If I create a Gratuitous Space Battles giveaway, and say in the description: "You will get a full unused humble gift bundle," would you consider that a misrepresentation?
I'm going to side with Valzi on this one, but it really is up for debate. Giving away a 4 game bundle key represented as a single game may break the "Do not misrepresent the title being given away" rule, however, I would argue that this is incorrect. I have seen many giveaways that state "if you win this giveaway, I will also give you the DLC to this game." Is this also misrepresenting the giveaway because you get extras? In my interpretation of the rules, this rule is there to prevent guest passes, beta keys, etc masquerading as the real games.
I do know CG stated that we should "review that bundle's terms of service to ensure you have permission to do so." This is NOT an explicit statement that such giveaways are not allowed. In fact, that completely contradicts the first statement of the paragraph if it were true: "There's no longer a restriction on what games can be given away, assuming they're not guest passes or beta keys".
At any rate, the entire point of the contributor system overhaul was so that these kinds of giveaways could be created.
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However, for the bonus key, there is no option in the drop down menu. The only way to make a giveaway (rule breaking or not) is to represent it as one of the games.
I still say that the updated contributor value rules cover this. I see nothing wrong with getting $10 contributor value from giving away a key you paid $1 for, considering that you can get the full $90 (well, as long as you give $450 non bundle games) or higher from splitting a Gala bundle.
The easiest way to solve this is if CG just comes and says it's either not allowed, or create giveaways in the dropdown menu explicitly for the keys.
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IndieGala unlocks secret bonus games in the 2nd week, yet those are allowed to be given away. No need to respond, I know HiB bonus keys are "different." I just continued this thread for the sake of argument :P
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Back when cg (the site admin) first allowed individual keys from various bundles to be given away here, he wrote this:
"If you're gifting a game from a bundle, please review that bundle's terms of service to ensure you have permission to do so. If you believe a giveaway needs to be removed, please use the report button."
And since Humble Bundle terms indeed do not allow this, report away.
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They dont get advantage because the value is capped.
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This thread made me realize that they added to the bundle. THANX BR00
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Well, there isnt any option to giveaway that bundle(for the obvious reason that you choose what games from the bundle you want)
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Do not allow individual redistribution by the Humble Bundle rules, but not by the steamgifts rules imo
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Well seeing as they can only get up to 30$ with bundle games they can't really boost can they
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Yeah I thought this issue has been fixed with the bundle games cap already?
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I asked here through a support ticket here if I could give away individual keys and I was told to go ahead and do it. I agree that way to many games are from bundles to the point that it's easier to ignore this site and just buy the bundles, but still. I have a large number of keys that I literally have been having trouble giving away, and this seems to be the best place for it.
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The third one is ok, he just got a tradable copy spawn in his inventory from activating the HIB. It happens sometimes with the way Steam handles extra copies from bundle and same game gets reactivated on the account. I got myself an extra Torchlight when I activated the HIB6 from my Torchlight 2 preorder. Giving away that tradable copy is not against the rules, although he did not explain himself correctly (and probably doesn't understand that HIB is not the one spawning that extra copy either)
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what is your problem people? really? someone give you a chance to win a free game and you complain about is contributor value?
Why? you are jealous about a number?
For what?
When someone want to give a free game, he gives it without thinking of a fucking contributor value!
And yes probably this message is full of grammar erros... (i'm not english)
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And? did you see how many "public" giveaway make by awesome people there is here? i have enter 1,655 giveaways and i have 0€/$ contributor value, this have no sense, is just something like "hey look at me, i have give away 1,000$ of games"... What do you gain whit this?
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If they didnt think of contributor value, they they would give it as it should be and get 1$ contributor value.
But they care about contributor value, so they misrepresent what they are giving to get more contributor value.
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^ This.
I mean c'mon nivo92, they clearly care about contributor values. If they didn't why wouldn't they just use the proper giveaway for indie bundles.
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And you must think complaining = epeen deficiency because you clearly suffer from brain cell deficiency.
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Witty.
