Shavua Tov, cg and thank you for your continued SG updates. ^^
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I don't know how I feel about this. I like being able to delete my own stuff, but sometimes a thread is created and there is a lengthy discussion that takes place in the comments between people that does not include the OP. This gives the OP the ability to not only delete their comments, but also everyone else's that commented in the discussion. You can spend many hours or days having a lengthy conversation with someone and want to be able to refer back to it in the future only to find out that it no longer exists even though neither user in the conversation wanted their comments deleted.
I would much prefer a button on the top of the thread that says "delete all my comments from this thread".
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Very good suggestion. I'm hoping cg will seriously consider it; A simply option to purge your thread's content and your own comments (then lock the thread), without affecting other user's comments and replies.
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Definitely. There are conceivably times I would like to delete my original post, but on page 4 of the comments is some data that some people might find critical for other purposes (related or unrelated to the OP). Or, I might be the person relying on that data.
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That makes absolutely no sense, both from a forum management/flow/utility perspective, and from a privacy perspective.
Since the site already allowed for both thread editing and individual post deletion, the privacy concerns relevant to the matter should already have been addressed- thus, allowing deletions seems to only serve as an allowance for trolling and abuse.
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I was about to say - legally the site is bound to maintain the data for a set amount of time at least on the back end should there be the call for any legal action.
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I think it's a reaction to the Facebook drama and new privacy laws in the EU. If you looked around, then most social media sites actually updated their ToS as well.
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True, but I have a feeling that there's a legal obligation for something like this.
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It's all about "personal information". Shitpost and trollthreads hardly count - but well paid horde of lawyers can make a difference xD
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You already usually agreed in the TOS/EULA (and connected privacy policy) that your data (that you voluntarily posted, ie in messages on boards like this one, or the Steam Workshop) could be stored and displayed permanently ("in any medium now known or developed in the future") by you, the board, owners of said board, other users, and/or sometimes the site's partners (ie ad companies) and that the website was not liable/responsible for how other users (or search engines, if applicable) used that info. So, in general, if I don't like how a website or company stores my data (that I voluntarily posted in a public manner), they already had the right to store/preserve/display it, and I already had no legal recourse other than to stop using the site and politely ask them to remove my data, at which point they might or might not do so.
I am very glad that SG allows us to remove data already!
So I sort-of-but-do-not-fully understand someone being upset that an ad company took said public information, compiled it with other information from other users, and used a result (logical or otherwise) in a way that the OP's would not endorse/support. In some ways it (the recent FB drama included) almost seems like a reaction from people who never took the time to read or fully understand the TOS/EULA in the first place. (A friend of mine often tells me "Come on, nobody reads the TOS/EULA/Privacy policies!" Whether they are right or not, I do not know.)
I am sorry and apologize if I offended anyone in this--that was certainly not my intention. I was merely stating how I see things at the present moment. :-)
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The problem is that people don't read the EULA/TOS. Now, your response would be "well then read it", but I'd ponder that what you're asking is genuinely too much.
For example, my iPhone had an update and with it they updated their store's TOS. So, the option you have is to read it... all of it.
So, first you read this, then this and if you want to develop something for the store, then you read this, this, this, this, this, this this, this, this, this, this and this.
Now, if these 12 (+2 for the normal consumer) 2-11 page documents aren't enough, you also have to remember that it's in legal mumbo jumbo. That's on purpose. One reason is to make it harder to read to make reading it a chore, making them read it less. Second reason is to keep the consumer as limited as possible with their rights. Third reason is to give developers as much leeway as possible to let them do whatever they want within the legal limits. Fourth is to cover their ass as much as possible to avoid lawsuits and the situation
like with Android Zucc and his posse.
Technically, you're correct. People technically agreed to what happened to them. But the people were mostly either misinformed or they didn't agree to it to this extent. Sure, the TOS was there, but reading that and having to decipher literally every word in every sentence and understand the legal meaning behind it isn't reasonable.
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ah. Thank you for the response and your reasons!
I don't know that it is too much to expect (only because you legally "swear" to having read it), but it is certainly very definitely inconvenient and annoying. As my local bank manager said when I opened an account, "Here is a whole sheaf of papers covering our legal obligations (all that I just paraphrased in the last 5 minutes in my office!) Try reading these if you have trouble falling asleep!"
