A statement was made in another tread about there being a high degree of antagonism between low level and high level people, something that I've personally not noticed. My experience it's that it's mainly down to individuals clashing, not "high level people" looking down at "low level people", and "low level people" generally disliking "high level people".

Also, exact definitions of high & low level were not given, but level 7 is at least considered high level in this context.

Obligatory GA

9 years ago

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Is there a degree of antagonism between high and low level people?

View Results
Yes, to a large degree
Yes, to a small degree
No

I haven't noticed this either. I think when you reach out and participate (forums, puzzle posting/solving) instead of just clicking to enter GAs that most respond well to that, regardless of level.

9 years ago
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im forum active and no one notices me :p. maybe because im from a 3rd world country (?.

9 years ago
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stop using invisible ink, we can't read you :(

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9 years ago
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Curious. That's a screenshot of this thread, but it looks considerably different from my display. Do you have an add-on changing the display? I don't see that new icon.

9 years ago
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sure thing :3
i'm using SteamGifts v2 dark blue (yeah i made it, shameless self-promotion). there's another darker version of the same skin inside the userstyle topic and a different skin called SteamGifts v2 Dark Userstyle.
feel free to try/test them all. :3

there are also some nice userscripts in that list.

9 years ago
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Wow! Thanks for the link. Will surely be trying them out. :)

9 years ago
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That's really cool! Thanks, man! I really like both of the skins! I'm actually torn between which one I like better; they both look great!

9 years ago
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thank you for the skin :) SG looks much better now =3

9 years ago
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Oh, thanks a lot! I tried to find that thread few days ago but couldn't remember the name :)

9 years ago
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You earned yourself a new acolyte :P

Nice job!

9 years ago
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Stop being so cruel D:

9 years ago
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i can't help it!

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9 years ago
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:( no ones loves me :C

9 years ago
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Aw, don't be sad. I'm sending you here:

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9 years ago
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No idea about it really. At least I haven't noticed it. Maybe it is considered 'antagonism' to create giveaways with level restrictions? Anyway, me being level 5 I feel like I'm in perfect balance right now ;)

9 years ago
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Yes. Those damn high-levelers, thinking they can buy our affection by showering us with free games. It makes me sick

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i am going to collect more mad feels :O

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9 years ago
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You win gifs for today hahah. :D

9 years ago
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BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

:D

9 years ago
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To a very small degree maybe, because it would only apply to a some people.
Some people feel elite being a high level and some lower hate higher levels for that and different reasons.
Although I'd say both those groups of people are in the minority of SG.

9 years ago
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I would hope not. I'd like to think of Steamgifts as my happy place full of happy gaming things to go to after/before/during work. I would imagine there would be quite a few members that would dislike or confront people being rude to one another solely based on level.

As for myself, I hate everybody equally.

9 years ago
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same here, humans sucks, go cows!

9 years ago
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What about cats, bro? Dafuq?

9 years ago
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Agreed! Go cats! What? Oh wait... haha

9 years ago
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As for myself, I hate everybody equally.

Equality, that's the reason why i love you so much :)

9 years ago
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LOVE YOU BACK HIRO! MY HERO! :P

9 years ago
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9 years ago
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If you love him, but hate everyone equally, doesn't that mean you love me too?

9 years ago
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I'd whitelist you again if I could.

9 years ago
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The feelings mutual! Some people, like yourself, deserves it multiple times! Haha! :D

9 years ago
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you should blacklist yourself!

9 years ago
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And whitelist myself. MIND BLOWN! :D

9 years ago
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now you have done it -_-

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9 years ago
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I hate everybody equally

When I worked as a prison guard... I worked with countless officers that insisted they hated everyone equally... unlike your jesting... they generally used it as an excuse to cover up their racism and other biases.

9 years ago
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Ouch, that saddens me. It's really depressing to think that there's actually people like that around, especially in our Prison systems. :/

Where is the love?

9 years ago
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Friction is gonna be around when such things as 'white & blacklisting', invite only GA's, etc are around to show favoritism and/or exclude individuals from anything. Andd as the one above said, this percentage is pretty small.

A schmuck is a schmuck, regardlesss if they're lvl 1, 3, 5, 7, or 10.

9 years ago*
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Hail scmuckisem

9 years ago
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hail lady heel :3

9 years ago
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Yes, there is definitelly some degree of "antagonism" between low lvl and high lvl folks here. Small or large, I'm not sure, but it's evidenced by some of the discussions here on SG (people calling low lvl users "leechers", blaming them for only creating supposedly "inferior" bundle giveaways, doing only X+ lvl giveaways because they believe all the low lvl users are regifters and/or don't understand the rules and such).

