Hello Community!

EDIT: Here is a better poll made by user NB264 that differentiates between gross and net income and funds available to buy things.

Many times when I read the forums I am puzzled by some statements. I always raise my eyebrows when someone says "I have no money to buy this bundle this month" or "I am selling cards to have the money to buy games".
The first thought in my head is always: "How is it possible to not have ~5 Dollars to buy a bundle? How? Even with social welfare there is enough money left to save this small amount of money per month."

But then the second thought kicks in: "Oh, wait, we're a global community and I can't convey the standards in my country to other countries. I have to remember that there are a lot of countries where money is scarce, wages are low, inflation is high etc."
So with this second thought I am always able to understand the problems and not judge them or the people in those situations.

Nevertheless, I wonder: How high is your monthly income, fellow SGers? ("The income of a person is therefore the sum of all of his earnings.")
To make it all comparable lets only use USD as a currency.

Cheers.

Edit: I now realize that this poll is not set up correctly and I should be more strict in the description, focusing on disposable income aka "money to spent or to save per month". But I can't change the poll now since there are already votes.
Maybe someone else will create a new thread with better wording to have more precise knowledge of the financial situation of most SGers.

1 week ago*

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How high is your monthly income in US Dollars?

View Results
< 100
100 - 250
250 - 500
500 - 1000
1000 - 1500
1500 - 2000
2000 - 2500
2500 - 3000
3000 - 4000
4000 - 5000
5000+

397.11 USD from serving the army :\

1 week ago
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Not bad, I get 100€ (~115$) for serving time ATM (Private for appro. 5 months)

1 week ago
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I was confused at first, because "serving time" means "to spend time in prison" XD

1 week ago
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1 week ago
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Yeah, if you're a junior soldier in the British army or maybe an E1 private in the US army you get that much but if you're a lieutenant in the Chinese army you get less than $500/month, same if you're a soldier in the Indian army.
edit: previous comment was deleted but he claimed that the lowest wage in the army is ~1600 USD...guess he figured out that there are more non-Americans out there than Americans :-)

1 week ago*
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I am glad you included an option for "less than $100/month."

1 week ago*
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I know that some or even many eastern european countries are really poor since either the collapse of the former UDSSR or the collapse of former Yugoslavia, so I deliberately included that option.
There are many families living in these countries that earn in a year what I earn in a month :-/

1 week ago
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Even minimum wage is usually around 200€ in post-Soviet countries, with maybe Moldova and Ukraine being an exception. Under 100 USD income for an average person is more of a thing in Africa and some parts of Asia. And Venezuela, but when your official currency is toilet paper, that is relatively normal.

And for kids, naturally, which seems to be the major demographic of this site. :P

1 week ago
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Russia and Belarus too but not a single one is lower than 100€ after taxes. OP is definetly worrying about the wrong countries. And honestly as someone from former Yugoslavia I feel slightly insulted by the "really poor" implication.

1 week ago*
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I think it is obvious that I did not want to insult you.
Considering the former yugoslavian countries I took a sneek peak at this list before I posted my comment.

1 week ago
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I know and I never said that you did, but it does feel insulting to read when it is far from the truth.

If you want to talk wages you should have looked at either this or this which it would have told you that nobody with a full time job should be making less than 100€, let alone $.

1 week ago
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Belarus

agree, as someone who knows many people from Belarus, in capital (Minsk) most my friends work for €500-1000, and if I ask friends from smaller cities (like Gomel, Brest or Pinsk) - most of them get €200-500, but not <€100. I believe that €100 you will rather get in Ukraine, cause thousands people from this country works in Russia, Canada and Poland.


Average income around the world (not sure if this is 100% correct data) - https://www.worlddata.info/average-income.php

1 week ago
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Belarus

Woops my bad, neither me not my phones auto correct caught on the mistake, fixed now.

Even in Ukraine minimum wage should be over 100€ according to the data. How actually true it is I guess someone from there should say (every single Ukrainian I know doesn't live there anymore so I can't ask any of them :/).

I guess this data should be pretty accurate for average in Europe at least.

But yea either way you are not gonna get wages under 100$ in Europe already when you are looking at minimal ones, let alone averages.

1 week ago
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Moving to Monaco today! ^^

1 week ago
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You're in Slovenia, you're basically "not former Yugoslavia" in the sense OP meant. In Serbia, Macedonia, Bosnia, even Montenegro, many people work for $150-200 a month net wage (let's say... cashiers in stores, newsstands, gas pumps and so on, not to mention construction worker and other blue collar jobs).

1 week ago
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Yea I am very well aware than the rest of ex-Yugoslavia doesn't get anywhere as high wages as we do (Croatia is not that far of). I guess it is more of an annoyance that we are always bunched together with the rest and ridiculed even tho we are doing just fine. I guess I should not even complain because I am living a comfy life but I can't help that it gets on my nerves when people go "oh how it is to live there" implying that it is a shithole that probably doesn't even have electricity, running water or internet. I just had someone surprised that fiber is a thing here the other week and happens way way too often in general.

