Should there be a special reward, full CV for bundled games or extra CV for unbundled games, for gifting games from the top of the community wishlist?
There no kind of direct reward. Edit: And I think there should not be.
Giving away a top wishlisted game might get you on a couple of whitelists, which might increase your chances of winning something by quite a lot.
Giving away Clickfarm might get you off whitelists.
Comment has been collapsed.
The good feeling of making someone very happy. Does it seem not enough to you?
Comment has been collapsed.
+1 It always has to be about "value" and "price" and "rewards", doesn't it...
Comment has been collapsed.
Take away that value, price, and rewards and I bet most of the giveaways on this site would disappear and every giveaway would have 10,000 entries. There are a lot of people on this site that give becasue they want to make people happy, but I bet over 95% of the giveaways on this site are solely for the purpose of gaining CV and nothing else. That is why 85% of the giveaways on this site are from bundles because of value, not quality.
Comment has been collapsed.
I'm sure a lot of those bundled GA would disspaear, but I think most of the good ones would remain. It's difficult to think that people gives away 50/60€ games to farm CV.
Comment has been collapsed.
That is why 85% of the giveaways on this site are from bundles because of value, not quality.
That makes no sense at all since bundled games don't give enough value to be worth it. :P
Comment has been collapsed.
I can't tell if you are being sarcastic, so... Bundle games give the most value per dollar spent than anything other than the Humble Monthly. Unbundled games give very little value, even when highly discounted. The most you can get without it being bundled is around 80%. That would give you 5 times as much CV as what you spent while most bundles give more than that.
Comment has been collapsed.
That is why 85% of the giveaways on this site are from bundles because of value, not quality.
Not too sure about that. Sure, a lot of people might give those games to gain CV, but there are also a lot of people that give those games because they're leftovers. Personally if I get a game in a bundle and I'm not interested in it, I give it away here.
Comment has been collapsed.
Yeah, I guess that's true. That is why I originally joined here and where most of my giveaways came from. I often only want 1 or 2 games from a bundle and don't have anything to do with the rest of them and decided I would rather give them away to people that may want them.
Comment has been collapsed.
Obviously it is not to most of the people, that's why there is a reward system, right?
Comment has been collapsed.
I'm pretty sure most of the top (amount and prize-wise) givers would give the same even if there was no reward system (levels) at all.
But we will never know.
Comment has been collapsed.
Probably, but there aren't many of them in the first place.
Comment has been collapsed.
and probably wouldn't be more with the system you propose.
Comment has been collapsed.
Of course there wouldn't be any more people that give for the purpose of making people happy, but more people would start giving these games that are in higher demand because they only care about the CV value and right now the best way to earn CV is from cheap bundle games. Changing the CV system to give more CV for games that are in higher demand would give them a reason to give them away, even if it is just to get CV.
Comment has been collapsed.
what I was saying is that (in my opinion) changing the CV system wouldn't result in more community wishlisted games GAs, because most of them are expensive and undiscounted, and people who farm CV do not give away those games.
Comment has been collapsed.
That all depends on how much extra CV is given. It should be like supply and demand. The more demand for the game, the more CV it gives.
Maybe something like this would be good.
Or maybe there could be an always changing CV system where every day that a game sits on the most wishlisted list it goes up by a certain percent of CV given until it drops down the list. There will be no limit on the amount of CV that it can go up to which means that the more people that want the game the more it will be worth. Isn't that pretty much how the economy of everything in the world works and also the stock market. As demand rises, prices rise, as demand drops, prices drop.
Comment has been collapsed.
Which I don't understand is that why would you reward those people who give games away for CV only? If all they care about is CV, let them whirl for it. And getting more giveaways for those games -I'm not even sure about that- is really a valid reason for that? If people don't create giveaways, then they don't. Why care? If people are trying to get their wanted games through this site instead of buying them, then they're way off base. This is steamgifts not steam store. These are gifts not harvests.
Comment has been collapsed.
I really don't understand what you are saying. If people are going to spend money for the purpose of gaining levels here, why do you want them to give away cheap games that most people don't want. Why wouldn't you want them to give away games that people actually want to play and make this a better quality site?