9 years ago
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I don't get the "inferior" giveaways...
What's the problem? I mean, I'm broke, but I'm giving. So I don't get it. What if someone else is in my position?
Should I just let all the extra keys collect and do nothing with them? :/

9 years ago
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Same here. I've got a lot of bundle keys just not gettting used - some for what I consider good games (although many I've never played or never will play). I just figure somebody might want them. There are quite a few good games in the bundles.

9 years ago
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I tend to buy bundles with the idea that I'm getting at least half the games for me, and if I don't want the other half, I can give them away on SG.

9 years ago
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I dont really care what you share as long as you share just something at least once.
And tbh, I'm one of those people who mostly makes group giveaways or higher level giveaways. After the 10th or so giveaway in which a winner didnt activate, regifted, tried to sell or forgot to mark received I decided to focus on level 1 or more giveaways.

9 years ago
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most "high-lv" users also give away lots of bundles, there was a huuuuuuge train a few days ago with 5+ copies of each. no one complained because it was just bundles.
of course, it's possible some high-lv users consider bundles as "crap", but the same applies to low-lv users which are ungrateful.

just to give an example, there was someone complaining about the regift rule (because he regifted Temper Tantrum and got suspended) and said "It's a garbage game that was being given away in BULK here (100s or more) on their promoted games at the top of the page".
it's not the only person that has made a comment like that. -_-

9 years ago
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"Aw, not fair! You made a GA, of course the downtrodden low-levels (including me by that definition) will vote in your favor! It's biased I tell you, BIASED!"

/s

9 years ago
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When I was a level 2 I was, along with my fellow 0-2 levellers, herded into a cattle train car and driven to a giant warehouse where the high-levellers were really mean to us... I managed to escape but my heart is with my brethren who didn't survive that shameful act of hatred.

9 years ago
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Word.

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9 years ago
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axaxa!

9 years ago
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Huh? What? Where? O.o

9 years ago
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Not really seen anything from higher level users, apart from the ones who mostly do group giveaways and more prominently mid-low level users who are active in the community seem to have somewhat of a distaste for leechers. I've also seen a bunch of low level users complaining about the higher level players making a lot of higher level giveaways. No direct hostility though.

9 years ago
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I think people keep forgeting this is a giveaway site after all.

Apparently, it has become a sin both to win games and to give them away.

9 years ago
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As a new user, I think there is truth to this. It can be intimidating to put up your first giveaways. Searching the forums finds quite a few arguments over giveaways. I have my first giveaways up now, but am a bit trepid because I do hope I get my needed feedback from the gift link giveaways and hope it's not just bots that win and disappear.

9 years ago
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I dont think that's a big issue. While there ARE occasional winners not leaving feedback, vast majority of the people do, even the first time winners. Personally, I was lucky enough to have all my giveaways confirmed. There's not a lot of them, but still.

9 years ago
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that's good. thanks for letting me know. I've got several years worth of unused keys to work through, so hopefully things go well.

9 years ago
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nah it's not that bad. if you wanna give it a try, start with a single GA or maybe two so you don't get overwhelmed. read the rules so you clearly know how things work.
if something cames up and you don't know what to do, just ask in the forums. most people know what to do in situations and support is usually around. :3

just remember there's no coming back from this! once you start, you won't stop :O

9 years ago
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Heck, I have more games than I can ever play in my lifetime, but I keep on buying more, and keep on buying bundles.... I'm already beyond the point of no return! ;-)

9 years ago
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If you're afraid about the confirmation, you can always deliver the key/gift personally. Add the winner on Steam directly and send it through the chat.

9 years ago
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You're not alone :( I've got so many spare bundle keys that it's downright silly, and a steam library that just crossed 2000 games.
Oh, and Zeno Clash, that's a nice game. I'm sure you made someone quite happy with that one!

9 years ago
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Word. At one time I had over 600 spare keys. I got like 10 copies of the lowest HB tier few times.
I were never much of a trader, in fact I traded exactly once, so the only way to get rid of those was to gift them.
Luckily I accumulated a large amount (in the hundreds) Steam friends from one larger forum I occasionally posted in so in the holiday season of 2013 I went on a gifting spree. Checked every game's store page to see who had it wishlisted. Spreadsheets were involved. I think during that time I managed to gift around 150 people and all that was something they had in their wishlist so while it took a lot of work and planning I felt really good about myself haha. Also the bundle key hoard thinned considerably, so that was a big relief. Did the same a year later. Now that we've got SGv2 I moved my leftover gifting sprees here because there's a number and it gets bigger, even if not by much. I'm a sucker for numbers getting bigger. Addicted to Adventure Capitalist? Yes I am.

