doesn't matter to me at all what anyone thinks about him. I gave my opinion, as did everyone else, and that's all.
You're free to think whatever you want about my input, but calling it stupid is just rude. That's the only thing I had a problem with in your response.
Exaggeration is, in my opinion, also quite important as it borderlines with lying, again, in my opinion.
As I've said before, I'm not about to talk about what happened to others as I do not have the complete view and knowledge of the situation. Mind you, I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with their description of the situation but I prefer to base my opinions on personal experience.
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Ok send him an email yesterday and answer today
Me:Hi,my name is Billy and i am one of your thousand supporter of predator simulator.My steam profile is this
http://steamcommunity.com/id/billy27 you can check it to see that i actually voted for your game when it was still greenlight.I want to test your game thats why i send you this email.If you could send me a key it will be awesome,have a great day.
Thats his answer:
Hi Vikaki,
Thank you for writing to me. I would really like to give you a key but I'm all out at this moment. We are not distributing keys very soon again since more than 500+ keys were given out on the first week. I will keep you updated.
Regards
Sam
Developer @GameIndica.com
He say that he keep me update,well all i have to do is waiting like i'm doing now :P
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Well that was a nice answer. It is so kind of him to answer each of the emails. I know people are probably gonna say he's doing it because he wants something out of it but it's really nice that he isn't just sending out a pre-made reply to, what I'm guessing is a lot, emails like this one that he receives.
He said the same thing to me too about the keys that were given out during the first week, I was probably lucky to get one of the remaining press-copies.
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Maybe if people would stop voting for shit games just because the developer of said shit game promises keys, this wouldn't keep happening.
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LOL what the actual hell, guys? Valve literally forbid him from giving out free keys. What follows is a dude trying to prevent as much entitled rage as possible but everyone just lacks empathy I guess. Sociopaths, if you will...
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Deleting proof he knew he fucked up isn't trying to prevent rage, all that does is stoke it. Plus the several hundred Predator Sim keys given out to giveaway sites in order to garner sales didn't help either...
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Well there's a difference there in my view, he's giving out keys on giveaway sites as a marketing move (like everyone else) while on the other hand he was forbidden from doing so via Steam. Won't go into the whole "cover-up", but I do understand why he's giving them away on giveaway sites.
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I just mentioned the keys because I see it a tad pathetic he could come up with that many for people who never offered him support or criticism, while saying "nope" to those who voted for him. Valve saying "no way" to legit claimants is irrelevant, he could have gotten around that bump. Others have, one way or another.
Like one person suggested, all he had to do was close the GameIndica group to new members and do a 100 key giveaway on here. Problem solved, then all the naysayers could blame would be the randomness of this site and nothing more as he'd have done as promised. But no, why do that... >.<
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He should have, he could have but he didn't...
Honestly, can't be bothered to care anymore.
Came here to describe my experience, did that and that's all from me xD
I've got literally nothing to lose or gain from this discussion and it's getting too tiresome for me. We're just rehashing everything that's been said.
I've got way more serious problems than discussing this; like beating Witcher. That Old Manor is filled with some mean SOB's and I was lazy on the potion-making front. You see? Now that's a problem.. xD
Wish me luck, I'm really gonna need it :D
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"Valve literally forbid him from giving out free keys." Sounds like BS to me, even if it isn't, he should have looked into it before spouting FREE KEYS just to get upvotes.
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Not even suprised. I stopped voting for these type of things a long time ago anyway, all it really does is make Greenlight even worse than it is now. In most cases atleast.
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Didn't see another topic on GameIndica and his crapfest, so figured I ought to post this one.
Pity, since I was gonna buy the game due to how strange it looked. :/
http://www.l45ltd.co.uk/developer-blog/predator-simulator-a-resolution
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