/rant

And before someone takes me the wrong way : no, I am not implying the rest of ex-Yugoslavia is a shithole, just saying that we are lucky and better of than the rest. Blah fuck, I should have not started with this in the first place anyways.

1 week ago
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Yeah, we are "in a shit hole" in a way, but in the other way, have faster broadband than most of the USA so... whatyagonnado?

1 week ago
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... but in the other way, have faster broadband than most of the USA so... whatyagonnado?

First-world problems, eh? )

On a more serious note, there are plenty of places that don't have electricity, running water or internet that offer a decent living. When I think of current "hell-holes," I think of places like Caracas, Venezuela (where walking down the street can get you killed), or Damascus (which remains a war zone). From my point of view, anywhere you can work to acquire food, shelter, and clothing without the constant fear of being murdered is an "OK" place to live.

1 week ago
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Oh I agree, was just talking in a context of what MouseWithBeer said, compared these countries to Slovenia.

1 week ago
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I know some mostly-unemployed people who make less than $100/month in the US. And then their disposable income is far less.

1 week ago
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~1750 $ (electrical engineer)

1 week ago
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Avatar - job match

1 week ago
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That is some German-type joke over there lol.

1 week ago
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And my steam name: Socket :)

1 week ago
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To be fair, when you ask others for their monthly income, you have to state what's your monthly income, first. See, money is a delicate topic to discuss.

Mine is around 200 USD, so yes, buying a $5 bundle can be a great deal for some, considering that there are hundreds of problems that can be fixed or temporarily patched with those $5.

And then (speaking only for myself here), there's a catch: The other day, i bought a couple of $2 bundles solely for giveaways to the community, i've read so many and such rude and elitist comments about trash games and trash donators (!?) that made my whole effort unnecessary.

1 week ago
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2$ bundles are a lot on a 200USD income (not ironic) ! :o
Thanks a lot for the effort you did !

1 week ago
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Not sure if you're kidding about it, i hope you aren't.

1 week ago
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I don't, i'm serious (i mean, i know it's a real effort you do compared to your needed expenses and money you earn).

Myself i play games from tremor, pocket money, trading with friends combination.
Trading with friends helps a lot because i don't have a credit card and some website just accept credit cards.

To be fair, in real life i don't need to pay the living expenses. I don't have a car or holidays but don't feel the need because i love videogames more than a car or holidays in fact.

1 week ago
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You can have my blue heart, for starters. 😊
I'm sharing my living expenses too, that's a relief. But since we are obliged to cut all paying outdoor activities, we are happy to afford a couple of $ per month for a bundle, and a couple more for some movies and tv series.

1 week ago
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Yes i guess there is really not much remaining in the end in your situation !

Thank you for the blue, i 💙 you back too ! :D

1 week ago
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The poll is anonymous, no one should feel the need to post their actual income in this thread.

1 week ago
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Yeah sure, what i meant is you might get more honest answers if you open up yourself first.
I don't mind chatting about my income, others do mind and react strangely offended. 😉

1 week ago
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Sorry to hear about your run-in with elitist assholes, those can really ruin one's day.

View attached image.
1 week ago
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Thank you, yeah it can drastically lower your morale for a day or two. 😸

View attached image.
1 week ago
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for some reason I just love that gif

1 week ago
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Damn, if I were on $200 budget I wouldn't think about buying stuff solely for giveaways.
Heck, I forgot to make Birthday Train, but then Humble isn't really helpful with it, making unappealing non-monthly bundles so I don't really have any spares to give :( Maybe in the evening I'll dig something from older bundles...

I salute you.

1 week ago
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It is wrong to "look down" on what someone is generous enough to give, and I try to remind other people of that. Unfortunately, not every person was raised properly, and some individuals have an inflated sense of entitlement. I am sorry you have to deal with that kind of behavior.

1 week ago
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Wow, I'm sorry to hear that you got nasty comments about your giveaways. I don't get why people would do that. I mean, if the giveaways don't interest you, just move along. There's no reason to write a nasty comment.

$5 could be a lot out of a $200 monthly income after you factor in rent, food, utilities, and other expenses.

1 week ago
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I pull off between $200-500 most months. I for once, appreciate your effort.
I don't feel able to afford buying stuff solely for giveaway purposes and it's hard to part with leftovers even ;p
Tell'ya what, someday (and I'm fairly certain it will actually happen) Imma scrub my keys file clean and do one big SG caravan.

And hey, I spend pretty much more than I earn on costs of living, despite sharing said costs. It ain't a country for living things.

4 days ago
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Going back to school soon, and only doing art commissions on the side so probably <$200.

1 week ago*
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Ohhh i always thought that u are a working adult xD

1 week ago
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Nah, not just yet, the working part.
If I have money to spend, it's usually partly because I earned it from working on commissions.
Took gap years from school so I'm older than most people who're in school, but I don't look like I'm that old.