If there was a really cheap bundle every week of Digital Homicide games, this site would just fill up with giveaways of their games. If the site made the CV system work in a way that gave more CV for good games that people want to play, these people will not be buying the cheap Digital Homicide bundles they can buy games that people actually want to play and make the site a better place.
It doesn't matter what the reason is for them buying the games they buy, what matters is that the people that win the games are happy. The Indie Gala giveaways were complete garbage when I checked and I couldn't even stand to look through them because everyone was just giving away games they got for free.
If people are trying to get their wanted games through this site instead of buying them, then they're way off base.
Why would you not try to win games here that you want? I only enter for games I want to play, that is the whole purpose of the site.
Comment has been collapsed.
Choosing the wanted ones in a bunch of games which are offered? Yes.
Wanting people to give away the games which are wished? No.
Comment has been collapsed.
That's not the point. You can only choose from what people give away. Right now there is a lot of cheap bundle games and not as many higher value games that people want. This is because of the way the CV system is designed.
The system right now is setup in a way that encourages people to give whatever cheap bundle games are available instead of games they feel are good quality that other people would enjoy. If we fix the CV system so that more desired games receive more CV then more games that people want will be given away.
Comment has been collapsed.
I think it would be a very good idea to give extra CV for games that are the most wishlisted. This will make people want to give away those games for the extra CV and it will make the winners more happy, win-win. The problem is, I don't know if it would be easy to implement because of how the site pulls its prices for CV directly from Steam. They would have to add CV values for each individual user here depending on the date they gave the game away and whether the game was one of the top wishlisted games at that time. That would be a lot of extra data and calculations.
Comment has been collapsed.
and it will make the winners more happy, win-win
Vast majority of the community wishlist is made from the latest highly-advertised AAA games, and they gradually sink a little lower every time the next similar arrives. If someone told me that more than 90% of the games given away from the top 100 places of the community wishlist have never been actually touched or gotten past the tutorial level, I'd say they are underestimating it.
Comment has been collapsed.
I have never used the wishlist feature. I figured people would wishlist games they want to play, but maybe I am wrong. What is the point of wishlisting games they don't want, or maybe they think they want them until they get them and realize they are just junk that they were tricked into believing they wanted.
I can definitely understand people not playing AAA games for long, most of them suck, they are so boring. I hate how they get so much attention and praise, but they just rehash the same thing over and over again. I love indie games that have new ideas and mechanics or go out on a limb with controversial subject matter.
Comment has been collapsed.
Last time I made a puzzle which contained two games from the top 10 list (and another unbundled one as an extra). Not enough folks could solve it, so I've ended up with three people entering. Didn't get any CV. Do I feel regret? Absolutely not. Will I do it again? Yes, though I will not create puzzles anymore, maybe in a different way, idk. Do I care? Nope.
Be like me and enjoy the life. ^^.
Comment has been collapsed.
To be fair i dont get CV for a lot of my big games, I think its actually a good idea to give extra CV to those giving away top community wishlisted games. Seems like it wouldn't do much other than prompt people to give away top wishlisted games. The people most likely to do that at the minute, probably don't care about CV anyway, so lets try and get a few involved who do.
Personally I think the whole level system needs a revamp.
Non-bundled full value, bundled get the bundle price for the lowest possible tier. None of this 30% or whatever, just give em what they pay.
Comment has been collapsed.
bundled games already give too much cv, no need to encourage people to spam them even more.
Comment has been collapsed.
yes. you are comparing expensive software which gives a lot of cv even when bundled, with a non-bundled game.
https://www.steamgifts.com/bundle-games/search?q=Rocket%20League
Comment has been collapsed.
Alright, my mistake, Rocket League has been in a Humble Monthly and a HB tier 3 before though, I didn't know that those don't get added to the bundled list. Rust is on the bundled list though.
Comment has been collapsed.
wait, Rocket league isnt bundled? i swear I saw it on a few bundles before. Weird
Comment has been collapsed.
People would just switch to farming Humble Monthly with multiple accounts (oh wait, they already do) whenever a top wishlisted game is in it for full CV and then get some extra for paying less than $2 per game.