I've found that almost everybody who bitches and moans about bundle keys is someone who thinks that contributor value is actually valuable. Yano, like the people that think that they're gamerscore on XBL or their steam rating means something.
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Boot to the head for not realizing what this is actually about.
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Nothing wrong with giving away bundle keys. That's allowed now. The issue is people listing bundled games under the title of one individual game to get more contributor value for it. You probably shouldn't complain about the rules when you clearly don't know them very well.
Haha you're right, this site is good for a laugh.
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please let me know if you find more of these giveaways, I want to report them
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um... what's the problem? they're games in bundles yes, but you can not separate the keys in Humble Indie Bundles! they're all together in 1 "ONE" key! other bundles like Indie Gala have separate keys, but not HiB. so they probably bought those or got them in other bundles.
I'm not a fan of just breaking apart bundles to up the contributor value, but for folks like me that get something with keys for each, like IG bundles, and there are games I can't even give away to my friends, it's nice to have a spot to dump them off for someone else to enjoy. but I could care less if they gave me contrib value or not.
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As i understand it they get full value until they reach the bundle cap
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The OP is complaining that games from bundles are being given away too much. That's actually what the post says. You're talking about your own more legitimate complaint.
Also, a rule was made about breaking up giveaways into individual games. It's allowed now, however, once a game is part of a bundle, it can only count toward a $30 cap, so you can't give away more than $30 worth of games from bundles.
So, here's why I'm not entirely sure if this situation you and I are talking about is considered against the rules or not: he's allowed to give away a game that was in a bundle. The fact that he's adding even more games from the bundle means that he's giving away even more than he's allowed to give. However, you're right that he's misrepresenting the giveaway to the steamgifts system, which the ops may easily count as against the rules, since, technically it is. =)
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Not to mention humble bundle wants it as a complete bundle and does not want you to share keys (or anything) from redeemed urls
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Well, it's good that he pointed this out, because I hadn't realized people were doing this. I could care less if he was breaking that silly rule about calling people out (which was really only created for people saying FAKE in giveaways).
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As far as I know the rule also had a lot to do with not wanting people to falsely call people out and send lynch mobs against innocent people. Better safe than sorry, that sort of thing.
I really don't care much about people calling people out either to be honest. I just find it funny when people complain about other people breaking the rules by doing so themselves.
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I mostly agree with you, but I get pissed at the angry responses when someone states in a giveaway something to the effect of "You are new here, so please read the FAQ. Beta keys/guest passes are not allowed to be given away." I've seen many giveaways where there may be more people reporting the commenter than the giveaway maker (okay, probably exaggerating here)! Makes no sense to me. Informing people of the rules =/= calling out :/
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When I first started out on sg, I won The Ship from someone. He gave me The Ship Complete instead of just The Ship. Should he be frozen?
This is misrepresentation in your book, is it not?
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With something like The Ship, I think it would be much easier for that to happen by mistake - listing a complete pack of a game under the name of the main game in it. "The Ship", "The Ship Complete" - very similar sounding, therefore probably not that far-fetched that people would have a bit of an accidental mix-up in the listing. When there are four entirely different games grouped together under a certain name, "Humble Bundle", the chances of making that mistake are very very slim. In theory there could be cases where someone is given a key from someone else and told "this is a key for _____", but that's obviously a case of simple misinformation, where they had no way of knowing. When people make a giveaway for something like the Humble Bundle the chances of them not knowing are very slim (due to reasons named above) and considering a lot of them flat out state "this is a Humble Bundle key that also contains...", obviously most of them know exactly what they're doing.
Although it's often not the intent of the people doing the giveaways, listing a bundle under the name of one individual game can very easily be/has been used to abuse contributor value and get much more than they should be. I think that's what upsets people.
Last I checked I haven't said anything about banning, suspending, or "freezing" people either. I simply stated that what he was saying wasn't the issue at hand and therefore I don't see how "should he be frozen?" is relevant to my comment.