1 week ago
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Enjoy! (I'm serious. Learning can be fun, depending on topic and teachers--I hope you get good teachers!)

1 week ago
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Learning can be fun depending on whether you learn useful things on your own or have to endure having your time stolen by sheeple futilely attempting to indoctrinate you to their screwed up ways and generally being obnoxious, you were meaning thar~? ;]

4 days ago
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About $1170 for doing nothing, even with everything costing much more here than in most countries, there's plenty left to buy and gift couple bundles now and then.

1 week ago
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doing nothing

What flavor of nothing? :3

1 week ago
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Unemployed kind. About half goes to rent and bills for 2x 100mbit nets.

1 week ago*
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The hell do you do with "2x 100mbit"? :D
Two separate connections?

1 week ago
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Home and mobile 27€ total per month.

1 week ago
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There is the specific situation of children too. I mean, there are probably a lot of children or teenagers on Steam.

1 week ago
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Technically I have €0/$0 income as I don't have a job anymore this study year. Am a Dutch student lucky enough to be in the old system so I'm kinda state-'sponsored' (and parents also give a monthly contribution) so I can take care of everything and be comfortable enough and occasionally buy a bundle if it interests me.

1 week ago
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lucky enough to be in the old system

What changed? When I last checked >10 years ago there was state sponsorship readily available to people with NL nationality (while other EU citizens had heavy restrictions, I think a minimum and/or maximum of work hours?), and study fees of perhaps 1.5k€ per year?

1 week ago
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Well for me 4 years are a gift (about 18k of 'debt') + this extra year I am doing because it's in education which is heavily wanted etc etc, but for the new students it's all a loan they have to fully pay back

1 week ago
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Right now I have nearly no income, as a student. But I usually work in summer, so I have some saving.

1 week ago
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I work in IT so I earn way above the average for my country but I can see someone earning minimum wage (400USD for full time job) struggling to buy 5-10$ bundles, especially if you consider cost of living in bigger cities where rent alone for a small flat is usually this 400$, and for a single room for one person it is 133-213$. And we still consider people working full time - what if someone is a student and can work only weekends? Or a minor who only gets money from parents? Ok still most of people could afford a single bundle, but not really all bundles they may want - so when they say they are not spending 5$ on sth it doesn't necessarily mean they do not have even 5$ but they may have little and decide to wait for sth better for this price if they can only afford one thing.

1 week ago
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so when they say they are not spending 5$ on sth it doesn't necessarily mean they do not have even 5$ but they may have little and decide to wait for sth better for this price if they can only afford one thing.

I'm a lot more comfortable with spending on leisure now than I was a few years ago so whilst this doesn't apply to me so much now I've definitely been there before. If you've only got $5 set aside for games you pretty much have to hold out for the best deal you can rather than just buying the first bundle to come along.

1 week ago
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in those situations, you definitely look for the most product or hours of product per dollar.

1 week ago
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Cost of living is a huge factor, one which this survey doesn't cover. As the average income of a place goes up, so does the amount of money needed to live there. Imagine the rent on that one-room flat you live in being $2000 USD per month. And no, the increase in price does not equate to an increase in the standard of living.

[Edit: Looks like jbondguy007 addressed this while I was writing this reply.]

1 week ago
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yeah, I fully realize that- that's why I said 'especially if you consider cost of living' ;) I know what you are talking about first hand, from myself in the past, fromk my friends and family etc - minimum wage in Poland did grow up significantly - over 25% in last decade, but at the same time cost of living (especially in bigger cities) grew up 2-3 times. And these are the very same flats with the same standard as 10 years ago. When I moved out from my parents for 3 years I was renting a small 2 rooms 32m2 flat and paying 133$ to owner (plus all bills, additional 130-150$), then after 3 years it went up to 160$ then 200$ for the same flat, then for 2 years I was renting a separate room and then finally moved in with my fiancee - we rented basically identical flat, in a block down the same street, metrage is identical, standard is identical, heck it should even be cheaper because we moved in with our own furniture. And what is the cost? 425USD + bills (additional 160-200$). Twice as much for identical flat in identical standard. I know people who are adult, graduates, moved out from their parents years ago, yet they are renting flats with big groups of friends - like 5-6 people in 3 bedrooms, because not only their salaties is not enough to rent a flat, sometimes it's not even enough to rent your own room if you still want to have money left for food, petrol, clothing etc.

1 week ago
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That is the problem with arbitrarily setting a "minimum wage." The influence of the Free Market is so powerful that raising the "floor" simply raises the cost of living.