I hadn't considered all those docs for an app dev, just the two/three for a regular user. I totally agree with your assessment of why they make them as tedious to get through as they do, especially #3 & 4. One reason I like GOG is they do have the "in plain English" translation of the EULA. :) [Sidenote: I am pleasantly surprised when a EULA on a steam game is easy to read & understand, AND reserves very few rights for the dev/publisher (the "Collectively, 'Us'" people), especially if it is coupled with allowing the user to do a lot with the game (eg modding, streaming etc).]
Also, I tend to just skim EULAs/TOS myself, but pay attention to the sections about licenses, sub-licenses, "can I make a backup," and what they can do with my data. As I read them (admittedly skimming them), most of the rest is fairly standard, varying only from one country to another. So I do understand that the user with little time on their hands would tend to skim or outright skip them, and thus miss what they are agreeing to.
I would say most people did agree to it to this extent, but they didn't mean to. :) It would certainly be nice if software owners also included a "here's what we mean by the legal jargon that we have to tell you & you have to agree to."
Again, I am not trying to offend anyone with my views, just to state things as I see them. I apologize if I offended anyone. :)
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Another thing I forgot to mention was that FB's demographic is getting older and less tech-savvy by the minute. A middle-aged mom who is confused about even using a smartphone is not going to understand most of the ToS and they won't be savvy enough to opt out of data selling apps or modes (like the targeted ads thing), which are on by default usually.
Also, you didn't offend anyone, don't worry :D
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Ah, I hadn't thought about that, but I know exactly what you mean. I've had to walk several relatives/friends through turning off interest-based ads/stories!
Thanks! :D
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Also, off-topic, but while we're on the subject of Zuc, I'm sure you've seen the "G-Men through the series pic"? If not, here it is:
:D
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Now that's a good meme.
So, wake up, Mr. Freeman... wake up and... smell the adsense...
Gordon sees the HQ of Cambridge Analytica when the train doors open
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Nuke everything!
EEEEVERRRYYYYTHINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Ah, so we've moved beyond allowing individuals to delete their own "SG footprint" (which I believe is silly to begin with) and into allowing them to delete content that others also post.
One of the primary reasons society works is the system of checks and balances -- accountability for our words and actions.
This update is one more step toward removing any sort of accountability on Steamgifts.
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So, someone can practically nuke an ongoing discussion when they feel like it? Why should one respond to a topic started by someone if you feel like they may wipe eveything if their opinion isn't popular or acceptable?
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Hmm...
I wonder when a person ask when they can delete their wins? ;D
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Not sure about this. Cheers for letting us know about this cg.
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Yeah, to echo what others said, this seems to go from "convenient" to "excessive". You can already edit and delete your own posts at will; making it easier to delete your own posts is nice, but enabling you to delete what others have posted is rather huge, and open to some abuse. I don't know exactly how it would be used to troll/grief, but I'm guessing people are going to disappoint me with their inventiveness before long. Being able to close the thread seems a decent balance. An added option to nuke all your posts from a thread instantly would be a nice bonus.
There's also a lack of consistency: I can't delete my old, completed GAs (well fine, that data's necessary for the site to function) but I can't delete all discussion on my old GAs either. What if that has data I'd rather not see? I'm guessing that wouldn't be implemented quite as speedily since it's more difficult... but if we had the "nuke all my own posts here" option, it would be a natural fit.
Spoilers: cg will delete this thread before long and deny the feature was ever considered! May Fools! ...no wait.
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people are going to disappoint me with their inventiveness before long
This!
LOL
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yes, keep feeding the cowards that insult, beg, and advertise with more options so they can later claim "i never did that, don't lie about me!".
well, even more reason to keep taking proof of everything 50 times per day.
soon autojoin will be nothing compared to an autoscreenshot script. 👏 👏 👏 👏 👏 👏
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If you are interested in a software that makes taking screenshot a painless process I recommend you ShareX and Greenshot, both do the same more or less, you press a button and the image gets saved directly into X folder you want.
No more copying into paint and then save it yay!
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You can also manually add a cache of the page on the waybackmachine.
I just added one for this page because I never tried it before. It's here
Edit: I don't know how long it takes to show on their site. I cached it 10 minutes ago and can get to the cache with the URL, but when I search for the page on their site, it still says they have no cache. Maybe it just takes a little while before it will show in the search results.