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as far as I know, giveaway bundle games is now allowed. But you only get 20% of the real value + your non-bundle games giveaway must be higher etc. I've seen many peoples list bonus on their giveaway(ex: <insert game's name here> giveaway = "the winner of the giveaway will also get <insert DLC's name here>"), HIB6 can be counted on that category.
That being said, both indie gala and HIB6 are $1 minimum, gifting individual games on Indie gala and get contributor points on each games is far worse than gifting one games on HIB6 and you should keep in mind that Indie gala have Happy hour which will give you more than one copy on each games.
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Giving away individual keys from games is allowed. Humble Bundles vary from Indie Gala bundles as they don't have individual keys, just one key for the whole thing.
Let's say you get 1 point for giving away a below the average Humble Bundle. Torchlight is in the bundle though, and that's 10 points (something like that, I really don't know but it's still more than the bundle). If they list in under Torchlight they get a lot more points and contributor value than if they'd listed it as just a bundle.
The issue isn't so much the misrepresentation as much as it is the fact that they're getting more contributor value than they should with it. If someone offers a game and says winner also gets the DLC, then they're losing contributor value by not listing them individually. They basically screw themselves with that and no one really cares.
By doing that with the Humble Bundle, however (like the example of listing it as Torchlight with the "bonus" of the rest of the bundle), they're getting more contributor value than they should and that's simply not fair. It's cheating the system and people don't like that.
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so, let me use a simple example.
I got both Indie Gala and HIB, both are below average, let's say both have 3 games with 10P value each games.
I giveaway individual keys on Indie gala and get 30P for it.
I giveaway HIB key and listed it as one of the games in it and only get 10P for it.
You basically get more points on Indiegala and pay the same price.
That being said, if Indie gala is allowed but HIB isn't, I can't see any logic in that.
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I honestly don't even care about any of it. A lot of people do though and I think a big part of the issue is that even if you can get more from giving away Indie Gala keys, it's completely allowed to give them away. If you got more value from Humble Bundles or if misrepresenting things wasn't against the rules for whatever reason, I'm sure it wouldn't be as big an issue. The fact that it is against the rules though and that you can use that to get more contributor value than you should is what seems to upset people I think. A lot of people are really uppity about contributor value and don't want people getting more for a giveaway than they're supposed to, especially if they're breaking rules to do it.
As I said before, I honestly don't care. I was only commenting to tell the guy that his comment wasn't entirely relevant to the issue at hand.
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Wrong, both can be given as a pack and get 1P instead. If one of them is allowed, both are allowed.
I honestly don't give a fuck about bundle keys since it is SG first world problem from day one.
And as far as I know, I've never seen such rules you just mentioned, can you paste it here?
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You mean the mispresenting rules? It's in the FAQ under "Giveaways"
"Do not misrepresent the title being given away."
The other relevant rules are here.
"...review that bundle's terms of service to ensure you have permission to do so."
and
"There's no longer a restriction on what games can be given away, assuming they're not guest passes or beta keys"
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While that's true for a lot of indie bundles, it does make a difference with Humble Bundles considering they can't be split into individual keys. It's one key for the whole thing. You don't get very many points for giving away the bundle so they list it under the name of one individual game in it, getting the (much greater) value for that as opposed to the bundle.
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I think the giant hole in this argument is that other bundles give you much more contributor value than the humble bundle. This is almost negligible in comparison. IndieGala, for example, can give you like $90 in contributor value for $2 investment ($1 the first week, then another $1 during happy hour to get 4 more bundles). Yet, you would (probably) not argue against giving away IndieGala keys.
I think it's a similar (obviously not the same) situation if someone makes a giveaway for Worms and say in the description "winner will also get Worms Blast and Worms Crazy Golf."
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Great, well I'm not talking about how this applies to other bundles. I'm talking about how this works with Humble Bundles. It's different from others considering it's only one key, not several to be giving away individually.
Let's say you get 1 point for giving away a below the average Humble Bundle. Torchlight is in the bundle though, and that's 10 points (something like that, I really don't know but it's still more than the bundle). If they list in under Torchlight they get a lot more points and contributor value than if they'd listed it as just a bundle.
