What tier celebrity are you?
That's because mine is an old one and yours is a very recent one in HD 1920 × 1080 with all the possible angles!!!
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Good one xD But still... that damned horse armor :/
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You obviously meant this as a joke, but impersonating a Staff member, begging for games, and threatening other users are all very serious matters. You want to avoid any possibility someone could mistake your intent regarding those subjects, even when joking. In fact, it would be better to avoid them altogether. Consider this a warning and take more care with future posts.
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All staff members have a text next to their username indicating their position, yours being "(Moderator)", so NO ONE can impersonate a staff member.
Nowhere in his post does he beg for games, if he is begging for anything it's for GIVEAWAYS. Is that against the rules too?
Threatening other users is NOT against the rules. If it is, then why have those hundreds of people who write something like "Comment in this giveaway or you will be blacklisted." in their giveaways not been suspended?
And the most important point of all, this was a JOKE. Do you know what a joke is?
noun
1.
a thing that someone says to cause amusement or laughter, especially a story with a funny punchline.
Seriously, SG staff these days...
You should give a warning to arfeu as well then:
Oh so cg is using multiple accounts. Nice..
Insinuating that cg is using multiple accounts as a joke. MUST BE BANNED IMMEDIATELY!
Well one doesn't just disobey the owner of the site
Insinuating that zeruel132's comment is true as a joke. MUST BE CRUCIFIED AND HAVE THEIR ORGANS FED TO DOGS ASAP!
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Let's be honest here, literally no one can mistake me for cg. There's just no chance.
My profile pic is different. My name is different. The link leads to just the "new giveaway" page. The blue tag shows I'm the OP. My language is ridiculously aggressive and over the top. I appreciate what you're trying to do, Khalaq. The "better safe than sorry" thing is all fine and dandy, but right now you're just barricading the sidewalk because someone might fall and break their neck. Your intentions might be pure, but this is a bit much.
The thread was meant for sillyness as the description of the thread says. So, let's not ruin it.
Thanks for keeping an eye out and all, but there's no need to stress over this :)
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You felt free to make the joke because you felt safe from it being misinterpreted by other people. I felt the need to warn you to be more careful because I have had to deal with both those who "only did what someone else did" and those who misinterpreted a "joke." Context is often lost when it comes to the Internet. (Revilheart, for example, quite obviously missed my point.) In real life, you can always add an "I'm only joking!" when you perceive misunderstanding in your audience, but timing may be an issue over the Net. That is why many people include disclaimers or otherwise notify their readers not to take their words seriously. To cloud things further, we also (unfortunately) have trolls on the Net, and they say and do various, anti-social things, all the while claiming to be "joking," and they are liars.
Perhaps you were not thinking about those things when you wrote what you wrote. I was thinking about them when I responded. If my warning helps you (or others who have read this) to avoid possible trouble in the future, then I have achieved my goal.
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Do explain how I missed your point, because I'm pretty sure I got it perfectly.
It's one thing to make a joke (though it's not even funny) like:
Please give me games!
And another to make a joke like:
Hello, I am cg. Click this link to feed me games. If you don't, you'll be banned!
It could be seen the same as saying:
Hello, I am Beyoncé. Click this link to feed me your soul. If you don't, you'll die!
There is a very clear understanding that the first quote can be seen as begging for games, regardless of it being a joke or not. But the last 2 quotes are obviously jokes, there is NO way that they could ever be true.
And again, the 3 points you raised in your original comment are not true:
So even if his comment was NOT a joke, which is IMPOSSIBLE, those 3 points woult NOT be valid.
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This is all just support's laziness. They don't want to deal with the tickets from the idiots who take these jokes seriously, so their solution is to not allow the jokes at all.
Their goal is not to make this community a better place (the jokes actually contribute to that), their goal is to make their job easier.
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yeah, the lazy mods... CG should decrease their salary!!!
oh wait, they work for free? probably they just want to save time for more important tickets like New winner requests...
if you just wanted to make a joke: sry, its sometimes pretty difficult to see if someone is joking... thats why jokes are OK, But shouldnt be made about some topics like SG premium or begging for something
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Working for free is no excuse for lazy work. They volunteered for it.
