First Discussion! Community Thoughts on Gifts Recieved to Gifts Sent Ratio

Well, it doesn't look good. But during the years I learnt that ratio is not everything, especially when number of GAs can twist it. I've seen people with like <1 ratio with hundreds of wins, but they played most of them, and seen people with thousands of sent games, and 'only' a few hundreds of wins, absolutely untouched. While everyone has the right to play or not to play something, at least for the better stuff I give away I prefer to end up with someone who plans to play it, as I don't think about those giveaways as me throwing money away or getting CV, but as handing out a (potentially) fun time/good experience with that game.
Also many 'leeches' are completely silent, not taking part in the community, so they seem like a blackhole for games - no personality, nothing to think about, just someone swallowing game after game. I do idealize SG a bit too much, but I prefer to think about my winners as people, while those hardcore leeches doesn't feel like one, and that makes me feel uncomfortable - hence my most often used level 2 restriction on public GAs.

I don't really care about ratio, as long as they don't make up excuses on how they are unable to give back anything (just say you don't feel like doing it, it's ok).
I'm more bothered if someone wins only to idle cards or +1 their library. For asset flips and such whatever, someone has to win them anyway and I doubt anyone cares if those are played, but when it's a decent game it would be nice if the winner really has some interest in playing it.

As others have already stated, your ratio certainly wouldn't strike as being good and even annoys some enough to get you blacklisted for sure. Considering how limited the information on user's profile is on this site, ratio is pretty much THE way to judge someone here. I guess you'd have the "redeeming quality" that you've at least commented a lot, so you aren't a silent leech - the type people hate the most. :p

However I wouldn't let it bother you (not saying you were but still) if you get blacklisted a lot for the ratio. The site is still called steamgifts and one can freely join just to receive. Of course someone might say that your chances of winning something good are as low as the level you are on since majority of better games get a level restriction or maybe even a puzzle gate.

Some users want to pay back for what they've won and some would think it unforgivable if you don't give (admittedly I think those who think you MUST give games are taking this site way too seriously) while others just like making giveaways. Those who don't want to feed the leeches will find ways to give their games to the "worthy" after all, there's room for everything.

To be completely honest to me you are a leech with (bad) excuses and I am really not sure what are you trying to achieve with this thread? Pity maybe? Because all you are probably gonna get are blacklists as you probably already noticed.

Do what you want 'cause a pirate is free,
You are a pirate!
Yar - Har - fiddle - dee-dee
being a pirate is all right with me!
do what you want'cause a pirate is free
you are a pirate!

Nobody is required to give anything on SG. Even so, most people expect those who receive to be grateful, and the best sign of gratitude is to use what was received and to make some effort to "give back." You can expect the SG community to look at your playtime and your giving pattern (the amount of money spent over the time spent on the site). Everyone has different circumstances, but at least you will know how you come across to those who judge such things.

Since you asked, my honest opinion is that you do look like a "leech", at least in the context this word is used here -- I would rather say "non-giver" or something less aggressive, but, well... But the way I see it, you are well within the site's rules; you are completely allowed to never ever create a GA. And, if someone does not want "non-givers" to get gifts, Level restrictions in the GA solve that need.

But let me encourage you to try a bit (again, you do not HAVE to, really, do not think I am trying to tell you what to do, just "encouragement"): for example, you could get the current Humble Bundle Tier 1 for $1, and give away those 3 Jack games. C'mon, you must have $1 somewhere there you can dispose of! I am not say this as a "because you would redeem yourself" or something like that -- I am saying this because giving can actually be very rewarding, maybe you will enjoy it!

Well, and I would totally enter those YDKJ GAs myself -- maybe that is the real reason I am encouraging you... :D

Anyway, the TLDR version: it looks bad, but it is allowed. I do not think you are automatically a bastard, but I will sometimes exclude users like you from my GAs (through level restrictions, it is not personal).

Cheers!

This is an interesting discussion!

Personally, I do look at stats/ratio when deciding whether to whitelist/blacklist someone. But I generally look at whether they've made any effort at all to give back, more so than just their ratio.