The issue isn't so much the misrepresentation as much as it is the fact that they're getting more contributor value than they should with it. If someone makes a giveaway of Worms and says winner gets both those games, then they're losing contributor value they could be getting by not listing them individually. They basically screw themselves with that and no one really cares.
By doing that with the Humble Bundle, however (like the example of listing it as Torchlight with the "bonus" of the rest of the bundle), they're getting more contributor value than they should and that's simply not fair. It's cheating the system and people don't like that.
Once again, since apparently it hasn't been made clear - I don't care about people giving away keys from bundles and I don't care about the misrepresentation in itself. That stuff doesn't bug me and they're not the issue. The issue is people misrepresenting Humble Bundle giveaways in order to abuse the system and get more contributor value.
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Either it's a misrepresentation or it's not. You can't say "misrepresentation because you get more contributor value than you should." You're trying to make exceptions.
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Losing contributor value is misrepresentation, but it's okay because no one cares and it doesn't cause an issue. Okay, gotcha.
I'm trying to find a nice way to say this, but it may be a bit harsh: Do you see how silly you sound? You may not have said this explicitly, but this it is very easy to see that you are implicitly stating this.
(I didn't see if you replied to my other post, but I apologize for posting it. It's not relevant and it's now been deleted)
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I often sound silly.
I honestly don't care. I really don't. A lot of other people do however, and as far as I can tell, that's the thing that bugs people. A lot of people get really uppity about contributor value and don't want people to get it in ways they "shouldn't", so threads like this are made. People shouldn't misrepresent giveaways to lose value either. It's against the rules in both cases. However, when it happens in a way that they're making some sort of gain from it, that's when people get upset.
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Hi, I'm the creator of the Bit.Trip Runner giveaway posted in the first post. I've opened it following this rule an user posted me about in the forum:
http://www.steamgifts.com/forum/vUnIE/important-updates-to-contributor-values-and-bundle-games
I think that, following this rule, my giveaway is legit. Fell free to explain me why I am wrong, if you think I am.
(P.S. I'm just trying to be kind to a site that already gave me games for free. I had this game in my inventory and I preferred to share it with you instead of just givin' it to a friend of mine on Facebook. I just don't see the point of all this reporting and gettin' mad. As I already said, I even asked on the forum if I could and I even had an answer! I'm posting you the rule that allows me! Does this really deserves a report?)
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Inventory games are always okay to give away. Your giveaway is fine, and the OP had no business pointing your giveaway out.
Sorry for all the trouble. The community here isn't as terrible as you think it is - there are just a couple of bad apples here and there.
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No, it doesn't deserve a report and yes, you are following the rules. The OP and some others in this thread are just being mean to you because they feel like it.
I (and probably several others) have reported the OP because he clearly broke the rules by trying to publicly defame you in this thread. Usually, when I report this sort of thing, the OP gets suspended, so don't worry too much about it. I suspect you'll be fine and he won't be rewarded for bullying.
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You are too fixed on the contributor value. They are all in a bundle list so the value is maxed out anyway.
According to Hib TOS you can't giveaway their keys, but that looks rather silly to me. I don't see alot of harm done, only more giveaways ;-)
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As you can read here http://www.steamgifts.com/forum/Ihcl4/how-were-planning-to-fix-bundle-keys-and-contributor-values-option-1-revised I have a maxed out value for this game only for the first 25 dollars of contributions. Seems like it's allowed and considered by the admins. I don't see the point! I had to be twice the careful to give a game away and yet users continues to be half the careful to diss this.
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http://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/0bNrV/gratuitous-space-battles
http://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/zMMZ3/gratuitous-space-battles
http://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/zP9aY/bittrip-runner
This is getting ridiculous
Edit:
SG needs more mods, look how the giveaways of a certain game go through the roof once a bundle is available.
I mean i'm absolutely not against people being generous, but that should happen without breaking the rules.
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