Oh the life of a digital hoarder...

9 years ago
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It is never said whether Santa's list is a spreadsheet =p

9 years ago
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Congrats on your first giveaway :) It seems you are not scared anymore XD

9 years ago
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prepare to go broke

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9 years ago
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It's not just about the level. Look at some private Steam groups. You know, "1 giveaway every month, expensive one, or you're out". Guess what they think about lov lvls here. What I think? This site is free, so if someone wants to win many games and won't give a single key back to the community... It's not great, but he can do it.

9 years ago
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Yeah I find those groups silly. Like, I could probably get into some of them and I could afford to go with the rules theoretically, and win a lot of nice stuff, but I made a choice not to. All my major non-bundled giveaways were to groups that have no mandatory gifting rules because I prefer those. And I guess in the future some will go to this forum if people don't run me out of here by then :-P

9 years ago
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I'm new here,but I don't understand reason for joining a group where you have to buy something expensive and give it away regularly. Why wouldn't you just buy the game you want if that's the case rather than buy something, give it away, and then hope you get a game you like?

9 years ago
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Yeah, it's a dumb idea. I do not recommend these groups.

9 years ago
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"mutual admiration society", I think

9 years ago
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I can understand having a requirement to give something away every once in a while (to avoid people entering as many groups as possible just to win games, with no intention of giving anything back, ever, though personally I avoid those groups), but yeah, groups that force you to give away expensive games all the time seem a bit silly.

9 years ago
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you know the monkey tree parable?

hierachical structures are like a tree of monkeys.

  • the ones on the top look down and see smiling faces.
  • the ones on the bottom look up and see nothing but assholes ;)
9 years ago
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So you're saying that we should start wearing pants?

Sorry, I get what you're saying, I just got a slightly unsettling mental image in my head.

9 years ago
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No no, skirts... then looking up becomes fun :)

9 years ago
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But I'm a man, would a kilt be alright?

9 years ago
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No, you're high level ... It's more fun for me if you're in a skirt instead ;)

9 years ago
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Also, monkeys love bananas..

9 years ago
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Truth

9 years ago
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well think of it as a tree where everybody sits where he sees himself. those who "look down" on others are the assholes.

those who meet people on equal terms are the smiling ones

9 years ago
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So they're shitting on us?

:S

9 years ago
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that might be the bad side-effect, but thats how it is in most societies

9 years ago
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This one is better.

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Of course not, you level 7 elitist snob!
J/K, no I haven't seen anyone looking down at me for being low level, not even when I was level 1.
One could argue that level restricted giveaways are a form of discrimination, but I consider them "thank you" giveaways for people who has contributed a fair amount of games.

9 years ago
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It's not common but it's present.
First of all - we have to differentiate low level users from low level leechers. There is not much hatred towards lvl 0 users with just a few wins (unless they create a topic asking why they don't win), but much more towards let's say lvl 0 user who never gave away anything having 100 wins oin their account.
Other side is present as well - I got blacklisted by several ppl for winning too much for example, or "if you can buy games for GAs why don't you buy games for yourself as well instead of stealing chances from others?"

9 years ago
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There is not much hatred towards lvl 0 users with just a few wins (unless they create a topic asking why they don't win), but much more towards let's say lvl 0 user who never gave away anything having 100 wins oin their account.

From my short time here this sums up what I have seen, levels by themselves don't appear to cause problems (or maybe I've just missed all that :D) - although a reluctance to make '0 rated' giveaways is usually from experience... once bitten twice shy and all that.

9 years ago
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Oh my god, I didn't know these users actually exist.........
I just found one >_>

http://www.steamgifts.com/user/BlackDraft/giveaways/won

9 years ago
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9 years ago
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Nah, he is using an add-on that auto-comments on every giveaway he joins, and probably using an add-on to just automatically join giveaways.

9 years ago
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9 years ago
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yup - this and ninjabots - automaticly snagging key drops ;p

9 years ago
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zelgh, you elitist presumptuous snob who assumes too much, the guy has better things to do with his life. :3
Just maintaining his 1,000+ games wishlist (lol) is a burdensome chore in itself, let alone playing his AAA games, cut him some slack, c'mon.
Why would he care about anything else? Priorities, man. ;P

9 years ago
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Teach me senpai (BlackDraft)!