I like it the way it is. People are going to exploit the system no matter how you do it.
edit: People who really "don't care about CV" also don't care about what CV others get.
Comment has been collapsed.
I voted 'no' but I think the most wanted games should be removed from the bundle list at least until they fall from the top 100 for example. Rocket League gives full CV (It was in a monthly bundle and in a tier 3) but Rust is in thousands of wishlists and you will not see giveaways for it because it was bundled.
Other examples:
64. Just Cause 3
79. Arma 3
89. Dirt Rally
90. Mad Max
93. Elite Dangerous
94. Oxenfree
97. Party HardAll those games are bundled=few giveaways.
Comment has been collapsed.
And back in the day, Talos Principle. And to a lesser extent, Dreamfall Chapters.
Comment has been collapsed.
So, giving extra CV for those games would cause more people to start giving them away again, isn't that what you want?
Comment has been collapsed.
I voted 'no' for extra CV, but top 100 wishlisted games should not be on the bundle list so we would have more good giveaways instead of Clickfarm ones.
Comment has been collapsed.
I think full value for a bundle game is too much, I would prefer a certain additional percentage, but I don't know how much.
Comment has been collapsed.
Do you think full CV for Arma 3 (number 11 most played game in Steam) or Rust (number 12) is too much? I don't think so.
Comment has been collapsed.
It depends on the rules. If you give all bundled games in the top 100 wishlisted full value, then yes, i think it is too much because other games would be valued too high.
Maybe it would be better if the amount of CV the game gives was directly related to what position it is in on the community wishlist. Maybe something like:
1 gives 150%
2 gives 149%
3 gives 148%
25 gives 125%
50 gives 100%
100 gives 50%
135 gives 15%
Unbundled games would never drop below 100% and bundled games would continue to drop until they get down to 15% at position 135 on the wishlist.
Comment has been collapsed.
I respect your opinion but think otherwise: today, you can get almost $26 of CV spending $1 in a tier 1 bundle. Rust would give you $20 of full CV but you can't get it for less than 14 dollars. Now, you get $3 of CV for it. Is that fair or have any logic?
Comment has been collapsed.
No, it is definitely not fair and that is why we have so many junk giveaways of bundle games nobody wants because they give too much CV, but I don't know how to fix the problem in a fair way and a way that SG could practically implement.
Comment has been collapsed.
Or how about this from another comment I just wrote:
Maybe there could be an always changing CV system where every day that a game sits on the most wishlisted list it goes up by a certain percent of CV given until it drops down the list. There will be no limit on the amount of CV that it can go up to which means that the more people that want the game the more it will be worth. Isn't that pretty much how the economy of everything in the world works and also the stock market. As demand rises, prices rise, as demand drops, prices drop.
Comment has been collapsed.
A dynamic CV would spend too many CPU cycles in the server, constantly calculating levels for all users, I bet that will not happen.
Comment has been collapsed.
I don't think anything in this thread will happen because it is all too complicated. They have the system they have now because it is simple and just grabs the price directly from steam. It just has to check the date the game was given away if it is on the bundle list and then do 1 calculation to get the value.
Comment has been collapsed.
Well, my suggestion could be done manually each week/month. There are only a few bundled games in the top 100 (those 7 I posted plus Rust).
Comment has been collapsed.
lol, I don't think anything manually will get done on this site weekly or monthly :)
Comment has been collapsed.
The bundle list is managed manually on a daily basis ;)
Comment has been collapsed.
It will also cause problems with people who create giveaways because someone will always be upset about how much CV they got when they gave the game away last week and how much someone is getting now. There needs to be a way to decide CV without someones personal opinion making choices. Everyone will think their favorite game deserves to get full CV while a large group of other people will say it's trash. I don't think the CV of individual games should be based on anyone one persons opinion of the game.
Comment has been collapsed.
Everyone will think their favorite game deserves to get full CV while a large group of other people will say it's trash.
That's why the OP suggested to take the community wishlist as reference. It's not based on opinions, it is based on the most wanted (or most expensive) games to give. Supply and demand. To satisfy that demand you need to reward the givers with full CV, as simple as that.
Comment has been collapsed.
