Your change suggestion amounts to punishing people who are regular gifters, and benefit people who just want to giveaway a bundle.
Lets spend that $1 and get $200 CV. That person who paid full price for 10 copies of Dark Souls a while ago? Lets give him the CV for just one.
This is why your idea sucks.
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Happens all the time. Fortix never gets discounted. Take a look at Delta's profile. A ten copy giveaway is on the very first page of his giveaways.
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I paid for every copy. Even after it was relegated to the bundle list.
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You got it free? Good for you. Just because you get it for free doesn't mean other people did. Especially 50+ copies of the game.
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Just because you are a greedy sod who expects high value for your dollar doesn't mean all people are such. Some people here are actually generous bastards. You should be ****ing happy such people exist, or you wouldn't have gotten the chance to win 27 games over your time here.
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Is that what I said... NO
If you have paid full price for all you have given away you are a rarity. Looking at many high CV profiles I just see people who have exploited the system the same way people have tried to exploit the system with bundles.
I only have given away games I already have the keys for in bundles and am looking for a way to get credit for the give aways. Do you dispute in any ways that there are many who have gamed the CV system with steam sales????????
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Here is the thing you seem so content to ignore while thinking all about gaming the system.
THEY SPEND MONEY. Even if they didn't pay full price, it often isn't so heavily discounted. Bundles are discounted by crazy amounts. Don't like it? Leave. Go to another site and have fun there. We won't miss you.
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As already pointed out in this thread.
I could wait for a 95% off game and spend $30 + another $5-10 with the scaling on "full price" vs bundle games to get a CV of $1000. Have I..... NO
I don't care about gaming the system otherwise I could have do WITHOUT ANY PROBLEMS.
I am looking for a way to get some credit for games I give away.
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Like I said below, 95% games are put on the bundle list, so you cannot "game the system" by giving away such games.
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I never said that people don't game the system. You are arguing that gaming with 90% off games is the same as gaming with bundles. That is entirely untrue. There are bundles out there that give you $200+ worth of games for a single dollar. $5 for $1000 is orders of magnitude different from paying $100 for $1000 CV.
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I am just looking for a way to get something for what I give away.
The CV system makes people game it. Nobody here will say anything else. There are many ways to game it including the steam sales.
As you can see from my profile I do not want to game there system, if I had I would have already. There are enough posts in this thread from me where I outline exactly how you can game the system for minimal outlay to get huge CV and yet I only have the CV from the few duplicate bundle games I have given away.
The CV system is just a joke as it stands, can you not see that?
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Everyone agrees that the CV system is broken. Your way of "fixing" it will not improve anything.
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"Those people are spending a bit of cash to get CV. I shouldn't need to spend that much to count as a generous person, so I'm going to ***** about how unfair it is."
Those people earned their CV. I don't give a ** that you aren't happy that your bundles don't earn you anything because you won't spend a dollar on a non bundle DLC to get higher CV. That is your** problem. You want CV? Try being a generous person yourself. You can buy discounted games yourself.
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I am just looking for a way to get something for what I give away.
Generous people don't care about CV or profile stats, they give away games because they want to make other people happy which in turn makes them happy. I personally despise the CV system, as it has twisted the reasons why people gift (as evidenced by your argument).
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You want to get something for what you give away? Maybe steamtrades is your website. This is called steamgifts for a reason, I don't think you should expect anything at all for your gifts.
The CV system may not be perfect, but what you suggest seems just way worse to me.
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I am not sure about it... There aren't regular discounts like that but hey! there are still those weird offers on Steam which are -98%, -99% etc. What if person bought, let's say - 100 copies of such game? Such person could then have really big CV since such games won't (probably) appear on bundle list so I don't think Your point is good.
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Recently, it was Tomb Raider and few other titles, don't remember which though. Some time ago it was Don't Starve (-92% or something) where price of 2-pack was something like 1.60 (many people bought a lot of them as far as I heard from Friends). There really are such "Deals", sometimes mmore often, sometimes less... Anyway, I wish I found one for myself D:
There was also few games (2 or 3 probably) discounted more than 100%. It was actually Tomb Raider with the price of -6 or -9 euro or something like that. Some people even say it's possible to complete purchase with such discounts... I haven't seen any proofs though.
