So blacklist him for saying he is first t,but yet you waste a post on telling them they are blacklisted
The irony
I love how the blacklist is just wasted on such sillyness
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they are personal blacklists, i dont really think its "wasted". it only pertains to the personal giveaways we do and people are allowed to not like other people for whatever reason.
If the "first" business bothers people, I think thats valid to blacklist them. If it bothers someone that it bothers someone so much that they feel they should announce the blacklist, that is also a valid reason for someone to blacklist someone else.
If someone did something I found offensive or annoying, I wouldnt have a problem blacklisting them. The same way I would whitelist someone for saying or doing something I like a lot.
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That is fine and your free to do that,i am just saying i think it is funny and a waste
I just chuckled a bit that you blacklisted them for saying first,and you wasted just as much time and space letting them know you blacklisted them .
I am not sure how letting them know they are being blacklisted is not any better then them saying first but it just how i feel.A valid post is also subjective because everyone will have different opinions on what they think is a valid post.
Anyhow i am not mad or not saying you can not or should not do it,i was just sharing what i thought about it,just as you shared you where black listing them.
Though to be honest if i was to blacklist for everything that may have bothered me it would be a huge list lol but i also know for me it just not right to blacklist people just because i do not like what they may post,i reserve it for things like cheating,being rude to others,re-gifters,racism and son
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Did you blacklist your own son?
Also, you're talking to two different persons (or so I think...) - the blacklister and the blacklist defender isn't the same person (again, so I think...).
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I just chuckled a bit that you blacklisted them for saying first,and you wasted just as much time and space letting them know you blacklisted them .
I meant to say they not you,so i understand why it seemed like that was meaning you
Either way i know sometimes what i say may get me back listed and that is fine,i do not blacklist just for being blacklisted though if they are on my white list then i just remove them from that.Anyone who has blacklisted can still enter my GA,if they are black listed it is for other reason like re-gifting and such.
Everyone has the right to black list for whatever they want,and if someone is going to have the right to say they blacklisted someone i should have the same right to say what i think about it.
In any case i will continue to do things the way i like and and those will continue to blacklist me for whatever reason they may have.
On a side note at least i am honest and i do not try be someone i am not so i do not end up on a blacklist i will not change my views or how i feel just so i might not end up on there blacklist.I can also say i have never called anyone names or have been total ass to anyone or re-gifted or been racist or any of that.I know i still might say things that annoy people,that just how life is,i was not put here to please everyone nor will i try,i am me,this is what you get.
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"All trade scams can be avoided.
Well they got you there.
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trade via trading window then the game get revoked because of scammer doing chargeback. How can you avoid it?
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Technically you can, but it isn't feasible: gifts older than about 90 days can't be charged back, depending on the finance service.
Of course, if you're trading for that dope new game that just dropped, you sure the hell are not gonna wait 90 days, so...
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Not trading for it in the first place or only trading with someone trusted for one...
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gifts are tradable after 30 days of purchase. Refunds only during 14 days
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If one callback money payed to steam, that account will get refusal for steam-services. Meaning no more buy, activations etc.
It's not worth it is it?
And as far as I can recall paypal doesn't issue refund for digital goods
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you set up new trading/scamming account, you don't trade/scam this way with one person but multiple people. Then you transfer your earnings out, issue a refund. Your trading/scamming account gets locked but what do you care? It had some few cheap games on it just to validate it, you can ust set up new one and repeat. What's not to be worth here? with 180 days refund policy and 30 days trade block on gifts it still elaves you with ovr 100 days of free scamming.
Paypal don't protect sellers of digital goods but it does buyers (got burned on it myself years ago while selling WoW gold - 2 weeks after big purchase buyer demanded refund and got it granted automatically. Screenies of account transaction history meant nothing - they protect seller only if it was physical good and you have for example package manifest showing that you already sent the goods). Also easy way for any scammer toget money refund on PP is just to claim that purchases were made while account have been hijacked.
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Obviously this doesn't apply to those situations. You will still get your items back if you traded items using trading window and the other guy charged back. This didn't change.
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And steam adding 7day/30day trade restrictions to every damn thing don't help anyone BUT scammers.
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No, like Valve said, if you press trade button on window and the "what you get" window is empty or doesn't have what you want, this is your fault.
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I never understood that part actually. How does adding the bans help the scammer? Mind explaining?