Then someone will create a group with enough people to have everyone whitelist a certain game to get it into the top 100 for a certain period of time so they can all give it away and get full CV, then remove that game and add the next one they want to give away so that all their giveaways will always be full value. I don't know how many people it would take to get a game into the top 100, but it's probably possible.
Comment has been collapsed.
LOL
Now seriously, there are enough ways to farm CV easier than creating a group of more than 100,000 members (or even more) to be able to influence the community wishlist xD We are almost 1 million members, all wishlists are taken into account.
I only want to see better giveaways here and reward the givers accordingly, that's all.
Comment has been collapsed.
I don't think it would take anywhere near 100,000. I was thinking it would only take a few thousand. A lot of people don't use the wishlist feature like me, I have never added a game. Anybody that already has the game wishlisted counts and they just need to bump it up enough to break past the number 100 spot. Also, I think the top wishlisted games do not work solely on the number of people that have it wishlisted, but also on how the game is trending on wishlists. Having a bunch of people add it at the same time can make it jump up higher.
Here's a quote directly from CG from this post.
As you'd expect, the page looks at wishlist data from our community. It focuses on active users to prevent outdated information, and gives preference to games that have been more recently added to wishlists, in order to not only find what's frequently wishlisted, but also games that are on the rise.
It focuses on active users which means it is probably only looking at around 250,000 users or less. I think I checked around a year ago and saw that SG had a little over 200k unique visitors per day. This counts everyone that visits the site though, not just registered users.
Yes, they could fix that and make it 100% based on just the number of people that have it wishlisted, but I think it would be possible for a group if 2 or 3000 people to get a game into the top 100 even if it was solely based on the total number that have it wishlisted. The top few games may be wishlisted by 100k people, but I bet as you go down the list, the numbers drop drastically. I wouldn't be surprised if by number 50 is was already down to around 10k and by 100 less than a few thousand.
Comment has been collapsed.
It focuses on active users
Then I was wrong and you'll need a smaller group, but I have the same opinion, it does not worth the effort considering how easy is to farm CV. There are several small private groups here with the sole purpose of level up.
Comment has been collapsed.
Because extra CV is not the same as full CV. I understood 'extra CV' as: "you will get more CV than normal".
Comment has been collapsed.
I also wrote "full CV for bundled games" which is pretty much what you where talking about. But whatever you wanna vote is fine.
Comment has been collapsed.
I changed my vote but you should have not mixed "full CV for bundled games" with "extra CV for unbundled games", or at least you should have added more choices to the poll.
Full CV: OK
Extra CV for unbundled: NO WAY
Comment has been collapsed.
i'd rather give 5% for bundled games, except the top 100, those can remain at 15% like they are now. <3
Comment has been collapsed.
I don't think 15% is enough to get people to buy more copies after the bundle has ended. You hardly ever see giveaways for previously bundled games unless someone has an old key lying around that they got from a bundle. Even at 50% I don't think there will be a lot of giveaways unless the game has a large discount around 75% or more.
Comment has been collapsed.
well, i'd rather have less of those games in giveaways than people stockpiling on price glitched games and old bundles.
Comment has been collapsed.
People will stock pile price glitched games no matter how the CV system here works, so that is irrelevant.
As for old bundles, I think the additional CV given for games that are the most wishlisted should be given at any time they are in the most wishlisted, whether it is before, during, or after a bundle. So there is no reason to stockpile bundles when you can get the extra CV from the start of the bundle.
Comment has been collapsed.
it's not irrelevant, those games remain "bundled" like jc3 and no one can exploit them.
Comment has been collapsed.
That ruins the site though because keeping those games as bundled stops anyone from making giveaways for them while everyone just creates giveaways nobody wants like clickteam. There is always going to be ways to cheat the system, why not encourage giving away good games while cheating the system instead of giving away junk?
Comment has been collapsed.
instead of giving away junk?
Junk is a subjective term. Who gets to decide what is junk and what isn't? ;)
To me, Just Cause 3 is junk.
Comment has been collapsed.
What I meant is that most people here do not decide what they want to give away. Their giveaways are based on whatever gets bundled for the best price. Most people do not give games because they played and enjoyed them, they give whatever will give the most CV for the cheapest price so they can level up.