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Can you buy Don't Starve 2 Pack as a gift? I thought you couldnt buy it if you own the game already. The best you could do is buy a 2-pack for yourself, which would be 90 cents a copy (it was actually $1.79 I think). That's 94% off, nowhere near 98% or 99%
Also, it's impossible to buy any game on Steam with over 100% discount. Those people are lying.
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dont starve was 92% for a very very limited time only, and 92% doesnt exactly fit the 98-99% that the other guy was claiming. The weird ones like -125% like tomb raider or borderlands in steam winter sale, i saw that too but those -100% discounts cant be purchased at all. I have yet to find a single relevant 98-99% valid discount on steam sale.
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And as already pointed out, that won't work. It would have been bundle listed. A shame you don't seem to read any of that during the time you complain about how you can't exploit bundles.
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Oh, sure. People can get a decent discount by purchasing games when they are 75% off.
You want to make no cut off for the purchase price (which means people will buy a $1 bundle each week to make thousands) yet punish people who actually spend decent money buying games. Your idea is bloody ****ing stupid. How long before you realise this?
You don't want to spend lots of money, I get that. Not everyone can afford to. But don't make suggestions to benefit you and punish the people that keep this site going. You are nothing but a ****ing sod if you believe your $1 bundles deserve CV more than someone who spends $25 to get $100CV.
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I am trying to point out how broken the CV system is. As you have just stated and I have pointed out, for minimal outlay you can game the CV system.
Have I... NO.
Come on as you are so vocal and have a CV of $1800
How much has that high CV REALLY cost you? Name a $ value.......
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No clue. But, I do know this. I'm a generous bastard, spending money on games I know won't get me CV. You are a greedy brat who wants to complain that you don't get anything. The problem is, you don't want to spend anything. You don't want to contribute, but you want the giveaways that people who do spend piles of case are allowed to enter.
Guess what. You aren't ever going to get to enter those giveaways without spending cash. Too ****ing bad for you.
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Here's the thing: anybody that's been here a while KNOWS that the actual value of CV is greater than the sum of its parts (in terms of what was actually paid), and people take that into account when making CV giveaways or group entry requirements. The discounts you can get on Steam games for non-bundle giveaways does not even compare to the ridiculous discounts you get in bundles.
If you care more about being rewarded in some trivial manner rather than giving away games to brighten someone's day, then maybe you should use the keydrop function at Playblink, or try using Steamtrades to swap a key for a bundle game you dont own.
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Last time I checked $10 /= $50. Perhaps you should relearn your "basic math"?
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I have already dealt with that rotf. For that outlay your odds for getting game wins is massive. Look at game wins for high CV people, there is an order of magnitude difference in probability for a $1000cv entry requirement over a normal entry requirement. So the $40 difference is actually nothing and will repay itself very quickly.
I have dealt with this already in this thread in a number of areas. Please keep up
I write complex tax systems for a living and fully understand math and basic rules of probability. I also can see how the current system can be gamed and yet I have not done so for the same reasons I have no VAC bans.
I am a gamer and buy games. I would also like to give away games I already have but the CV system is broken. This is what this thread is about
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It is not broken. It works. It ensures that people don't just buy bundle games if they want a high CV. Such a shame that you can't understand you need to contribute to count as a contributor, despite your claims to understand maths.
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And yet you cannot admit that you are wrong. Whether the "investment" as you call it is worth it or not has nothing to do with basic math. $10 is not the same as $50. Please keep up or is this perhaps a bit too complicated for you?
See? I can be just as condescending as you are.
I'm just arguing semantics.
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Look. There is a difference between $10 and $50. It's basic math.
Now stepping away from the definition portion: A $40 difference may be "nothing" to you, but try saying that to a homeless person, or even just to someone living paycheck to paycheck. Seriously. What kind of restaurants do you go to that your meal will cost over $40? And a typical family going to McD will cost more than $40? Maybe in New Zealand, but not in the rest of the world as far as I know.
I grew up in a poor family, and let me tell you that a trip out to McDonald's for 4 rarely exceeded $8.
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I think the OP is a very privileged individual and/or grew up in a very wealthy household.
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Hmmm... my mouse was free after rebate, I got my headset in a company promotion offer (for free), and my "gaming rig" was $500 give or take, spread over like 5 years.
