I just saw Lichdom: Battlemage, which basically promises to redo magic and make it better (somehow they have no cooldown and no mana, but they probably mean no extended cooldown (not that you can spawn blackholes as quick as you can click)).

Based on the reviews, is seems to have somewhat failed, while maintaining a moderate level of fun even with a lot of repetitiveness.

But that brings me to the reason for this thread. I think everyone is aware of a general dissatisfaction with how games handle magic. While you could say the same thing about melee, I think the industry is moderately ahead in that area compared to magic use. So I thought we could talk about magic systems. Which ones do you like, which ones do you not like, what game had this really interesting feature that you would like to see more of, what do you think a really cool magic game mechanic[s] would be?

9 years ago*

Comment has been collapsed.

I think more games should allow us to use magic to turn people into goats. I think it's important thing for evolution of videogames as an art form.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

People into goats, pigs, sheep... and most importantly, because of its cultural relevance from farytales, FROGS!!!
And ourselves/our characters in Eagles, Crows, Cats, Wolves or even Dragons!
Imagine being able to transform into a dragon for a limited time and burn, bite, chew, fly, squish and maul yourself through hoards of enemies.
Transformation spells need to be a thing!

4 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I will start:
DnD based magic. I remember trying to play NwNs 2 or something like that as a mage. You need to sleep in-between spell use, and as a mage that was my only weapon. So enter room, use spells, hope they kill everything, if not run away until they stop chasing you so you can sleep. Basically it worked until I encountered a boss. And technically any decently defended healing enemy would be basically unkillable. It was such a boring system. It is possible I was playing wrong, as I said bosses basically were unkillable, but even if I was missing something huge that whole system of having to sleep every time you use a spell was soo bad.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

That spell system I've seen work on the Wizardry games, you basically need the game to be set up right for that kind of system to work, and need to conserve your spells for when you need them. Use basic melee and basic ranged attacks on everything using the magic for special cases, like bosses

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

This!

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

So basically there is no such thing as a pure mage in DnD? 90% of your kills will be with your staff, etc?

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

From what I've seen of the magic system in D&D, the mage is does higher damage, but is handicapped with their cast count. Generally, the mages are in parties, so they are there to support more than to be the focus of the damage. You should probably keep your mage away from taking damage (squishy), and focus on you melee characters doing the brunt of the damage, while your mage does burst damage, focusing on the lower spells, as you likely can cast more of those.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I could see having a reagent based system working, just have to have the weaker/more common spells requiring a few of something extremely abundent, and the most powerful spells require more reagents and rarer reagents. I suppose the hard part would be balancing the availability of the reagents against the strength and use of the spells.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I personally cannot see a system like this adding anything.
They do this in UnEpic. All fire magic, for example, takes some number of fire reagents. So I am a full on fire mage, 99.99% of MY kills are with my axe, and I do a lot of waiting around for my pet to recharge (everyone gets a pet) so that I will have some pet offensive support.

Sure, in 1% of the battles I have uber fire magic, and if I wanted I would unleash a horde of fire summons, but then I would need to farm for hours to get fire reagents. Basically it comes down to, this system requires that I am already a good warrior capable of dealing with just about anything in my way. Personally I think this all would of been fixed if they can just allowed reagent saving, at some point, to completely negate the cost of the low level spells. But even if they had the system would not add anything to a recharging mana/cooldown system imho.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

It sounds like the reagent system is not exactly balanced in that game. In my opinion, the reagent system would be in place of the mana pool system.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

Compare that to the system used in the Ultima series whose games were also reagent-based. As in Ultima, you needed to harvest and stock up on reagents so that you were ready to cast in battle, but stocking up didn't require that much time and was on par with buying food. You did it once in a while and didn't have to worry too much about it. When casting, you didn't have to worry about reagents unless you were casting something really powerful and had just recently found a source of its reagents. All-in-all, collecting reagents added depth to the game rather than being a handicap.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I loved the spell system in Neverwinter Nights. With the wizard you had to prepare spells before the fight (no mana or cooldown). You put spells in a limited number of spell slots and when you used the spell you can't use it again before you rest (out of combat). I don't like the fast paced spell shooting (with super low cooldowns) this way you had to think about not wasting your spells.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I don't know if that was what you expected, but I really like Magicka's magic system. While it had not so many Magicks and regular spells, the general idea was good and it was real fun to play.

Other than that? Maybe Skyrim? Having typical mage clothes not only gave you more damage but also allowed for almost continous use of spells without worrying about mana, which I think was great. Wanna be a mage and use spells as much as possible? No problem. Wanna be a warrior and occassionaly set enemies on fire? Sure, why not. A bowman who can summon undead once for a while? Okay!

What I disliked however was magic system in Guild Wars 2 though. There was no resource bar and all skills were cooldown based - while this may not require you to stop farming to recharge (like WoW) low amount of skills (5 per weapon [I know, elementalist has 4 elements making it actually 20 spells, but shuffling was cooldown reliable too...] and 5 utility, one of which is healing) doesn't actually fit my gaming style.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

Never really got into the magic in Skyrim.

I always just ended up as a stealth archer. Last time I think I worked on Summons as well.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I actually don't mind the GW2 system. It reminds me of a cross between D&D (have to pick your spell setup before the battle) and Diablo (can cast your spells almost endlessly). Casting in that game involves figuring out which combination of spells you want to equip so that you can spam them at the proper times for both offensive and defensive purposes.

The only drawback to a spamming system like Diablo or Skyrim is that you end up casting only a few spells (the most useful or powerful ones), over and over, again. Spells then become more like artillery/bullets than magic. Diablo did, however, do a good job of making the different magic classes feel unique. Necro's play much differently than Sorc's, for example, and even the same classes could have different emphases.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

And Magicka:
Fun, really fun. With a huge array of combinations. But it is really hard to have a game reward diversity. The only way to really play well was to learn 3-4 spells down pat. I remember getting to the Yeti? level, being absolutely creamed, and them just using wet beam -> ice, lightning beam for the rest of the game.

But in general I really like the idea of finger dexterity based magic. Avencast was fun as it added a similar mortal combat style button combination to launch spells. SO you progressed and got better at spells as you used them.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/thoughtstem/codespells-express-yourself-with-magic is neat, but looks like they are going to fall flat on the objectives/duel/combat. It feels like they are aiming for a more kid friendly creative experience. I sort of like how it is somewhat resource based, an earth spell is not just spawn a rock shooting towards your enemy, you need to find an actual rock. And I imagine it will be similar with water. I could see that promoting a very interesting creative mmo industry system. With maybe magic aqueducts bringing water to holding tanks to be used in spells.

But I could see it really being unbalanced and one sided. You can create these very very complex spell constructs, or just blast a repel earth spell to destroy one. It will be a challenge to design a system then give as much power to order as chaos.

Note: No matter what you do, you have to watch the end of the KS video. They creates an Fing stone golem, that is soo amazing.

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

I didnt read anything, i just wanted somewhere to put this (っ ͡ ͡° ͜ ʖ ͡ ͡° )⊃━☆゚. ・ 。゚•
(っ ͡ ͡° ͜ ʖ ͡ ͡° )⊃━☆゚.
・ 。゚•

9 years ago
Permalink

Comment has been collapsed.

Sign in through Steam to add a comment.