For example: User A has won 1000 games and sent 100; User B has won 3 games and sent 1; both have been on the site for 3 years. (And let's assume their Real CV ratio matches their standard ratio).

Obviously User B technically has a better ratio (3-1 vs 10-1), but I'd be more inclined to blacklist User B because only giving back 1 game in 3 years just doesn't show any effort at all, and I prefer to give my games to those who make an effort.

Might as well take this opportunity to explain my thoughts on blacklists:

For me, a blacklist does not equate to "I hate you" or "I think you are a terrible person" or "I wish you were banned from this site" or anything else. It simply means "I choose to restrict my giveaways to other users."

It's not a judgement as to someone's worth as a person, or even as a member of this community. I fully understand that there are plenty of users who can't afford to give back, and even more who simply choose not to give back, and that's fine -- this site wouldn't exist without them. (If we all gave 10x more than we received, the math would not work!). I just generally prefer to give games to those who find a way to give back, so I use my whitelist and blacklist accordingly.

For me, the whitelist and blacklist are just tools to help shape my SG experience, nothing more.

Apparently, this discussion lends itself to text walls! :)

Good luck, I hope you find a way to give back since you've expressed a desire to do that.

Well, you could always grab a couple dollar bundles. My mom has next to no disposable income, but she still managed to do some giveaways on her own. Usually I had to give her games to giveaways. Steam wallet is an option if you sell cards. That's usually how I get a lot of my games, besides bundles. I think Tremorgames (however it's spelled) is still a thing.

But really, you should be able to afford at least a dollar to give something back, even if it's just some el cheapos.

I generally don't blacklist for ratios since I don't know what's going on in someone's life (like my mom for example being dragged down with medical bills) but there's still ways to try to give back. Just my opinion

now i know whats up with the description for the giveaway. also the way im seeing it at least you gave away something. it may have been bundled and 2 years ago but ive come across so many people with more won games then you and nothing given out. i dont know if youve played any of them that uve won but even if u played at least 1 its better then all the hoarders who enter just for the 1+ not even bothering to spend 1 minute on a game unless for cards even then they probably use a program to farm it for them

By any sensible definition, someone who's been here 3 years, won 98 games and given away 1 must be considered a leech. More interestingly though, you seem to be in denial...

You were sure to state in your OP, "I'm not the kind of person with disposable income", and yet when people have pointed out you're making excuses for leeching you seem to think you aren't.

As has already been pointed out, you may not feel like you have disposable income, but you demonstrably are "the sort of person" with more than $100 in CS:GO items. This may come as a shock to you - but those items can be exchanged for steam credit, which in turn can be exchanged for games to be gifted. I believe there are several games available on steam costing under $100.

So, yep, you're a leech, which isn't the worst thing in the world, especially considering there are infinitely worse leeches here who make no effort to participate in the community in addition to leeching.

But don't kid yourself - you could give away games if you wanted to, and you choose not to - and that's your decision to make... To be a leech, or not to be a leech.

For those who care about ratio you will look like a leech, yes. Not everyone care about ratio though. Also, you don't have to spend money to contribute to a site (or, rather not spending REAL money). Games in steam drop cards, and even after you got all cards you still have a chance to get booster packs. You can sell those games, and do giveaways for steam wallet funds you got. It's not much, but it's something. And that's not real money, so it does not depends on your income. Also, you can get game keys on sites like tremorgames for making simple tasks when you have some free time. So, if you really care about ratio - you can fix it over time. Good luck.

As I recall, by prior attempts at consensus, it was determined that anyone with a 5:1 or greater ratio is fairly widely considered "a leech", while anything lower than 2:1 was generally considered "leechy". By your stats, it may be more suitable to define yourself as a lamprey. :P
That said, conduct, actual quantity of sent and won, and library size all typically factor in to perceptions on if someone should be considered as a leech, regardless of whether they fall into any sort of classification range for such.