1 week ago
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I gotta disagree, these processes are much more complex and dependant on many more factors than simple 'oh, it's because you set minimum wage!' - if it was so simple like you say the result of rising minimum wage would be rising cost of living by 25%, not by 100-200%. Also the cost of living started to skyrocket before the minimum wage was raised (actually it got raised 2-3 years after, after it came to such ridicculous situations that 2 people working full time were not able to rent a single room for themselves). Main reason why cost of living in big cities skyrocketed here is not minimum wage but sudden raise in wages in a few sectors, without raise in most of economy. After PPoland joined EU and opened market a lot of IT and financial companies outsourced work to PL, we became sort of outsourcing centre for EU, as a result of that salaries in IT and banking doubled in just a few years, while salaries in most of economy remained the same. But as more and more companies from the west kept opening their branches and new companies started creating studios strictly to be an outsource force more and more specialists from this few specific fields started migrating to big cities, cities demographics changed (when I moved to my city it was student-city, most of rental here was targeted on students from 3 big universities and few minor schools, nowadays, cheap student rental market is less than 25%, while over 60% is market for specialists migrating after work), landlords started to raise prices for this influx of people who can pay more, but as salaries in most of fields remained the same it pushed out economically a lot of people from rental market. Without raise in minimum wage rental prices would keep gfrowing anyway, while less and less people would be able to afford anything. So like I say - it's a complex process, in a stable economy like US, where all the fields are stagnated for years - yes, rising minimum wage there could probably result in all salaries going up and cost of living going up accordingly, but smaller still developing economy where just one or very few fields suddenly explodes is totally different system and economical situation compared to stagnated US market.

1 week ago
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I gotta disagree, these processes are much more complex and dependant on many more factors than simple 'oh, it's because you set minimum wage!' - if it was so simple like you say the result of rising minimum wage would be rising cost of living by 25%, not by 100-200%.

The first part of what I wrote is true, but does not apply in the situation you describe. The second part of what I wrote is also true, and your description of events would seem to provide evidence for it. As you say, human activity is always complex and dependent upon many different factors. Studying it, therefore, is a matter of identifying patterns of behavior (i.e. "cause and effect") within the ever-changing sea of minute details (i.e. "background noise"). If successful, it is then possible to describe something that is complex using simple terms. One example is that of "increasing demand raises prices."

In the situation you describe, the cost of living went up because the "floor" was raised by the suddenly-changing demographics. If left alone, the economy would have eventually found its equilibrium, but that would have taken years and there would probably have been much suffering and disruption in the meantime. Instead of waiting for the minimum wage to be set by The Market, those in charge of the economy decided to raise it by decree. It is hoped that they did not set it too high.

... in a stable economy like US, where all the fields are stagnated for years - yes, rising minimum wage there could probably result in all salaries going up and cost of living going up accordingly...

heh... We were just talking about how people who do not live in a country have little understanding of what it is really like. The U.S. is not as your description would seem to imply. Think of us as a very large "European Union," with each State being a different country. The same things which affect you affect us, only on a different scale. And, as far as I am aware, none of our "fields" are stagnant. You may have intended to say "entrenched," but even then, there are no guarantees when it comes to Economics. Even things like Manufacturing and Farming are affected by circumstance.

1 week ago
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agree with most of what you said in first paragraphs with one big exceltion - the "floor" wasn't raised, the floor remained the same (until raise of minimum wage, but like I said, it was reaction, not causation), what suddenly was raised was the "ceiling" as well as population proportion, first differences between small group of population - specialists from specified fields and vast majority, being everyopne else includfing not only the poorest people but also most of middle class, changed dramatically in short time, then because of that mass migration of these specialists towards biggest cities happened changing population proportion. As amount of housing remained about the same this shift in population proportion caused the "ceiling" pushing out "floor" from the rental market, while floor still remained the same.

as for 2nd part - like you said, probably chose my wording poorly, as as you know english is not my first language and I'm mostly self-taught ;) I also didn't mean that US is fully "entrenched" (hey, I just learnt new word! :D:), but it's much more like that comp[ared to developing economies of Europe not to mention other countries in the word, your economy is more stable, that's all what I meant. I do not want to imply it's the best in the world etc (quite contrary, personally I view a lot of elements of your economic and social system to be extremelly flawed), still due to pure weath of the country overall it will be much more stable in many aspects compared to most of (if not almost all) developing and undeveloped markets.

But now we're entering really high level economics discussion, something that for once does not really fits this discussion, and more importantly, due to my langueage level I don't really feel capable in discussing, as I never dealt with even semi-pro levels of economics discussion or professional articles written in english I will probably be simply incapable of expressing my thoughts in a right way, which will prolly lead to misunderstandings (like it did with "stagnant" - as it's simply the word we use for it in my language, we're getting into phrases, something which is difficult to navigate in a field you have no langueage experience in).

1 week ago
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There are a lot of factors that would need to be included in order to truly understand a person's financial disposition - monthly income doesn't matter much if your monthly spendings are steeper than your income, or at least very close. It leaves room for no mistake in your finances, and since unexpected incidents and expenses can and often will happen, many will feel insecure about spending money for entertainment when it could save them some trouble down the line.

In addition to that, I don't think that comparing income, even when converting to USD, will tell much at all. What in one country is a lot may be very little in another country after conversion. Economics are definitely more complicated than a simple numbers comparison - is food expensive? Rent? Is everything cheaper, but your wage much smaller as well? Then there's the possibility of multiple people living on a single person's wage, families, etc...

