Greetings, this will be a two part post. The first part is the main part and I want to fish for some opinions regarding puzzle events. The second one is completely optional.

Solving different puzzle events it seems to be a general trend to make some kind of overarching puzzle. This can be seen for the really large events but also for most of the smaller scale events. Often this is done as an ITH with passwords or similar. What I wanted to know is:

  • Do you expect some kind of overarching puzzle?
  • Do you prefer one way or another?

I have thought about it and I think both variants have some benefits. Presenting some kind of overarching puzzle:

  • Gives motivation to solve all puzzles and solving stuff you would normally just drop
  • Gives a feeling of satisfaction in case of solving it
  • More giveaways for the dedicated
  • Can give a lot of frustration in case of not solving single puzzles

Doing some kind of event with single puzzles only on the other hand:

  • Gives no additional bonus motivation to try puzzles you are bad at or you are slightly stuck
  • People can concentrate on the puzzles the like and/or are good with and still have fun
  • No pressure to do stuff you don't like
  • Can be easily upscaled without puzzles feeling out of context or out of place

So any thoughts on the topic?


Well, the reason I ask the question is obviously because I want to do a small scale mini-event called "A picture a puzzle". Each puzzle will consists of only one image maybe with one additional line for description. As it needs preparation the solution will link to another site first but there people have to do one simple task to get to the giveaway. I currently have five images and plan to do at least a sixth one but no overarching puzzle. So I wanted to use this situation if someone is interested to add an own picture puzzle. I would like to end the giveaways on the 18th March. The starting point is not decided as it depends if I do it alone or not. If alone I think one, at max two weeks will be enough. If more people decide to join it would start the earliest at the 18th February. So if you are interested I would be content about every contribution. It doesn't matter if stuff repeats between different puzzle makers or if it is totally easy. Just not torturing difficult unless you are ready to jump in with tips or you feed from human tears.

6 years ago

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Do you prefer puzzle events with some kind of overarching puzzle or not?

View Results
Yes, I prefer overarching puzzles. They give me motivation and reward the dedicated
No, I prefer events without overarching puzzle. I can focus on puzzles I like and still have fun.
I have no strong feelings one way or the other. Your statement has inspired in me a sense of utter indifference. All I know is my gut says maybe.

Personally, I prefer stand-alone puzzles, or ones that aren't too involved. Having to log everything you do and track bits and pieces can be quite tedious, and I don't always have the time. This is especially the case with the largest events where it might take weeks to solve different parts, and to a lesser extent smaller events where it's not immediately apparent that this is the case.

I don't mind puzzles that sorta cross-reference bits, and when I did Zork it did require some back and forth and there were isolated sections that could almost be seen as mini-events. But most people work for a living, and so making it too arduous means a lot less people can enjoy it all

6 years ago
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Yea, I actually like doing the events. Bit if they get to large and have some kind of overarching structure they start to feel tedious. The only ones I remember to complete and take part in as a whole have been while I was without job -_-
That is what I also thought that it just can take very long. With a secluded structure people can still smile while only solving one puzzle. "Oh I got that one." instead of "Sigh, still seven to go."

6 years ago
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The "overarching puzzle" you are referring to initially is also known as a meta puzzle. I love meta puzzles when they are puzzles themselves. If they're just enter all the passwords into one ITH page, then I don't mind them. But it really impresses me as a solver when there's a meta puzzle.

Also, sometimes if there is a meta puzzle you can guess solutions to the smaller puzzles that you were confused on.

Feel free to message me if you want a decent puzzle playtester. I'm not snrd3r level, but I'm better than your average joe.

6 years ago
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Do you have some kind of example for a good meta puzzle. The most I remember are ITH's where you can check passwords. I'm sure I have done others before but they didn't stay with me for some reason.

Hm, a playtester would make some sense. But regarding the little resonance I usually get I fear it would take away quite a large chunk of actual puzzle solvers while the thread is open.