I wasn't joking. Not allowing certain jokes to be made because of possible increase in tickets by people who do not understand the jokes and take them seriously is the lazy approach.
Coming down on jokes about begging I can get on board with, because begging is against the rules. But coming down on jokes about SG premium? That's not against the rules. So what if some people believe in it and open tickets about it? It's not that hard for support to reply "SG does not have a premium subscription system, that user was joking." There could be even a bot that automatically replied that if the word "premium" or something was in the description of the ticket. And the user could always, you know, read the FAQ and Guidelines to find that out.
Sacrificing certain jokes for the sake of saving time for other tickets should not be acceptable. If time is the reason for this strange behavior that the mods have, then the solution is to hire more mods.
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"Working for free is no excuse for lazy work. They volunteered for it."
but isnt it against the meaning of lazyness? they work for free, they dont need to do it but they want to spend their time to help here. probably you should try to join the support team. this way you could speed things up and answere all the support tickets, the other cant handle ;)
probably you should post your idea in the suggestion section^^
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In all honesty, I get the premium account thing. You might not know the site and it might be confusing. Fair enough, right? Some sites have subscription models and premium services and this wouldn't be anything new.
But it's a whole other thing to see an account's name, them saying everything in the most exaggerated way possible, claiming to be someone else and then giving a ridiculous threat about something that can't be threatened over, all to an account that isn't new to the site or anything. Plus, the link leads to the new giveaway page. If anything, it'd inspire a giveaway or two just for the joke of it.
This just disrupts the community and the rules are too arbitrary to follow. This goes beyond common sense at some points. I don't dislike the rulemakers or the enforcers, but I do dislike that they blindly follow the rules and don't actually make decisions based on the context.
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You might not know the site and it might be confusing.
Or you can read tos/faq/guideliness. But yeah - I stopped joking like that. It took me a while to realise that minority read rules before taking part in activities that are described there (like creating gas, posting on forum and so on).
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I got suspended once for making a thread joking about begging for games. Basically some idiot thought when I was asking for what game to buy next and showing my public wishlist that you can already see was begging. Like all I wanted to do was make like 4 clicks into one but directly linking it seemed to be begging, but people putting polls isn't.. So I made a joke thread and got suspended for like a week or something.
Basically I wouldn't joke about it, its against the rules and all that.
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Your suspension sounds like yet another case of power-hunger by mods. It's unfortunate what SG has become...
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Yeah I came back because I know that the community can be pretty supportive sometimes and so Ally and I linked our twitch in a puzzle thread he made. Previously I got warned but I thought you had to make a giveaway alongside advertising as my previous thread got taken down after the giveaways ended and nobody bumped the thread for like 3 weeks. So anyway, we made a thread and then I get suspended... It was funny because whoever reported me failed to report someone else that had a thread open for 3 months with just a link to their twitch with no giveaway. So that user clearly hates me and Ally lol.
Supposedly the rule is you have to put ads in giveaways but its not very clear in the rules.
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I believe that if the rules of the site were completely clear, with 0 room for interpretation, and that the mods were consistent with their suspensions, the community would be a much better place.
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Hopefully, I have clarified my thought process while still keeping my responses civil, polite, and professional. If any of the above remains unclear, please let me know.
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This makes more sense, but it's also quite contradictory to the original post.
Zeruel132 didn't break any rules.
Fair enough, but you did essentially give me a warning. I hope you understand that you're in a position of power and so, your choice of words has a different meaning to a regular user. So, if a friend says "I'm giving you a warning", you know that it's informal. When a cop says "I'm giving you a warning", you'd assume it to be a formal warning and essentially be a punishment for doing something that's not allowed, breaking the rules.
If he had actually done any of the things I listed, I would have suspended him and we would not be having this conversation.
Just to let you know, that doesn't seem to be normal protocol then as I've seen people be warned before getting suspended before for issues similar or even same as mine. If I'm correct then I've even seen you do it. It's fine that you do and that you actually give people a chance before punishing them. It's just that this doesn't seem to line up.
These are all extremely sensitive topics on the site and should be treated as such. /.../ To use a parallel in real life, you can make jokes about bombs in an airport, but it is still not wise to do so.