It's an interesting question to ask yourself, but not an easy one to get answers to due to the fact that you'd need a bunch of information and analysis of said information before reaching a clear conclusion, in my opinion. At most you'll know how much a bundle is valued, but not if they can spare said amount.

1 week ago
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True dat, but how could I have included all these thoughts in a single poll? :-P I was just curious in the numbers for monthly income, that is all :)

1 week ago
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You could ask about disposable income that's left after all the expenses.

1 week ago
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^this :>

1 week ago
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Well, I can't change it now after the first answers are in. I leave this task to you and a new thread :)

1 week ago
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Yeah, that's very different. Someone might be earning $100 net a month but keeping all 100 because they live with wealthy parents... and someone might be earning $2000 and spending it all on frugal life in NYC for example and having maybe $30 a month to spend on fun/games.

1 week ago
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I should have done that, true

1 week ago
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Glad I didn't have to type this myself. :D

Living costs in germany (especially Berlin) raised a lot the last few years. Rent alone almost doubled within 7 years in some parts of Berlin and the average salary didn't raise as much within the same timeframe.
Even with possiby earning quite well compared to others on SG I still got to feed the whole family all on my own so I actually often end up having less disposable income left than others (sometimes even none ignoring the fact of my yearly HB subscription which I pause every now and then).

1 week ago
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I guess this is what people living in the first world want to believe.
Do you really think 25$ in somewhere can be better than 1000€ in anywhere?

Not to mention a lot of things are either the same price or more expensive in poor countries. For example: Imports (since they are not developed countries pretty much everything is imported), plane tickets, tech products, computers, cars, travelling abroad, bundles :) etc

Yeah the rent and labor is cheap for sure. Being poor also eliminates all other options to get out of that poverty. I don't think many people would stay where they live if they had the option. That's the real unfairness of this sh*t if you ask me.

****Before being misunderstood let me be more clear. 1000€ or 1000$ is good money anywhere, 100$ might be good in only poor countries. This limits your options a lot if you ever think of buying any imports or getting out of that country for any purpose.

1 week ago*
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...1000€ or 1000$ is good money anywhere...

Not necessarily. People need food, shelter, and clothing. When their ability to afford even those three things is limited, they are considered impoverished, even at the $1000 per month level.

People from other countries often assume that crushing poverty does not exist in the U.S. True, it is possible to relocate so as to escape one's current situation, but relocating when you have almost nothing is difficult, and it is not a simple matter to find work when you have no home. The truly poor in the U.S. tend to flock to the big cities, but that is a major mistake. The cost of living in such places is very high, the assistance is very limited, and the opportunities are very few. The result is that such people often remain homeless.

1 week ago*
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It doesn't have to be exactly 1000$.
What I was trying to say 1000$ > 25$ for everywhere in the world. This gives you a lot more options. Whatever you have as savings will have some actual value in somewhere else as well.

I think most people know about the poverty in the US. But I see more people from the first world countries who don't understand what it is like being from underdeveloped countries. A lot of people think, if the wages are lower then everything will be cheaper. And it'll balance out in the end. This is a huge misconception.
The reality is; as you get poorer and poorer your standards of living will get lower as well. You will have to live a life you won't even think about in rich countries. If you want to live only on food, shelter and clothing (which are also at low standards) I wouldn't call that living tbh.

1 week ago
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I agree when you say that $1000 is more than $25. My point was that your options are not necessarily greater in number if you're making $1000 a month. When food, shelter, and clothing cost you $1000 a month, you don't have anything left over for things like healthcare, entertainment, transportation, and et cetera.

You will have to live a life you won't even think about in rich countries.

What kind of life do you imagine I won't ever think about? I live in a "rich country" and have found myself being forced to choose between eating and being able to get to work. (I chose getting to work, of course. Keeping my job enables me to afford food, even if there's none for today.) Thank God, I am not currently that poor, but you seem to have no idea what some of us Americans are forced to "think about." I admit, the longest I've ever gone without food was only three days, but that does not mean I lack compassion for those who have even less than I do.

1 week ago*
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Actually in my experience, people who had no idea about the life in poor countries were from Western Europe, where your life is secured by the government even if you don't do anything. As I said some people think, life is pretty much the same anywhere since if you are poor then everything is also cheaper which is a big misconception.

Well let's say you can "imagine" but you won't think you would ever live like that. There's a video linked in this thread by another SG user. Also the site they show the photos in the video is: http://lectures.dollarstreet.org/
At very low income levels, you'll see people living as if it's the middle ages. With no access to the current tech, using ancient things to survive and living in extreme poverty, that kind of life is unimaginable to most people from the developed world.

In that video you can see, people, no matter where they are from, can live in similar looking places and use similar products, have similar living standards. What determines their living standards is not where they live but how much their income is. Sadly, in most cases your income is closely related to where you live.