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" I would also like to give away games I already have but the CV system is broken"
The CV system only affects you for the GAs you want to enter, not those you want to create. If you really mean what you say, go ahead: give away all those bundle games you're sitting on! There's no imperfect CV system stopping you from doing that! :)
If however what you really want is to get access to all those fancy high-CV GAs, then you may have a problem...
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I've given away Advent Rising 8 or 10 times and have paid full price everytime. Ya it is only $10 but it never goes on sale so full price everytime.
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The reason people get full value from those non bundle games is because even the best discounts are rarely over 75% off. I've seen people get bundles which amount to 99.5% off.
And you can get the value from your bundle games if you gave away other stuff as well. Try that once in a while, rather than complaining about people who spend decent bits of cash getting CV from that.
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Actually I just got 90% of Payday on last day of sale and have seen 95% off stuff before so yes that is gaming the system.
I have a key for Walking Dead Season 1 just waiting to go on steam gifts but no way am giving away because of the current system. I have about 15 keys unused all for different games. I get bundles but have a lot of games so some keys I can't use. The current system is the way it is because people used to buy 50 copies of a bundle and try and get CV on all the keys.
Lets face it, the difference between 95% off in the sale and 99% off in a bundle is nothing yet one method of gaming the system is valid and the other is not.
This is why it is time for a change to the system.
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Thanks for your input. I am sure support will take it into consideration, and then keep the system we have in place now.
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And as I said, anything above 75% is rare.
and I also pointed out that bundles have been as high as 99.5% off. Which is still a whole ****ing lot more off the sale prices.
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The games that get it are for the most part cheap indie titles, often from a certain bundle of developers, and most have been bundled in the past. No one is making piles of CV off the majority of those. And compare the maybe 20 games that had such high discounts to the THOUSANDS on Steam. They are rare.
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You think the difference between 95% off and 99% is "nothing"?
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I guess you're rich or something. $40 is a lot to me.
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Actually if you play it right that $40 investment is worth the return as you will see the number of game wins in steam gifts for high CV people will show, many with 100s of wins.
So yes if I wanted to game the system $40 is a very cheap outlay given one high value game could cost you twice that.
As you can see, I have not spent that to game the system because I just want "something" when I do give away keys for game I already have.
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People who think CV is a good investment are so cool :3
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Hah, you wish. $30 wouldn't get you $1000 CV, it would have entered the bundle list with such discounts.
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For the 90% of payday I could have bought the $1000CV for just $8?
40 copies of payday at $2 each and a few $ on bundle games.
Now pick a 95% game and yes $45 for near $1000 cv is a reality with well selected bundles. There were 95% off games in the recent sales, I picked up Don't Starve on a flash sale for that.
So is Don't Starve on the bundle list... no
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I see you have a problem with basic math. 40 copies of Payday at $2 each is $80, not $8.
Also, since when was Don't Starve 95% off? When was any game 95% off during the recent sale? Please show proof.
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Yes I know about that. But not 95% off, which is the criteria for the bundle list.
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8 is a wildcard symbol that can represent any number now I see.
Or the easier explanation is that you left out a 0 and just are not willing to admit you made a mistake.
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You mean the 92% price glitch that was there for a few minutes, not long enough to be farmed for enough copies. And hell, why not giveaway a copy of that yourself? You could have gamed the system, like you want.
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Given my history. A few bundle games each one from a different bundle and also that I have highlighted how I could game the system for little outlay if I had wanted, does that look like what I really want... NO
I Fully understand they are trying to stop the system gaming but you have to admit the way games get discounted on steam there is little difference between the two. So why not give credit for the first giveaway on a game from a bundle.
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there is little difference between the two
I think you are failing to see that both Delta and I do not agree with this assessment.
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Remember than 99.5% I mentioned earlier. That is $200 CV for $1. That will NEVER happen.
With non bundles, if you are really lucky and get a price glitch or an awesome deal on a non bundled game, it might be a little over $10CV for your $1. Most of the time, its more $4 for every dollar.
Very big difference.
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To be fair, I did see one person get a majority of his/her 1K cv from giving away 30 copies of that 1 cent Carrier Command game. That being said, those cases are rare to see and just another example where there shouldn't be a hard and fast rule like 95% to add (or not add in this case) a game to the bundle list but rather go on a case to case basis, taking into account all factors.