As far as blacklists, they're never a good topic to bring up, and tend to be especially unwelcome when coming from someone with an especially one-sided won ratio, as it generally highlights the entitlement and other negative characteristics that are especially common among users with such stats, to whatever degree that such may be present.
Beyond that, blacklists don't hurt users in any meaningful way, and anyone with a "leechy" ratio is already benefiting from the site to a special degree, so balancing detractions are to be expected by any rational perspective. As such, it already becomes negative for a "leechy" user to bring up blacklists, since it implies there is entitlement to begin with (much like the ratio itself already implies).

In summary, if you present yourself as focusing overly much on the giveaway aspect of the site, then others will reciprocate that focus and analyze you off that perspective as well. If you focus more on how you convey yourself, you'll get more users who reciprocate off that, instead.

People with low values make excuses and complain. If you want to take action on the feedback, do some giveaways and stop trying to justify why you have not given games away.

For example, you could have done giveaways for free games provided by Humble Bundle or other websites. They do not contribute to your CV, but at least it shows some goodwill.

Your exaggerated hand-wringing in this thread is infinitely more annoying than any supposed “leech status.”

OK, a genuine question, please don't take this the wrong way:

You've got loads of cards, items etc. Steam very regularly has heavy discounts meaning awesome games are available for next to nothing.

Why don't you contribute something to the community?

Blacklists, what do they achieve? You are still on this site and can enter lots of giveaways.
Of course, it is not your fault that some other people dislike hypocrites, liars, egoists and anything they may think based on mere statistical facts and comments. After all, this site doesn't require anyone registering to be reasonable, fair and honest etc. No meaningful activities and discussions shall be seriously expected.

I'm not the kind of person with disposable income for anything

Luckily for You, the world is full of disposable money and goodwill of others, isn't it. Cheerio.

Honest answer, from my point of view- you are a professional entitled leech.
Your ratio, your Steam profile, and your thread topic text here, make you look like a complete greedy cad.

Seriously, did you post this thread just to watch your Blacklist number go up and up and up?

When I first started on this site I had good health and a steady job with income and had a great ratio. Then I had a major medical issue occur that changed my whole life and put a huge dent in the wallet so I can't do giveaways like I used to. Meanwhile my win luck turned around after winning nothing here for a long time and eventually my wins were worth more than what I gave away. Because of this some people on this site are now calling me a leech and I have been blacklisted for my ratio by some of them.

Do I care? No. I do what I can and that's all that should be expected of anyone here. I have no one on my blacklist either because I don't judge and no one has done anything that directly effects me to where they need to be on it. But I do have everyone I have ever won a game from on my whitelist so I try to remember them when I can do a giveaway at least.

Don't worry about the few people that might call you out for being a leech. We all have the same tools to view your profile that everyone else does and can base our own opinions by what we see on it but a lot of people here like to bandwagon regardless of the reason. Just enjoy the site and try to give back when you can.

If you're playing your wins, and you're polite, I have no problems.

IN THIS THREAD
people with 300+ unplayed wins telling others they are leeches.

View attached image.

Hey Jordanlol, with regards to your ratio, it looks like you're a leech bastard to me (your words) based purely on that. Without knowing your personal circumstances, I am indifferent to you winning or entering my giveaways. I do favour making my better quality giveaways towards people that do give back as they have made an effort to contribute to the site rather than just taking/winning. Nowadays, even free games from other sites can be given away on steamgifts. You may not get any contribution value for it but your ratio will look better. I suspect its not that important to you but the fact that you are enquiring about it means there is some concern about it. Recognising this is the first step to addressing the issue.

Quite a lot of people I suspect do hand out blacklists based on ratio as not everyone will have time to look at individual circumstances to assess but by being more vocal on the forums may mitigate some of this as people that are active on the site will tend to get noticed more. This can be a double edged sword meaning more whitelists potentially and also more blacklists.

I personally don't blacklist people on ratio but I do if they have been rude, obnoxious or just horrible on the site. People blacklist for many reasons as others have stated so all it means is that they cant see or enter your giveaways and vice versa. I wouldn't worry about it too much as doing anything on the site can get you blacklisted.