I'm sorry to hear that you had bad experience with poverty while living in the first world. I'm not here to have a competition over who had the worst experience, who is poorer or who understands the poor better. I just hear that "In poor countries, life is also cheaper" cliché phrase a lot and wanted to elaborate on it. I don't think I ever experienced poverty to that extent but I don't live in a first world country. I know how being from a developing country can limit your life choices. So I can imagine it will get only worse as you go to a poorer country.

1 week ago
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It seems to me that we are in agreement. Wherever you are in the world, poverty exists, and it is never fun. Those who have not experienced it have a difficult time understanding it, and those who have suffered it do not forget it easily. As you mentioned, a majority of people in "first-world countries" are pretty clueless about life outside of their "world," but that seems to be true of humanity as a whole. People understand their own living situation, but their ideas about other places are often based upon fantasy and conjecture. To really understand what it is like to live in a particular place, you really need to experience it for yourself. Failing that, one can at least spend time with people who have lived in that area and thereby get a rough idea of what it is like.

I know how being from a developing country can limit your life choices.

Well, there are always "limits" to one's choices in life, but in my experience, the true limits of a person's choices are largely determined by his imagination and his persistence. Most people who are "stuck" in an environment are still there because they cannot imagine themselves living somewhere else and do not have the drive to do so. There are countless people who have come from similar backgrounds to the "stuck" people, yet they have relocated and begun new lives for themselves. Not only are human beings amazingly adaptable, they also have astounding potential. It is just that most of us are too frightened of the unknown. It is much less scary to stay in the life we know, dealing with the problems with which we are already coping, than it is to leap into that with which we are unfamiliar.

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Where I live, you would either need more than a couple roommates, or would be homeless if 1k per month is what you made.

1 week ago
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I live in a third world country, work 8 hrs a day, 6 days a week in a photo studio (doing almost everything).
I get payed around 25$ a month.

1 week ago
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damn, that's harsh... did you consider freelancing over the internet? 25$ is an amount really easy to beat - especially if by doing almost everything in this photo studio you also mean photo-editing, if you are good with photo-editing software you could earn several times as much as you do now with several times less work. Heck 5 small projects 5$ each, editing 5 photos and you have the very same 25$.

1 week ago
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Yes I actually did consider, but since I live in Iran, and it is in a complete boycott by USA, we don't have any access to national banks, so no paypal,master card etc. for us.
I also bought lots of my steam games by boosting games and getting paid in steam wallet for an online friend.

1 week ago
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damn' that's too bad, I didn't consider the fact that there are countries with such embargos, but you are right, now I remember having a similar conversation on sGG some time ago with a Syrian user (thou this copnversation was about him not being able to purchase anything) and he also got cut from all forms of western monetary options :/ well best of luck to you then, I hope you will be able to find some solution in the future.

1 week ago
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heck actually while writing last comment I just thought about not one but two solutions ;p
first - what is Iran stand on using VPN? I know that Iran is heavilly censoring internet, but are they pursuing you for using VPNs or is it acceptable? If you can use VPN you would be able to at least set up things like PayPal account or other money-transfer accounts, even if you are unable to directly withdraw money, and as for withdrawal here comes 2nd solution...
second - bitcoin (or any other cryptocurrency) - quick google told me that Iran not only is not punishing for use of cryptocurrencies but is one of the very first countries to officialy recognize them - so you could theorethically do a remote work and accept money to PP account or any other platform using VPN , then use this money to purchase bitcoin (or other cryptocurrencies) and then exchange this bitcoin for rali.

1 week ago
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Or just get paid in bundles to cut out middle-men.

1 week ago
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if someone is earning 25$/month I guess being able to get more actual money is more important than getting bundles themselves ;p Also if he would be able to set up PP he could purchase bundles himself using it ;)

1 week ago
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Of course, that was just related to SG. Altho I hear that you can also trade the bundles for profit :)

1 week ago
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I think I can consider bitcoin, I've got to look up for it and see some places if it can be useful for me.
VPNs are a must-have thing if we want to use internet here, and about using it to use paypal, I believe it is against the rules, and if they ever find out (which they commonly do) they just ban your ID and seize all of your money too.

1 week ago
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yeah, of course it's against their rules, but well - so is for example having multiple PP accounts and a lot of people do have these ;p I'm not saying it's legal (from their TOS standpoint) solution, just saying it's a possibility ;) Ofc it is possible to just find work where someone would directly pay you with bitcoins, but you will find it much easier if you offer multiple paypal options, remember that most of your employers are not tech savvy people and will have no idea how bitcoin works, so they will just instead of hiring you find other contractor who will accept PayPal ;) As for VPN - that's why you shouldn't use Public VPN but get a good paid private VPN as soon as you get some money - this way your PP account will be much more secure and less likelly to get banned (still, you baing Iranian should not keep large amounts of money on it anyway, best case exchange into BTC and eventually your local currency as soon as you save up a little more and continue doing so. This way even if you end up banned you won't lose most of your money ;)

Best of luck to you!