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The scammer will trade with person saying since the gift is trade restricted for x days, that they will send it after they get the tf2 keys/games/skins, and then never deliver, if there were NO trade restrictions, they would be forced to put the items in thier side of the trade window at the start.
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Asking someone to buy a game for you (in return for keys) and telling the person that they will get the keys as soon as the trade ban is lifted would quite simply not fly. Traders would not want to do it due to the risk of the person asking for the game changing his/her mind/disappearing/finding the game cheaper somewhere else and thus refusing to do the trade.
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I didn't get scammed. In this way. I've just known it happend... A LOT.
I was scammed once, and it was a game later revoked because of stolen credit card.
Valve basically broke into my home and took back the game. :D
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How is that still Valves fault that you risked your stuff and lost it?
I still do not get people who want to blame Valve so much sure they have done some stupid shit but in this case they are not in the wrong,your are responsible for your own stuff and trading,why should you not be responsible for getting scammed?
If you can not wait for it to be tradeable that is not Valves fault you where impatient and decided to trade something for nothing and got scammed.
You would not go on Craigslist and say hey here is 1500 for your car i will be back later to pick it up,you come back and it is gone along with the add and such,Is it Craigslist fault that you got scammed because you trusted someone and gave them money without taking possession of said product before left??So how can you blame Valve for you losing your items when they had nothing to do with your transaction the same as Craigslist,it is shipper be ware,for Steam trader be ware.
Valve has not fault because you trusted someone and gave them something for nothing or traded with some random stranger and turned out to be a fraud,it is still not Valve fault because you fail to take simple common sense steps to protect yourself better.
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The point was that, if Valve didn't put a trade-lock on games and items, people wouldn't have to go this route to be able to trade freshly bought items.
I don't know how effective these 7-30 days trade lock are against reducing chargeback frauds, but the only way you can now trade for on-sale items is through unsafe methods. No trader is ever going to keep a game in inventory for 30 days then sell it to you at the same price it was on the sale.The only thing Valve have done with these locks is setting this up so they don't have to help out anymore.
By forcing people to trade outside of the "safe" environment provided by the trade window, they made sure they no longer have to handle request from people who's been scammed. It IS Valve's fault for putting in place a system that forces traders to either do unsafe trades or miss out on deals.
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They are not forcing you was my point,
No where do you agree you have to trade games,you do that on your own,they have put in enough steps to warn people,you can spin the web any way you want but in the end it will still be a web
I get why your saying it,but still does not change the fact they are not forcing because of trade locks.i guess it just easier to blame someone else because you got scammed and risk your items t hen say hey maybe i should have not risked the items and would not lose them
Being scammed is a 2 way street,it takes 2 people get get scammed,and Valve has nothing to do with it because you can not wait to trade or use some common sense
Again they are not forcing you,you do the trading on your own,saying they forced you because you do not to wait,
That is like saying it is my works fault i got a ticket for speeding because my job forced me to speed so i would not be late.
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before that change, valve would reverse the whole trade and give the victim his items back. now they're saying, if you are not willing to wait 30 days, you will take the full risk, and we won't help you anymore in case of scam.
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Yay, Valve deciding to **** over even more people. Really, how do people keep thinking they are perfect?
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They implemented a TON of anti-scamming stuff. I dont see how you can fault them for this of all things. Paid mods, no refunds for their first 10 years, greenlight spam, EA scams and so on, but not this. The fact that they even bothered to reverse trades in the first place was amazing.
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not all scams can be avoided. Chargeback for gift you traded for via trading window cannot be avoided.
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The traders guide's OP says that those are still covered as its not an item/currency/marketable trade scam/hijack. I hope that is the case.
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Well, as usual Steam is being sketchy about it's updated policy. But from the FAQ, it seems even hijacked accounts won't have their items restored because Steam claims it would disrupt the economy and their FAQ already covered all possible kind of trade scams.
So it means if you get hijacked and you lose your items, it's no longer their problem because Steam has its ass covered with their shitty FAQ.
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You can fault them for a chargeback scam, but if your account gets hijacked, you are at fault. I defend people that fall under scams all the time, but if you cant be bothered enough to enable steam guard, and to secure your email, you kind of are asking for it. Its one thing to fall for a clever scam like the screensaver trick that was/is making the rounds, its another matter if you end up having your account phished/hijacked do to incompetence. I mean, gmail and yahoo both have verification steps to login from an unknown device. So to hack my account, you would need to figure out my account name, since it differs from your display name, and my password, lets assume you were given this info outright. You then have to find out my email, and hack my email. Lets say you were given that too. You THEN have to get my phone/secondary email to get logged into my email, so you can verify your login to my steam account.