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i get 2$ extra CV on non bundle games i give so system is fine a bit complicated but u will understand it by time :) i had a problem understanding that too so yeah giveaway as much bundle games u can so u will get extra cv on every non bundle game u giveaway so its super win for all of us :)
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But, but...you haven't gave away anything, except cheap bundle games?
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I give away games because I but bundles and already have some of the games. As you will see non of the games given away are all from one bundle are they. It is not like I have given away 5 copies of one game. Each is from a different bundle
I currently have about 15 keys all from different bundles, again ones I already have, including Walking Dead Season 1. But why give them away with the current system?
Yet I look at people with $1000CV and they have given away 100 copies of one game that I KNOW was on sale for 95% off on steam.
Do you see my logic yet?
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You can give them away to your friends or your favourite SG group, anyway, there's always a reason to giveaway something if you want (Birthday, celebration, milestones etc). But you just want to get more bonuses for your bundle games.
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You should give them away to make people happy. I've spent money on 40 bundle games I knew would get me nothing as far as CV goes. 40 happy people at the end of the day though.
Also, don't pull **** about them getting full value for a game you know was 95% off, that is automatic bundle list status.
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If it's 95% off on Steam, it gets put on the bundle list as well.
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It's not good neither not bad.
"Democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." (c)
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I don't actually agree with that. The site started without having CV and it ran pretty smoothly. Complaints about exploiting and so forth only came after CV was implemented.
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Yup, there will definitely be tons of complaints. I guess this is one of those - once you implement it, you're stuck there forever - kind of things.
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I think it's a valid comment about the negatives of CV.
Looking at it from another angle, you could say that the extra CV from discounted games encourages more giveaways.
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You argue that you're keeping your leftovers because of the cv system yet you enter and win the giveaways created by those generous, or from your point of view, stupid people who still bother to share even though they get no cv.
Sure I agree that some games especially with regional pricing differences are being exploited as an easy srouce of gaining massive amounts of cv. But still, they spent hell more than bundles. At least they paid for something to get their cv not whine like you about how the cv system is ripping off your rights. (which may not even exist.)
Admit it. YOU JUST DONT WANT TO SHARE. ALL YOU WANT IS TO ENTER AND WIN HIGH CV GIVEAWAYS AND GET SOMETHING FOR FREE. Go sell your dear keys and get your value.
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Though you are right that people do not contribute some of their keys for that reason (I personally give them to friends), you forget one thing... Nobody cares! This site isn't suppose to solely exist to boost your CV next to your name but for people who want to give to one another gifts can. Besides, the reason it was created in the first place was not just because of people abusing it to get high CV with dollars at a time but also because this site gets flooded like fuck with these games. Variety is good and this is one way to get that. There is no perfect system to the topic, so we might as well not change it. That is my opinion anyways.
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I don't think not getting CV for bundles is a problem. I think getting CV for 90% off games is, though. They've been exploited to hell now. Serious Sam, Fowl Space. It's so easy to enter high CV giveaways during sales with so little investment it's not even funny.
It's pretty sad. What do you guys think about 90% off games?
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Serious Sam is one of the worst culprits. Most of the giveaways are actually from the Russian regions, in which the Complete Pack can be had for ~$3. My pleas for Shobo to add it to the bundle list like he did to Kane's Wrath has fallen on deaf ears.
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That is so funny. You hassle and hassle me in other parts of the thread because I start a thread about how broken the CV system is and they you highlight exactly why I start such a thread in the first place.
DeltaBladeX might be the exception to the rule but we all know the system is so exploited it is just not funny any more.
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Your 'fix' contains something that isn't needed, but would make a lot of CV profit for people unwilling to spend cash. It will not help. Complain if you want, but this system is much better than the alternatives. Take away the CV or make BUNDLES of all things earn large amounts will just see anything decent hide in private groups for a small selection of people that the gifter likes.
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Frankly, we're already seeing it happen Delta. With an increasing number of individuals cracking 1K+ cv purely on the laurels of SS Complete Pack or SS BFE: Gold, I imagine more than a few individuals aren't keen on making any public giveaways anytime soon, I know I certainly won't be making any giveaways outside of group/private giveaways.
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+1 No point in Public giveaways.
Not to mention that SG has become way too popular and even giveaways for games that aren't Skyrim get over 3,000 entries if they're over 1 hour in duration. Remember when quickies were winnable? Perhaps we're just getting too old and we should make way for the new generation that just really loves Serious Sam apparently, haha.