1 week ago
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PayPal is problematic, they often require real-world information (Social Security number, Passport copy, ect.) just to open an account. And they automatically detect which country you're from.

1 week ago
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I've created 3 PayPal accounts so far, never was asked for any documents, and even with unverified account you can accept money, thou there are limits to it, but even verification should be doable, one verification I did with bank transfers, which would not work in this case, but two others were did with prepaid cards, which should be doable.

That being said I do live in non-restricted country, whenever I accessed PP it was also always from other non-restricted countries, so it may as well be the case of them not giving a damn because my case was not suspicious enough to demand any real-world proofs. And I do believe that stuff like that can be asked, had no problems with PP ever, but when I was setting up Revolut not only did they requested me to verify separately with bank transfer and card but also demanded photos of two different documents and then for me to take a selfie to prove it's me on these documents...

1 week ago
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I might be dead wrong here.

I remember wanting to open a second PayPal account a few months ago, and they demanded an IRL proof of who I am (and basically saying 1 person is forbidden from having 2 accounts). So I just dropped it.

Might be related to the country I live in... not sure...

EDIT: Just checked it. From the US, you need US Address and Phone number (mandatory). From my country you also need Date of birth, Nationality and ID number.

1 week ago*
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for my country you need Name, Surname, address, email and phone number, and that's all, if you want to be able to use 'Send money to" function you also need bank account or card to verify your account. And as for address - never received any real-life mail from PP, heck adress associated with my main account is my mom's house, where I don't live for 13 years ;) So like I said - it's probably doable. Not saying it's not against their Terms of Service - it obviously is, same as having multiple accounts you mention and which I'm well aware of, but having something in ToS is one thing, but whether what's in ToS is enforced or not is totally different.

I'd say it's worth a try, worst case scenario he will not be able to create account, all he will waste is a little bit of time, no real risk here ;)

1 week ago
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PS - if you wanted to create 2nd PP account because you wanted different adress / account name, for example sounding more professional, you can set up secondary address/account-name within your original account ;) multiple accounts are really needed only if you want to break ToS on various platforms, for example buying more than maximum number of purchases avaiable on account, or registering a few accounts on some platform ;)

1 week ago
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I may be misunderstanding here, but if a photo studio also implies digital software and not just a physical building, do you do any design work in Adobe software?

1 week ago
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I'm good with adobe photoshop, but don't have much experience with designing

1 week ago
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145 usd a month ... working as a doctor

1 week ago
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Did you ever think of moving? You are a doctor, you are very valueable

1 week ago
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It's not that easy. You cannot simply move to another country and work as a doctor, you need your degree officially recognized by local universities.

Nostrification of a university degree in a developed country can be extremely costly for someone making $145 a month.

1 week ago
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everything i wanted to say

1 week ago
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Well, that was something I didn't know about, thanks for explanation :)

1 week ago
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Not just costly, they might never accept it at all. You might be forced to be a nurse (not bad in itself, but if you worked as a doctor for years/decades it is not great) or something completely unrelated. People in "target" countries often don't realize it's not as easy as picking things up, buying a plane ticket and enjoying your new life.

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That isn't true in more than a few countries.

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To add to what ryuga has said, what you studied in one country may not work for the patient jn another country due to difference in living condition, economy, climate, and population history of medication. That's why unlike many other discipline, medicine degrees have limited transferability between countries.

1 week ago
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in summer time around 500 as an artist and in winter about 2300 with 10 hours a day 6 days a week in a ski resort ...

1 week ago
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Around 1500 a month after taxes, working in IT (sysadmin).

1 week ago
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good to know prices are like that, I'm studying that speciality and in two years I should star working outside.

1 week ago
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I've been unemployed and leeching off my parents for the past two years... so $0.
I did resume college so I'd like to think that I'm not that much of a waste of space, but truth be told I'm probably what's wrong with the world and an example of why my generation is awful.

1 week ago
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To be honest, I don't think that this is what's wrong with the world. Don't be so hard on yourself. And I say that as someone who believes that being self-critical is a fundamentally good thing, but this is going too far.
There are so many different reasons at play here... it's complicated. Really.

1 week ago
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at least you are trying! Good luck to the future! <3

1 week ago
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To be honest, I don't think that this is what's wrong with your generation. If you are managing to avoid arrogance, dishonesty, and over-attachment to material wealth, you should consider yourself blessed. Keep trying to do "the right thing," and persevere in spite of the trolls, and you should be fine.

1 week ago
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I earn around 400 euros give or take(?)

Its not much but managable

1 week ago
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There's a students also, who don't work. For me i don't really have a monthly income, i work online as an editor on news website or by earnings from Humble Bundle Partner Program. Sometimes i get 100$ or more in a month and sometimes i get nothing, literally no income. I can't ask my parents to give me money to buy bundles/games. I try to pay that with my own money always, i don't like to ask my parents for money for anything. So when i get money i buy bundles/games, when i don't have an income i don't and i try to live economic.