9 years ago
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I think some people are elitist. I personally don't like zeroes as much as anyone else because I suspect some are bots/leeches, but I think there are exemplary people in each group. There are some higher levels who should know better by now, and some new people who are just trying to become accepted. That said, I understand why some people like higher/lower levels when they fit into those groups.

9 years ago
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Hmm, i know some users ignore others that have low ratio.
Whats the differnce?

9 years ago
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Haven't seen such tread, so i wouldn't know exactly the reasons for such statement
I would still say No, the majority of people i know from the forums or on my whitelist are like level 4/5 maybe, i wouldn't consider that to be high level
Then there are the majority of the low level members that are usually here for the free games and barely even stop by the forum
on the other hand, after each ga, if a member is level 3 or below i usually check on them just to be sure they are following the rules, so i guess i dont trust them as much.
Other than that i hate all of you the same way, independently of your level

9 years ago
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I have no idea about the general consensus but I don't have a problem with any group as a whole. We've all been level 0 once, you know? I only make lvl 4 giveaways because I want the process to be as simple and easy as it can be.

9 years ago
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I do find the results thus far a bit disheartening. Roughly 50% of all people here think there is a problem, and a bit over a third of those seem to think that it's widespread.

9 years ago
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On the other hand, only about half the people think there's any problem at all, and only about 1 in 6 thinks it's even serious.

9 years ago
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Yeah, but I still think it's a bit worrying/sad

9 years ago
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These numbers are actually better than I anticipated. Don't forget you're just polling opinions here, so this is just ignorance in aggregate. And you can be sure that at least half those voting yes can't distinguish between people being selective about who can enter their giveaways and antagonism. I'm especially impressed with the low number of people saying it's serious.

9 years ago
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On top of that, you're only getting the people willing to respond.
Some of them may be choosing not to respond for fear of irritating someone or a group of people.

9 years ago
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The results are anonymous, so hopefully that does not factor into this.

9 years ago
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Oh you mean on the poll?

Yeah, Anonymity helps, but there are people who might want to say something but won't for fear of what might be interpreted.

9 years ago
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+1 So true..Fear of other users and fear of being reported by other user to the SG moderators for reprisal is maybe many things except a far fetched thing.

9 years ago*
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+1

voicing unpopular opinions can backfire badly

9 years ago
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I think apathy would be more responsible for non-respondents than fear of reprisal.

9 years ago
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And it only includes people who look at Discussions...FWIW. Good thread, though.
Let's hope it doesn't devolve.

9 years ago
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Relax. 50% of statistics are inaccurate anyway.

9 years ago
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What about the other 65%?

9 years ago
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9 out of 10, 62% of them are made up.

9 years ago
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I think it has mostly to do with how the poll was worded (not meant as offence to your choice of wording, obviously).
But as you can see from those who have not just voted, but voiced the reasoning in their opinion, some see only a minority acting out.
If those thinking even if 1% acting out is enough to vote Yes, to a small degree, that will skew the results quite a bit.

By skewed i mean in the sense that reading what you said, you're finding even those replying Yes, to a small degree as disheartening, which i really wouldn't read as much into as you seem to be doing. :)

Ofc, dunno what the voting was at the time you wrote that, but at the time i'm writing, this is the poll.
Which is only less than a fifth, not a third anymore. Still a bit more than i'd expect, but there's always a few people trolling polls... although i guess you could argue that could skew them in any random direction.

As you can see, i voted no, because my rationale is that even though you find the occasional antagonizer here and there, considering it's such as small minority acting out (let's face it, which website doesn't have people acting like jerks?), it's nothing but irrelevant. The rationale of some people may be, because it's a minority they voted Yes, to a small degree, though.

Oh... and i'm willing to bet there's a small portion that regardless of whatever system would be in place, they would be against it, because, well, when was the last time you saw everyone on board with whichever system was in place at wherever it was? And some people tend to take that resentment towards whatever they can find to nitpick. Levels and its differences may just be as good an excuse as any to them, for that matter. There are petty people everywhere... regardless of being low/high leveled. :)

Just my not so short 2 cents. :)

9 years ago
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There absolutely is.
Many don't realize that many puzzles requires high knowledge and effort that old members that have been doing them for ages don't need anymore. Also you can see that high valued games go to higher levels quiet often in trains and what not as everyone thinks low level scum will enjoy just any bundle crap. Circlejerking is also a big thing that goes behind the scene a lot.
On the other side of spectrum there is leechers and bots who don't even bother to read thread descriptions.