I agree with what you say and I think most AAA games are junk. I get much more enjoyment from indie games. I (or, I should say "we") have talked about this in the past here.
Comment has been collapsed.
I decide what I want to give away, and that's all that matters to me. I'm easy like that.
IMHO people should be happy anyone is giving away anything, especially after reading the forums for a while and realizing why some people give away particular games.
People spend too much time worrying about how much CV someone else is getting, thinking they should get more, or someone else should get less. I have better things to do than worry about what level or how "generous" someone else is. It takes too much time away from gaming. ;)
And yeah, I remember that conversation. ;)
Comment has been collapsed.
I think most people here treat SG as a game and a status symbol just like they do with their steam accounts. They want the highest level on Steam and the most games, just so they can show off and feel more important (bigger e-peen). SG is the same, I think there is 2 main reasons people spend money to level, as a status symbol with other members here or to get the benefit of being able to enter higher level giveaways.
Of course there are the members that are here just for the community or because they want to give games to make other people happy, but there are very few numbers of them compared to the hundreds of thousands of users.
I dabble in a bit of everything. I mostly give because I buy bundles where I only want 1 or 2 games and I have nothing else to do with the rest of the games so I figure why not give them away to someone that may want them. I also enjoy giving games that I enjoyed playing or just good games that other people want because it feels good to give, but that is more rare because I don't have much money to spend. I also enjoy doing puzzles and talking with people in the community. I don't always have something to say, but I check every thread that is created :)
Comment has been collapsed.
or to get the benefit of being able to enter higher level giveaways.
Because there are so many high level giveaways. :X
The status thing I can see, I guess. But whatever, don't much care about status myself, either, or I'd probably be less outspoken and honest, haha. It tends to get me into more trouble than it's worth sometimes.
Yeah I'm in the same boat - give away what I can, when I can. Such is life. But it also gives me an appreciation of others in that same boat. I don't see the difference between someone who doesn't have much giving away bundled games when they can and someone who has money giving away $60 games all the time.
I guess it's just perspective. I'm odd like that.
Comment has been collapsed.
Yeah, not much point in leveling to gain odds in winning. I don't think people realize this until they get there though. I would say it's worth it to level to about level 5, after that it becomes cost prohibitive to level and there are not many giveaways. I would say gaining any levels after that should be more about giving for the purpose of giving and not to win because you will most likely spend more money getting there then you will win back from giveaways.
I hate the idea of using my steam account as a status symbol or social media, I use it to play games. My account is almost 11 years old and I just recently was forced to level 13 because I voted on a single game in the steam awards. I like to keep it as basic as possible.
Edit: That may also partly be due to the fact that I'm an antisocial loner :)
Comment has been collapsed.
Why does it matter if something is on the community wishlist? No matter how many people want the game, there will always be exactly one winner. So long as there is at least one person who really wants each game being given away(hint: there always is), the giveaway is of the same value. Of course, people enter for games they don't want, and that makes certain games more likely to go to people who'll never play them, but the mistake there is on the people entering for games they don't want, not those giving them away.
Comment has been collapsed.
The problem is that everyone gives away junk bundle games that nobody wants just because it gives them the most CV for their money. If you create an incentive for giving away better games that people want, more people will create giveaways for them. Better quality games will make the site more enjoyable instead of just giving games that people enter for just to +1 their steam account.
Comment has been collapsed.
The problem is that everyone gives away junk bundle games that nobody wants just because it gives them the most CV for their money.
No, that is not why they do it. They do it because they have already bought the bundle and had no other use for those games. Or at least, that's what the majority does. Making some games give more CV won't change that. The reality of the matter is, the majority of people don't buy games to give them away, be it for CV or just to genuinely make people happy. People buy bundles for themselves and giveaway the leftovers.
Things like Clickteam Fusion are an exception, of course, but I don't see that we should change the rule to handle an exception.
Comment has been collapsed.
Funny how there is a lot of level 1 users suddenly deciding that the website should be changed or mocking others for giving away bundle games when they've barely given away a handful of bundle game themselves.
Comment has been collapsed.