At SOME point, you have to sit back and let people learn. I had a key scammed from me, once. I didnt sit back and cry to steam, or to geforce or anyone else even when I took every precaution I could and still got scammed. I learned from it, changed my behaviors and continued with my life. You can only bubble wrap the world so much. Its not Valve's responsibility to bail out people that cant follow simple instructions to secure their accounts. IMO if your account gets hijacked, your stuff stolen, the items taken should just be nuked from the market.
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With those scr hijacking, they don't need access to your email or anything at all. It's all done on your pc, not theirs. So it won't ask you for those login authentication, or even your password before it changes the associated email and password.
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Except they do, because you also need to confirm a trade through your email, even if the accounts are 8 years old, the logged in device has never changed, and you constantly trade. Or maybe, only select few traders have to double confirm a trade offer. I know that I sent out a trade offer to my buddy, and I needed to confirm the trade twice, one of which was through my email.
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You and I need to confirm. Yes. They don't.
I speak from experience, when I say that my account was hijacked, and all items put on market automatically in a matter of seconds for lower value, and once my account was empty of items, my steam wallet cash was used to buy something worthless from the hijackers steam account via market. There was not a single confirmation I got. Not when they sold my stuff on market. Not when they changed my email address. Not when they changed my password.
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They can be avoided by not trading,OR trade with people you trust,not random people
I have yet to be scammed since joining TG and getting to know people in chat and only deal with people i know i can trust i also know there is still a risk but i know that trading is a risk no matter how careful you are.
I still think people should be responsible enough to know that trading is a risk,and why blame Steam because you got scammed and you may bot get your items back!?They had nothing to do with your trade with someone else.
I said it before it is no different then say going to a flea market buying something and some how you get some counterfeit money,you go to your bank they discover it,and they keep your money and you end up with nothing.
Sure you still have the right to be pissed but do you blame the bank for taking your money?Is it there fault you have no money because they kept it,you got scammed but they did not return to you good money.So why is Steam at fault for saying your on your own?
In the end the person trading stuff needs to also take responsibility for there actions and the risk of trading items,Stop being pissed at Steam because they have done more then enough to help you not get scammed to say enough is enough and your on your own.
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Exactly! I still remember the first day I worked at a grocery store and a customer came in to tell me they had dropped their wine bottle outside and it broke. I thanked them and started to walk out to clean up glass when they asked if they can get another one for free. I was dumbfounded that the manager said it was cool. Only one single time in the months I was there did somebody say they were responsible and demanded to pay for the product. Naturally I told them to STFU..sigh
We have courts for chargebacks and hijacked accounts. Steam can get you your account back but they shouldn't feel it is their duty to find your tradable items. That's what insurance is for.
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I mean, not only do they automatically block about 90% of websites posted in a chat window, not only do they require a verification code to start a trade, but they also send you an email asking you to verify said transaction. If you go through all of that and still end up scammed... pm me, because Im in desperate need of free money.
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And how is any of this going to prevent the other person from doing a chargeback and your game from being revoked?
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You now can only trade gifts after 30 days after buying it. Isn't 30 days more than enough to a gift to be revoked?
This is not sarcasm, I'm actually asking.
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Depending on the payment method, you can issue a chargeback up to 90 days after the initial transaction.
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This won't affect chargeback issues. You will still be able to get your items back if you traded items through trading window.
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Is there any official word from Valve, or is it just speculations? Because they're certainly not mentioning this in their FAQ.
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This new policy is actually the exact same policy they ever had about scams.
By trading in the trade window you are following their guidelines. A chargeback is impossible to avoid in anyway, so of course it will be possible to get your things back as long you followed the trading rules.
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it would be fair if valve hadn't made trading such a hostile and difficult system now, especially with all the trading lockdowns put in place... how do you expect people to do trades that happen 'entirely in one trading window' when you put a 7day lock on purchases, necessitating a 'you go first' scenario? or a market steam wallet transfer, because an item you want to trade for, cant be traded to you for a week...
dont get me wrong, a lot of people who get scammed are just idiots or flat out not thinking properly, and it shouldnt be everyone elses problem, BUT valve could at least make trading easier again if they've finally thrown up their hands and said 'f*ck it, not helping any more'
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How is a 7day lock on purchases in any way necessitating a 'you go first' scenario? I mean, how do you even land on this (frankly, stupid) conclusion?