But I digress. I still try my luck, these past few weeks have been great!
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Once again, I never said that the system is not broken. So I don't know why you are pulling this out of your ass. Stop putting words in my mouth.
The main argument you made in the OP is, and let me quote you:
"gaming the steam sales is NO different than gaming the bundles "
The entire time I have argued that gaming bundles is ENTIRELY different from gaming steam sales.
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my only problem with the system is like, those certain people who'll take a $3 game & then say you've gotta have a CV of $1,000 or higher to enter for it...i hate that shit lol its just so pointless to me. but you should be giving to make others happy, not to focus on a CV limit.
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I can see plenty of reasons why those giveaways are valid. I give away $2000 worth of games over a year. The next month I lose my job. Or I really want a game but I can't buy it in my region. Or I simply just don't want to pay for a game.
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*holy shit jatan just replied to me.
i can see how it would be valid if you're over that limit. but from the outside looking in...idk i guess it just doesn't click with me yet. i don't work anywhere (well i didn't, i just started up a clothing line on New Year's) but when i didn't have any income at all, it was still pretty easy to scrape up $3 (or cheaper with Steam sales). & i would much rather pay for a $3 game than a $30 or $50 one that i could luck up & win here.
as for it not being available in your region, yeah that makes sense. :)
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Yeah, it might be kind of strange to see these cheap games at high CV, but it so rarely happens anyways that I don't think it really matters in the end :P
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This argument has been done a lot. You are not the first one. The system is not perfect, but it works. Allowing everyone to get full values for 'pay $1 for 10 game' bundles would make the CV system useless, so we would be back to square one because either everyone will just put higher CVs (like really high) or not put CVs at all. You want to give away games to get a high CV, what happens when thousands of other people have similar CV as you? That's the same as having no CV at all and entering public giveaways.
You have to think of all sides of an argument.
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Ugh, I lose $54 CV for some reason.. :P
Here is a public giveaway. Good luck!
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yhm, ok.... So, just theorethicaly - I go and buy 5 copies of brand new AAA game on release day, paying 5*60=300$ for them, make a public GA, 2 contri only GAs, puzzle and give one to my fav group. And I should just get 60$ CV for it. You buy Groupees BUndle for 1$ and get 10 games you never gave away before. So you should get 100-200$ CV for them. Yeah, seems totally legit and fair... The most stupid argument in CV discussion I've seen in a while. It even doesn't try to pretend to be "fair" to everybody - the only reasoning behind it is for it to be "fair" (aka gives the most CV possible) to you, OP.
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It's just CV deal with it.
If you would gain CV for every bundle games (for the first time) the most possible outcome would be this: people creating giveaways would make GA with higher CV requirement
Why are you guys whining? If you want to participate in better giveaways spend your real money and make GA like those guys making those bloody GA. I'm person with 0 CV, didn't make single GA yet because all I have is only 2 bundle games to spare…. but I acknowledge the right of person who makes to GA to set CV as high as he want. It is HIS GAME to begin with, he can do whatever he want. If he doesn't want to give it to leech entering every GA (just because he can) that's his own rational choice.
And btw. one more thing 15K entered GA in just 1 year? Lad you are leech. Stop entering every possible GA
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It's been tried before, but unfortunately, a large majority of sg still supports having this system in place.
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Until people still want this game is ok (and joinin this giveaway did'nt have that game already). Do you prefer 1 giveaway, or 10? When smb could buy it cheaper it is better - give other's more. I even want say that better idea, than almost only bundles will be better giveaway eg. games from daily deals on steam.
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Hi,
I have to admit I am sat on a load of keys but have stopped giving away anything because the the CV system.
Lets face it, you see loads of people sat on stupid CV and when you look they have just gamed the system by getting loads of games that are 90+% off on steam and giving them away. Often multiple copies of the same game. Is this really any better than those that try and game the system by getting multiple bundles to boost CV.
Given how many games have been through the bundle system now it must be time for a change.
I think you should get the game value the first time you give away a game and then nothing after that. We all get bundles and want to give away what we already have but it is the morons that game the system that have got us to where we are today. Lets be honest here, gaming the steam sales is NO different than gaming the bundles yet people are sat on CV of $1000 probably for a payment of $50 with careful sale selection. Utter stupidity.
Just a thought
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