Yes, I'm literally laughing my ass off. And I'm mocking others for giving away bundle games. And I have no rights to express my thoughts because I don't have hundreds of bucks to spend on steam gifts for other people. Please excuse my audacity.
Comment has been collapsed.
You don't have to laugh at someone to mock them, referring to people who give away bundle games as "C.V. farmers" is enough. Did you consider than not everyone here is rich? Maybe bundle games are the best some people can do. The fact that people are giving their hard earned money to strangers at all should be celebrated.
Comment has been collapsed.
I never mocked anyone or complained about people gifting bundled games. You must have mistaken something. I never even said that gifting bundled games should be rewarded less, all I said is that I think gifting great games that are wanted by the community should be rewarded better.
Comment has been collapsed.
I feel like there definitely should be some kind of reward to encourage people to gift nice games instead of a bunch of bundled stuff only to farm CV.
There are nice games in bundles. Many of them are great games.
Comment has been collapsed.
+1 some of the best games I've ever played came from bundles.
In fact, The Black Watchmen, given away free recently, is just fucking AMAZING (though I bought it because my luck sucks lol)
Comment has been collapsed.
That's why gifting a great game like Rust should be rewarded with the full CV instead of just 15% because it was bundled.
Comment has been collapsed.
CV and level is total overrated. Receiving full CV shouldn't matter.
Comment has been collapsed.
Concerning the bundled CV, to take things in perspective, it only takes 333400 ten cent bundled games with 15% CV to level up ten times in a row on SG. <3
A part of my CV is also from mostly spare 10 cent bundled games that I use in my SGTools trains but I still get a lot of entries for those bundled games so there's definitely a proverbial market for bundled games as I'm not forcing people to join them. ^^
Comment has been collapsed.
I still get a lot of entries for those bundled games
The +1 is strong in this community :)
If there was a limit in our wishlist and you could only enter in wishlisted giveaways, there would be thousands of them with less than 5 entries or even 0 entries considering the amount of trash in Steam's catalog.
Comment has been collapsed.
The +1 is strong in this community :)
And it can be strong as there's nothing in the SG rules against entering giveaways even for +1 and knowing this is SGv2 without special rules. :-)
Also if giveaway creators have a problem with that they can use a variety of tools and giveaways like group, puzzle, WL, BL, SGTools and others.
Comment has been collapsed.
No and there shouldn't be.
I've never given anything away for cv and I'm tired of people devaluing games (claiming that bundle games are shit) simply because they have been bundled. I buy bundles for myself and give away the games I already have or don't want. Some of them are far better than AAA games, while others are complete shit. You can't put them all in one basket when it comes to "quality". There are odd occasions where I will buy a game just to giveaway because I like it or it seems good. If I wanted to farm cv I would join the Clickteamfuckfest.
Comment has been collapsed.
When I say "a bunch of bundled stuff only to farm CV" I'm referring to giveaways for Clickteam Fusion or the "One Dollar Mega Bundle" from BundleStars for example. I don't mean to devaluate bundled games in any way. All I was saying is that I think gifting great games, even if they have been bundled before, should be rewarded better.
Comment has been collapsed.
I can see where you're coming from, but I think the current system is still better in the long run to reduce abuse. Even with the occasional clickteam type flood.
There will always be people giving away great games regardless of the cv value. Also my other posts may have seemed more aggressive than intended :P
Comment has been collapsed.
the best reward you can get.... its that Warm fuzzy feeling you get inside :)
Comment has been collapsed.
Since I'm fairly new to this side I have to ask: is there any reward for gifting Community Wishlisted games, like extra CV or full CV for bundled games?
If not I feel like there definitely should be some kind of reward to encourage people to gift nice games instead of a bunch of bundled stuff only to farm CV.
Rocket League or Rust for example, those games are in the top 50 of the Community Wishlist and where bundled before. If someone is gifting those games he gets less CV than someone who's gifting Clickteam Fusion for example, a software only a handful of people would actually use. That seems like a huge flaw to me.
I don't mean to complain, I just saw this thread yesterday and it got me thinking about this. https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/NsA83/is-this-clickteam-fusion-25-spam-legit
So what do you guys think about this, isn't it something that would make the reward system better?
Comment has been collapsed.