The only thing it encourages is for you to say "dude, we will trade next week, when your item thingy is no longer locked" and maybe you used that week to think if this is really a person you want to trade with, if he insist on doing it right now with you giving him the stuff for nothing.
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its a 7 day lock on items and a MONTH-lock on games. traders during a sale will NOT hold a game for you for a month and THEN trade for sale prices, that just doesnt happen in trading... if anyone has a stupid concept on how trading on steam now works these days, it is yourself.
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A strange game. The only winning move is not to play.
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Well, that seems fair enough. Volvo just removes the additional safety wheels from users' bikes.
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IF you get scammed then you must be an idiot,That's my opinion,just saying.
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Many people get scammed daily. Oftentimes they one scamming you are someone you trusted. Happened daily in real life as well.
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Now I wish Steam would do something about those fucking phishing bots.
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like 10% of the people i know on steam have been phished
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I'm talking about those irritating friend requests.
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They did, but sadly enough most of the bots left now are hijacked accounts that still over the $5+ requirement...
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Isnt that what the 5 dollar minimum store purchase per account requirement was rolled out for or has that not been implemented fully yet? If scammers are still rolling out bots in mass with that, then damn, Valve must be making bank.
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Just watch as they will increase it even further to make more money, saying that it is to prevent bots while that doesn't help anybody besides steam's purse.
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Scammers are likely using hijacked accounts instead.
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I haven't received any friend requests after they did what these guys said.
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Ditto, I dont have any large market listings, dont trade, so my profile isnt posted on trading sites, and I was still getting 1-3 bots a day, now I dont get any adds.
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Or "Our support is sick of helping people who doesn't even read an url and can't even write properly".
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Not even a couple of hours of this thread, I get another scam attempt.
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-and if you pressed "Accept", it would be your fault, not Valve's, as they are saying
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How is this a scam? You can clearly see what they want to trade for what you have. If you accept, then thats what you agree is a fair price.
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Well if that's a scam then I don't know what a scam is.
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Everything is a scam when kiddies are trading. "Oh no, I didnt get the best deal in the world, SCAMMER!!" I left the trader's guild for this very reason. You offer a fair price, but people want 50% lower then the lowest sale price, if you dont agree they tell all their friends how you scammed them. Its fucking stupid.
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Internet should not be allowed for people under 18, or lets say 16. Things would be much better.
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i've never been scammed...so if you have been scammed you are doing it wrong
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ya last statement there is full of poop. i recently dealt with support in losing a game that i received from a very high repp person here whom received it from someone else whom received it from someone else and so on. The game was traded like 4 to 5 times before I added to my library, then Let alone the 2 to 3+ monthss it took for Valve to even figure the game was bought with a stolen credit card.
In this case, i consider this a scam, but not on the person whom i originally traded for because am highly sure they did not know as well.
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I think they should label gifts and items with every account that has touched it with a timestamp. With the new restrictions in place, it should be manageable, even for keys that are traded back and forth 200 times a day.
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Also i think people were abusing this, claming that someone scam them but the "scammer" was a friend, so they just dupe items
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Soooooo I suppose the now extra step [clicky clicking the email after the trade window] is considered redundant now?
Since it's only purpose was to protect ya if someone scammed ya
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Always has been redundant because someone can still hijack your email.
And Steamguard code still needs to be accessed via email which is what hijackers need to access your account.
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[Off topic Sorry] But how do they scam people if they just send trade offers ?
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You can still get scammed by chargeback/stolencreditcard purchase, it has happened to me, though I didn't challenge it via steam support, cause steam support has NEVER once resolved any of my many many many support tickets... even a double charge on one of my purchases, they refused to refund me. (aka 1 game twice the price).
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should have told them you were going to charge back both if it wasn't resolved. i've seen others get results with that.
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If you're on the right side, insist. What they did is a robbery for your case.
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He got charged twice for one purchase.
He has every right to contest that.
Wouldn't you if you were in his case? Seriously you'd sit down doing nothing?
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Well, for one thing, that's not what you said, and for another, I suspect he accidentally added it to his cart twice, hit the purchase button twice, or something in which case there's no one else to blame.
But I suppose if they really charged him twice for one item in his cart he should be able to get a refund, but not only is that unlikely, but it's not all you were saying.