Also i bought a Gaming PC with the help of my family, so everytime i get an income, i give 75% of it to my Dad who payed the most of it.

1 week ago
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Maybe you should include in your post that you mean the monthly gross salary. Because this might be a big difference for some. Cries in german.....

1 week ago
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I earn my living being a teacher, usually end up getting the equivalent of about 800-1000 USD a month.

1 week ago
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400USD. Dam im poor

1 week ago
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Same here man. Kinda bad at the end of the month, but not too bad otherwise, if you buy nothing that isnt food and bills

1 week ago
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Around $1,000 after taxes, working as a video editor / community person in a game dev studio. To give better insight, I pay about half on my monthly expenses (rent, electricity, internet and so on).

1 week ago
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0, currently unoccupied. At best, i got up to 600 eur (almost 700$) in the past, in a country where rent alone costs from 200 to 500 eur per month.

1 week ago*
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exactly $100/month :')
that's minimum salary in my province :')
8 hours per day, 5 days a week as senior programmer/lead developer :')
however i got bonus from project and side project, more than what i got from monthly salary

1 week ago*
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100$ a month as a senior at top of that with a lead experience? Someone is seriously screwing you over. If you are not willing to relocate maybe you should consider a remote work? Even if you were to earn half of the usual salary in not highest-paying market it would be several times higher than your current salary is, for example my country is considered an outsource country for europe and IT salaries are considerably lower than in Western EU or US, still senior dev is earning 3k+ USD (lead dev gets even more, but it can be hard to be a lead dev while working remotely), if someone would be to work for half of this price companies would be killing themselves over him. And like I said - it's not highest-paying market, with remote work you could easilly look for a job on a market with even better salaries.

1 week ago
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My friends said that too and the head hunter that i met.
I have 8 years of working experience in programming, actually i can get up to $1000 in capital city.
I work on new small company, so i understand the situation besides $100 monthly salary is enough in my city.
Thanks for the advice, currently i working remotely for another company.
Actually get more money from them and from project bonus.. Well not so bad after all :)
wow $3K+ that's a lot, in my country only few big company can do that.

1 week ago
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Here a small new start-up sallary would be around $2K for senior, $3K is pretty standard on senior position, offered by most companies (keeping in mind that in most cases they are western companies opening branches in Poland to outsource some of the work, or polish companies being contracted as outsourcing, basically 80-90% of work on the market is outsourcing for the west, remaining being mostly banks/financial market), top what a senior can get in a few highest paying companies is $5K. In Western EU or US this $5Kn wibb be normal avg salary for good senior dev.

Anyway, best of luck to you ;)

1 week ago
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o_O damn and i complain... but i suppose the main thing is can you pay your rent and eat and that depends on the region.

1 week ago
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Yes i can pay with $100 :D
Here living cost relatively cheap. $30 - $40 for rent (+electricity)
and another $40 - $60 for eat and transportation.
Capital city up to 3x of that.

1 week ago
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Fellow programmer here.
Not sure where you're from, but a company I worked for, used to have offshore employees in Ukraine, and senior devlopers were payed $3000 - $4000 per month, while juniors around $2000. They were all working remotely from a WeWork office (which the company paid).
They were from Kharkov/Kharkyv if you're wondering.

1 week ago
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I'm from developed country, IT is relatively new here.
Wow, even junior got $2K remotely ?

Well these stories really open my eyes, friends of mine told me to leave my current company since i should got at least $500 with 8 years experience (senior/lead).
however i have some goal in this small company, let say I'm invest here (not money tho), I just want to make it bigger in the future.
Working in some small project/ freelance for other company give me more for now.
For a picture, usually small company ask us to create a "simple" store/ catalog web for $200 - $400 only (after working hours, spent 2 weeks - a month to develop a web)

1 week ago*
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to put some perspective to your last paragraph - here a highschool student or student from 1st 2 years at uni will charge 250-500$ for making simplest store/catalog webpage (and that is if we're talking just coding, setup etc, no theme design, no graphic design, no flashy custom UI etc - for these you can triple these numbers at least ;p), and we're talking about people with no experience, not a pro with 8 years of exp, and projects that take like 1-2 days top to finish.

If you wish to stay with your startup company with hopes for it going big, then sure do so, but for these small freelance side-projects maybe try looking for employers from western markets - you will do the same job but for few times higher salary ;)

1 week ago
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I'll correct myself - not straight-out-of-uni juniors.

More like 2+ years of experience juniors, vs. 5+ years of experience seniors.

1 week ago
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This is enlightening. I would be curious to see this survey be done again to focus on disposable income, or people's cost of rent/food, along with more options in the less than 100 USD spectrum (like 0).

1 week ago
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Something like "What percentage of your income is disposable?" might be interesting.

1 week ago
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Yeah, it would be far more focused and telling as far as economic scenarios around the world.

1 week ago
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