That is false. Maybe it's true in the circle of staff, but it's not in the public. An example of where impersonation would be a taboo subject and making a joke about it would be inappropriate would be the trade forums, where it does matter. Taboos tend to come from a type of danger or disdain for something in specific. For example, on SG, the more common taboos would be regifting, not activating wins, using bots and "leeching". There are also social stigmas that this community as a separate social ecosystem has had at some point or another. Like making political posts or asking simple questions that can be answered by the FAQ. These are examples of sensitive topics.
Impersonation, solicitation and misrepresenting rules are not taboo because they don't affect us. The system in place basically voids impersonation, solicitation always requires the victim to voluntarily give something away and misrepresenting the rules isn't an issue because we have the guidelines and the FAQ which cover most of the basics.
Maybe you can prove me wrong by people getting angry at someone even mentioning impersonation on SG in specific or threads being made about someone begging for a game on the forum. If it truly is a sensitive subject like you claim it to be, then the community's reaction to these things would be according to the offense. I personally, have not seen any. Maybe one or two, but that's from my tens of months on this site, it'd be weird if no one reacted negatively.
My initial response was not only for the benefit of Zeruel132, but also to make it clear to anyone who either a) took it seriously
Fair enough. It's hard to prove either way, so I'll concede and say that there really are so many dummies that can't read usernames, get confused by exaggerations and can't figure out what the "new giveaway" tab is.
In this way, I warn Zeruel132 that there are people out there who are too dense to pick up on his included "obviousness and insanity" while also discouraging the trolls from taking his example a step further and then claiming "it was OK when he did it."
It's like the site The Onion and the subreddit r/AteTheOnion. Basically a satirical news site that now has a subreddit dedicated to people who believed what they spewed and now believe their jokes to be real. And if you actually look at them, you see that they do exist and they're essentially the same people that you are trying to protect. And it should show that at some point your gains are outweighed by the losses. Yes, you might help a confused dummy, but at the same time you confuse a few users, make some over time dislike you and unlikely to co-operate with you and more likely to break site's rules, which'll create more issues for you. These are the people that can't be helped. If we did account for them, then single sentence comments would turn into paragraphs which would basically nip all the confusions in the bud before they even emerge. Sure, it'll be good for them, but it's unreasonable. So, we either ruin our own jokes by pointing them out, which usually ruins them and add all ways to remove confusion to almost any post. Or we just live and let live for the most part. Only intervene with something like that if it's genuinely confusing.
I'm glad you're down with using this as an example on a future thread. I'll try and think of how to make that thread in the meanwhile :)
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If you had left it alone like it was intended to be, it would most likely not have gotten as much attention.
It seems to me that your comments do more to draw attention than mine.
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Context is often lost when it comes to the Internet.
Which is why I added the extra level of obviousness and insanity. "Feed me games"(completely opposite to the way cg types), "This link"(which leads to a new giveaway tab, not to some donation box. The context is obvious. CG owns the site so technically it's like feeding him by feeding the site. Simple association.), "If you don't, you'll be banned"(a ridiculous ultimatum for something that isn't mandated by the rules of the site.), ">:("(just to show that I'm joking even further by adding a dumb exaggerated emoticon to the end). There's nothing that could be construed as something could break a rule.
Revilheart, for example, quite obviously missed my point.
I don't think he did. He was just being overly aggressive. He had similar thoughts as me and as many others seem to as well.
In real life, you can always add an "I'm only joking!" when you perceive misunderstanding in your audience, but timing may be an issue over the Net.
How was the timing an issue? But the "I'm joking" part is replaced with exaggeration in texts. Forms of communication adapt. In normal conversation, people often don't add "I'm joking" and if they do, they're the same people who would also respond to other people in comments by pointing out the joke. One, it kills the joke. Flat out. The funny part about these jokes has never been just the words, but instead the combination of the subject, tone and the imagination of it being real. That's why the most popular jokes on the Internet are chains of comments/posts of people going along with the joke. Immersing themselves in a stupid and impossible situation.
That is why many people include disclaimers or otherwise notify their readers not to take their words seriously.