Overall, I suspect you are not that different from a lot of the lower level people on the site. Over 900,000 users are on level 0 so they have given less contribution value games than you. You are actually in the top 10-15% approx or so of people on the site. (not sure if those figures are active or total users though). I hope you do carry through your intention to make some giveaways regardless of being bundled or not. If you don't, then that just gives people more reason to blacklist you. Actions do speak louder than words. Hope this helps you in some way, shape or form.

After reading through the thread (that was a long read), I've noticed that the topic of you having "marketable items that you could sell" came up quite a few times, as well as "there's no way you can't spare some money for giveaways" - to wish you've responded with the items having sentimental value, and actually being unable to spare any money towards any kind of giveaway, which established that you have no intention of acting upon your poor ratio, or at least you do not have the will to do so at this time.

With that in mind, the thread's theme seems to indicate that you wish to know the community's opinion on "leeches", however you get a bit... defensive whenever a negative opinion shows itself, as if you are actively defending your situation in face of people who answer your question in a way that is against your favour (and that, while also claiming that the thread's purpose is purely to get a better idea of the community's mindset towards leeches).

Now, bear with me as I get to the point of my initial observation, and come to the conclusion of my thoughts (it's almost 3am and my mind's tired) - I honestly can't tell if you are feeling guilt and this thread's responses were not the ones you were expecting, and in combination with the way you formulated your question... you are feeling targeted when users reply to your thread; chances are I'm reading the situation wrong, but it certainly does feel that way.

Now, with my (rather unclear) understanding of the situation out of the way, the fact is that I am not sure if you are asking us if people such as you are considered leeches, or you are asking us the give you a personal opinion of you, with the focus of your ratio on Steamgifts. With that in mind, here's a response that compromises both cases;

My opinion and conclusion is the following - Yes, your behaviour on Steamgifts is of a "leech", and anyone claiming the opposite is wrong. The definition (as per the SG community) of a "leech" is a person who spends a long time on the website, winning a variety of giveaways but giving very few. Of course, the exact definition may vary from user to user, but generally speaking, it is the same. By all means, you fit this description - and honestly, not all people dislike "leeches" and will blacklist them, but many may do so.

Now, the question that remains is this one: Does this information affect you? Do you feel guilt from your actions? If you feel that your participation in the community is done in a way that feels wrong to you, then you will do all in your power to address the issue at hand by putting aside your indecision to take action. If however, you do not care enough to do so, then yes; you will continue to be considered, by the majority of users, a "leech". And there really is nothing wrong with that - the only things you should ask yourself is, do you think what you are doing is fine, even when the majority frowns upon your behaviour? Then once you come to answer that question, act upon it.

Personally, I see SG gifting and ratio that way - if you had a friend who gave you a gift every once in a while, on your birthday, on holidays, and randomly through the years; Would you feel at ease by accepting those gifts but never trying to give back? In my case, that's how I feel about SG and I will feel extremely guilty when I win games and don't give back when I can. At first I started by farming Tremor coins and redeeming keys to giveaway on SG, then later I tried getting some bundles from time to time and giveaway the keys I did not absolutely need. Then later I caught up with my poor ratio when I had more money to spare, and today I've given more in numbers that I've won - I still want to work on my "value" ratio as I've won so many fantastic games but gave away mostly bundled stuff. Another thing I do is that I do not enter every giveaway I can simply because I can, and instead only seek to enter a few giveaways here and there to balance out between giving and receiving.

Holy shit, this got longer than I wanted to. Sorry. >_<

But yeah, the gist of it is - You are a leecher. Whether or not being one is wrong to your eyes, is in your hands. Being a leecher isn't necessarily wrong as the website allows this behaviour. The question is whether or not you wish to be one, regardless of whatever others may say - the choice is entirely yours.

I think you like to martirize yourself or something for such question. SG is the place where you'll get a BL if you say that "there's too much leeches" and you'll get another if you're the leech - what can i say?

About you, i really hope that you're poor, not that i wish you became poor but i HOPE you don't have money or ways to fix that, because if you do have, you are a leech - deal with it.