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waybackmachine is the only thing keeping politicians from deleting their nasty stuff from twitter and other social websites, is truly a useful tool
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I suspect the wayback machine will fall victim to a "right to forget" or some other privacy thing in the future.
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Nope. Just nope.
A simple example from a couple of days ago: a totally pleasant newbie creates a thread with senseless insults towards indie developers in general. He gets a really mild adequate reaction in return. Then he closes the thread and creates a new one, where he states that he's asked an innocent question and was attacked by numerous high-level trolls, and adds a pretty offensive poll about those high-level monsters. This community is a nice and sympathetic one, so people say they are sorry for the assholes before them, they ask not to pay attention to blacklists and so on. They stop being so sympathetic when a link to a previous thread is added. So he closes this thread and creates a third one, where he apologizes for other people's behaviour in the previous threads - once again, without context, of course. After links are added again, guess what?
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Time to nuke some of my old, now completely useless GA threads. Thanks! :)
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Why are so many people protesting this? You practically don't remember what you said to your buddies last week, but this here is forever? People with much more "effective" power in the world are allowed to delete tweets, FB threads, forum threads but you're worried if some random gamer acts like an idiot and maybe regrets that later and want to start afresh or wants to hide? Sure there will be perma-idiots and they will get caught or maybe they won't and people will forget about them. It's not the end of the world..
PS. Cheers cg..
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I don't care about trolls or idiots, I just don't want my conversation deleted that I may want to refer back to in the future because the OP decided to delete their thread. The conversation may not involve or have anything to do with the OP, but I may still want to reference it or talk to the person I was talking to. Users here spend hours or days talking to eachother in threads and may want to continue, but now it all can disappear because the OP decided to delete the thread.
The OP can already remove the original post and any of their own comments, why should they have the ability to remove everyone else's conversations?
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because it's their threads created with specific purpose on a site where off-topic is not punishable. besides it's not lifesaving blablalogy
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I don't understand what you are trying to say. What does "off topic not being punishable" have to do with anything? You think people should only be able to post comments if they are on topic and you would want to delete a discussion if people start talking about something in your discussion that isn't on topic? That makes no sense. Just let the discussion flow and allow people to talk about what they want to talk about. You don't have to take part in their conversation and can skip anything you don't want to read. Why do we need to restrict our conversations? If someone posts something that is against the rules, they will be punished and the posts will be edited or deleted. I don't see any reason to censor beyond that.
Nothing on this site if life saving. I don't see what that has to do with anything. Should we just delete 99% of the internet because it isn't life saving?
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I can understand what you try to say but normaly you can save the name/conversation background/sg profile/steam profile or whatever in a text file when you must "fear" that it can disappear at sg from now on at every time.
I save myself much old threads because of comments. So it would be a change for me too.
But when i look back i don't visited all of the saved threads/comments again. It is not so important then i thinked at the first moment.
And i am happy over the possibility to kill a thread. If it is old and unused. Not more from interest. Too much people commented bullshi* in my thread or whatever reason. I have now the possibility to do anything.
On the other side people can use it to hide trolling, scamming, bad behavior and such things.
Let's say it would be a good thing to think if it is possible to find a way to prevent people "abuse" it in any way.
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Seems like a good change... /s
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This one crosses a line. Bad move. Many examples above. This is not a good change. Hopefully you will reconsider.
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I was kind of afraid this would happen... I wish there was a better way to satisfy everyone involved.
This is going to be annoying when you receive a reply and the discussion is deleted before you have time to see it.
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Why I should delete my own thread? This update is so stupid -.-
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Thanks for allowing users to hide proof of stuff they posted and of stuff others posted.
Why not just give the ability to delete comments made to you too. Or hell, just give the ability to edit other users comments in our threads and ga's.
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Hi again,
Another update just went live, giving everyone a little more control over their data. You'll notice a new "Delete Discussion" button, located in the dropdown menu on the right side of your discussions. If you click this new button, you'll see a popup that confirms whether or not you would like to proceed with the deletion. If you choose to delete your discussion, then the discussion, comments, poll, poll answers, and poll votes contained within will all be removed from the site and our database. Since the data is being permanently removed, you will not be able to undo or restore the information, so please be careful with deletes.
Enjoy your week!
Edit: Thanks for the feedback and opinions. Although a few people seemed to appreciate the change, the majority expressed a number of concerns. This change has been reversed, and I'll look into other options for allowing users to remove their personal data from discussions.
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