But such is the way in current society. And you can't escape these even in real life. However there are ways to minimize participation on some of these types. Currently it is not possible to exclude elitists EASILY, but it is easier to minimize participation of bots and leechers.

9 years ago
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You. You, I like. If I'd used whitelist I'd add you.

9 years ago
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I do believe that a minor level of hostility exists between the two. One thing that some people might see as an issue, is when some higher leveled individuals seem to make the majority of their giveaways for small private groups, yet they enter/win public giveaways. There's also the dislike for leechy/bad ratio users.

9 years ago
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Concerning the one sided small private groups/invites only giveaways by some high level SG users whilst entering and winning level 0 and 1 open (= no small groups/no invites only,/no white list) giveaways I have seen this myselves and it's disconcerting and dishonest.

These people don't want certain SG users to win their giveaways but they do like to win from the same certain SG users.

I think the correct English word for this is: " ambiguous "

9 years ago
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I for one don't mind where people throw their gibs, be it the majority or otherwise... in itself (yes, even if they enter public GAs).
I might consider it abusive if someone only does group GAs and still enters public GAs to the point of having more wins than losses, in which quite a few of those wins are from public GAs with level restrictions, while having never given nothing at all to the general public. Meaning, it's not one or the other of those aforementioned, but all of it combined, that looks at least a bit... scummy.

But that has nothing to do with levels or hostility between different levels (imo) all by itself, but more so with how some people get their levels, by clearly abusing the system. But that's my reasoning, of course. ;)

9 years ago
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THIS! I couldn't have worded it better :)

Just noting that i for myselves do mostly connect high-lvl usersl with giveaway groups users. I guess it forms the majority of all L10 steamgiifters out there. I do know there are the regular users. From the steamgifts mod side for instance - like jatan11t & cg. Or for instance Mediennerd went into a GA spree and rushed to lvl10 in top speed. But thats the exceptions. On the other hand i know 2-3 other L10 who more or less solely running group GA's. Not implying anything of course. Just the association.

9 years ago
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And the thing is that some of those that run and have large amounts of wins in very smal (private), shady and shifty invite only groups if you check their wins they also have a lot of wins in level 0 and 1 giveaways from people they don't want in their shady groups giveaways what is atleast very ambugious.

Also some SG rules like the mandatory 5 entries for a private group/invite only/whitelist giveaways can easily be circumvented by making for example a 6 members private invite only group. Maybe SG moderators should consider upping the mandatory 5 entries to something a lot more substantial? That would certainly help to lift the suspicious veil around some of those shady groups.

9 years ago
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Also some SG rules like the mandatory 5 entries for a private group/invite only/whitelist giveaways can easily be circumvented by making for example a 6 members private invite only group

I'm trying to recruit 6 Level 0 users to a private invite only group. It sounds super shady, but I think it's a good cause. Don't you?

9 years ago
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I was refering to some very high level CV users that like to have most of their giveaways in small (private) invite only groups while at the same time entering and winning open level 0 and 1 giveaways.

9 years ago
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I agree. I noticed it too after hastily adding some of these users to my whitelist, and am going through it again to do some cleanup.

9 years ago
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Wait, what's wrong in gaining level through private groups and THEN entering level 0 and 1 giveaways?

That user for sure created at least one public giveaway which got him L1+, he could as well stop contributing at all and just join the giveaways, nothing would change.

I'm trying to balance my public winnings with some public giveaways, sometimes even public events, but if somebody sees a guy that participates in a private group and at the same time win public giveaways, then considers him as a "bad guy", then something is wrong with him.

Most of the time if you want to maximize your winnings, you'll go for private giveaway groups rather than building up your CV. I have much more fun from making a < 5 entries giveaway, and winning other one, rather than making X amount of giveaways and praying to RNGesus for winning the giveaway out of other 200, or 300 people. Of course, some people will not care at all, they're here to give away game, and maybe sometimes win something, I understand those people, but I never understood why there's a hidden hate for people in private groups. It's not like they're winning much anyway, most (if not all) high level people have much more CV that WV (won value), and those who do not wish to spend massive amount of money on giveaways prefer to attend private groups (like me), when they can maximize the chances for winning and get something in return without a need to throw 1000$.

That's one of the reasons why I have still L4 with over 250 created giveaways. Because of my lovely group.

9 years ago
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Closed 9 years ago by Fnord.