6 years ago
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Here are three meta puzzles by nickchanger: https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/D8x0z/a-trainful-of-painful-puzzles-finished-solutions-in-progress

One of my favorites is the meta puzzle from Mikalye's Riddle Dungeon: http://www.itstoohard.com/puzzle/knAgiFUy (All of his puzzles and the solutions can be accessed from this comment https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/NXLTG/mikalyes-21th-2016-puzzle-an-event-mikalyes-riddle-dungeon-ended-solutions-posted/search?page=6#fkuXOtX )

You can message jeffhowe about his meta puzzle on the 2018 YSAE puzzle event. The meta feels like a nice reward to get a really good/expensive game after all your hard work

If you want to do a clever meta puzzle and require word restrictions like Mikalye's, a very popular website to use is called OneLook.com

6 years ago*
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In general I think a good meta puzzle is one that makes use of the answers to the previous puzzles and forces you to solve another puzzle using those words. Here is another example taken from the book The Maze of Games:

Some examples of the flavortext on this metapuzzle:
Add one and then the rest do not disturb
And THIS will change into a common verb
MEANER -> MEANDER

Upon a map you'll find THIS and disclose
The waterway that htrough it ever flows
CAIRO -> NILE

View attached image.
6 years ago
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Hm, without context the last puzzle makes no sense to me :P I will keep this in mind although it is a very specific set of puzzles where this works. Also I somehow completely missed Mikalye's puzzle O.o

6 years ago
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Average Joe here.
I like META puzzles when they are not too difficult. The separate branches can be a mix of difficulty, but I don't like getting stuck on the META, this way I can cherry-pick my puzzles to solve and guess/bruteforce my way through the door :P

6 years ago
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With getting stuck on the Meta you mean something like a pyramid structure where this one puzzle stops you from accessing others? Well, with image based puzzle there is not really brute-forcing. Either you understand what is presented or you will pluck out your hair.

6 years ago
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Yeah.
Ok, that sounds good, I guess... :P

6 years ago
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I prefer things to be not too complex but complex enough that it requires SOME effort by the solver.

6 years ago
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You mean the whole structure of all puzzles or puzzles generally? Finding the right difficulty is often hard as things are more obvious for the creator.

6 years ago
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Its hard to give a blanket answer. Each puzzle is different as is each person I use puzzles to increase participation, community and try to keep threads accessible for everyone. However straight up puzzles that are meant to last weeks need to be difficult as they need to last weeks.

Then you've got to think about the puzzle hungry masses who if you make it too easy may finish it in 5 minutes. It really depends on your end goal.

6 years ago
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Welp, yea. That chance will be there one way or another anyway. So I probably will accept that it may end to easy. Have still some ideas and have to check if i find the motivation to work them all out.

6 years ago
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I like puzzles either way... thanks for the interesting thread topic.

Making Puzzles... I prefer to have meta puzzles when I make a large collection of puzzles in an event. When I make s9mething small then a meta puzzle is unnecessary.

6 years ago
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Heh, yea. I was pretty sure that your answer would be something like this. I solved two of your puzzle pyramides after all. What is something small for you though? I think i never saw you do something small O.o

6 years ago
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Well, I never thought about that. I just try to make a fun puzzle. Whatever comes to my mind at the time. If you have an idea, make it a reality - if it's fun, people will try to solve it.

If I had to choose... Single puzzles with secret meta one, so everyone can enjoy.

6 years ago
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If it is a single puzzle, there is no chance for meta anyway :P

6 years ago
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I think it depends on the puzzle.

6 years ago
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Type? I saw it above. Word based puzzle have better chances to make something meta I guess.

6 years ago
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Deleted

This comment was deleted 2 years ago.

6 years ago
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You mean the reward for each puzzle specifically? Or only what rewards for all puzzles and you still have to find the one you are interested in. Do you actually appreciate the puzzle then or just the reward?

6 years ago
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Closed 6 years ago by Adelion.