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That's what I SAID. You misinterpreted my sentence. Not my problem.
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No, you said it was robbery if they didn't, which is not true, idiot, sheesh.
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Yea retard, keep misinterpreting. Moronic poor people..
You can't purchase same game twice, dimwit.
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What the hell? You realize you said something wrong so you try to avert the attention. And what the hell are you even talking about? Moronic poor people? I'm sorry, I shouldn't laugh since it's not your fault you were born retarded...
But go ahead and keep trying to find ways to go back on what you said earlier, it's funny, but I'm done trying to talk to someone so confused about everything.
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You were the one who got it wrong yet you tried to act as if it was my mistake to begin with. Funny guy. I said Steam robbed him because he paid twice for a single game. That's it. No other meaning.
It was not my fault you misunderstood. This is my last reply to you, though.
Dumbass.
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The trick is to learn your own chargeback rights (as a merchant) and sound as much like a lawyer as possible when you talk to your financial institution about it. They won't want to risk pissing off someone who sounds like a lawyer.
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I guess they're so busy with refund requests they can't handle this type of thing anymore.
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Blah Blah Blah Charge back ..... Blah Blah Blah Stolen Credit Card.
All I can say is if you are greedy, you get scammed,
See a game you want?
Wow the guy selling so cheap, I want it.
But if you trust that random guy, there is always risk involve in this type of trading for cheaper games.
Therefore if you do it, you take a risk and therefore your fault getting scam cause you want it for cheap.
treat everyone with caution to prevent getting scam.
No matter how high his rep for trading is, no one will trade a game or item that is far below its value without hidden intent.
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To be honest, Valve is doing good here. THEY implemented the warnings on the trading window; THEY implemented the email verification step; THEY put in the coding and all the work and now it's up to the user to not be a stupid idiot. They shouldn't waste their time with this anymore; if you get scammed at this point through the trading window, it's your own damn fault.
That being said, I'm reading through this thread and I'm getting a little confused. Can someone explain to me what a "chargeback" is?
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Damn son, finally.
Maybe steam support won't be overflooded with idiots getting scammed and asking for their items now.
Hopefully with the reduced workload the overall quality of the support also raises.
Changes are very-very welcome.
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It'll still be flooded with those idiots, but at least now Valve will have a faster way of dealing with this by simply linking them to the terms page instead of wasting hours and days and months on investigating who traded what for what and why and what happened and who is really at fault.
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Scammers are annoying, but if there's a way for them to scam you, then you just don't do it. You wouldn't trade someone first and then wait for them to trade their items back to you, you wouldn't trade partial items first and then trade the rest for the actual item and you wouldn't trade items on Steam for real money on paypal of something, but if you would do any of these things, it's your own fault if you get scammed, it's your own stupidity that let you participate in these trades no matter how trustworthy the other person is. Might as well give them your password to your email and your Steam account so that they'd perform the trade themselves and then wonder why you can't login to your Steam account.
From what I read in this thread, chargeback is still an issue, in which case you also shouldn't trade for gifts, you're risking the same kind of thing as with any other types of scams, as long as it's not secure you shouldn't do it. Someone said it has to be 90 days old or more, so wait for that and don't trade for gifts that are newer than that. They already put in a restriction to not be able to trade a gift for 30 days after purchasing it, so I don't get why it takes that long to confirm the funds of some purchases.
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To all of those who call the victims of scamming idiots, I take it that you've never actually seen a "skilled" scammer in action? While I've never been scammed, I've come across plenty of scammers, and had I not already been a somewhat experienced trader, I would probably have fallen for them. It's not always obvious who is a scammer and who is not. Sure, if you run into someone saying "I will give you GTA V, just give me 2 keys", then that is a clear scammer, but if that person was offering you GTA V for a reasonable price, and acting professional about it, then it would be far less obvious.
Also consider the fact that there are a lot of younger users on Steam. They are prime targets as many of them simply don't know what a scam looks like.
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Valve never did return scammed items.
Only hijacked items and only once.
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as a victim of a chargeback scam, I can tell you that you're wrong. I had all my items returned.
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Actually they did. Once I had the issue of someone charging back a gift I bought for a friend and I was able to contact support and get what I traded for it back.
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I don't think they would do it again twice. Perhaps it was one time customer gesture.
Saw someone had that happened twice to him and he said Support denied his 2nd request.
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Updated FAQ
Trader's Guild
Just another normal scamming day on Steam.
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