Untrue. The only thing that really exists in other communities is /s and greentexts. This wasn't sarcasm and we don't have greentext and it's not in that format or style. The joke I did was the most basic "in-role" joke. These have never had disclaimers to them.
Perhaps you were not thinking about those things when you wrote what you wrote.
It was. That's why my previous comment went through every single reason I could come up with as to why I didn't break any rules and why a normal human being couldn't mistake it for anything other than a joke.
If my warning helps you (or others who have read this) to avoid possible trouble in the future, then I have achieved my goal.
Look... as I said before, I know you're trying to help. It's just that all this does is make everyone less interested in using the forums. Maybe that's just better for you and you won't see a problem in it, but I think the community does. Killing the discussions kills the community, which in turn kills the longer duration visits, which can in turn reduce active user counts. This doesn't harm anyone.
The only people that this could affect might be people with a more serious level of autism or something else like that. Now, that's fine. They might have that issue. But if we went down your route, then for example television would be screwed. The reason is that we now have to account for the extremely small minority of people who can't distinguish reality for drama and jokes from truth. I've gone the extra mile to make sure it's perceived as a joke. They have to take a step as well and think for a second before they act.
I'd like to make a thread about this topic and use this as an example with both our reasons and responses, including the one that you'd respond with, if you respond. Of course, as per the rules, I won't use your name and I won't even say that it was me that was in that situation. I hope you're down to have the community chip in on this question. Either of us could be right here, so I'd like to see if I'm genuinely just completely misguided right now.
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You said it perfectly. :)
Yes, I'm often a bit aggressive when expressing my thoughts when I see something ridiculous, but I have lost all respect for SG staff for a long time now, so I tend to go a bit over the board when I see a staff member doing things like these. That shouldn't be excuse to disregard my points though, like Khalaq did.
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A thread about those topics which are taboo on SG, and why they are, and how their being taboo affects those of us on the site, sounds like a good idea to me.
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Lol, I knew there would be someone saying this.
It doesn't matter if I was funny to you or not. What matters is what actually happened. If something like this is so hard to understand for you, then it'll be best that you learn from life before talking about stuff like this. You're seeing this at the most shallow level possible and while it's still valid criticism, it'll be based on insights that a egocentric aged children can make.
I didn't walk any policy infringement tightrope. I made a joke that touched on the perceived heavyhandedness of the authority of the site, the community members that demand gifts at a rapid rate, the blatant mockery of impersonators and that was all with a tinge of exaggeration.
And just so you know, not all comedy has to be funny. Many jokes rely on relatability and social commentary. :D
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No, you shouldn't have. You did the right thing by saying this.
I made a mistake by saying that you should "learn from life before talking about stuff like this". You shouldn't. You should always (if you want to, of course) stand up and take a hit. There's always a chance you'll be hit back even stronger. But from that you'll learn about discussions and how to handle certain subjects and so on. The best way to learn is by doing and you did well.
I was the one who went maybe a bit too aggressively.
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I think my other points are valid, but just remember to always take a shot. Don't know much about something? Well, how else will you learn? Watching/reading material on it is one thing, but there's nothing more funny/embarrassing to see a person who obviously has looked into material that they agree with, trying to articulate their arguments by basically using the ones that they've heard someone else use. You counter that argument and see their whole point just collapse with them not knowing what to say because they've only thought it through one dimensionally. Just because they saw no rebuttal to their "gotcha" argument doesn't mean that one doesn't exist.
You were being a smartass with your "tone", not with your actual point. Your criticism is valid, to an extent. But it's most definitely a piece of criticism that very one dimensional and shallow.
There's nothing more commendable than a person who not only sees that they're wrong, but also who admits it. I'm not saying I was right and you wrong (because in discussions like these, there don't tend to be objective rights and wrongs), but instead if someone does "get you", then you don't just descend into non-sense, anger and repeating of the same argument, you don't just disappear, but you instead just concede. It's an admirable quality that I, myself, am trying to hone down. Sometimes I'm successful, but sometimes the thrill of "being right" just sucks me in.
Keep doing what you're doing, my man :)
Whitelisted <3
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Understand that not everyone on this site has the same understanding of English even if many can do basic posts, and machine translations that others may use are far from perfect. They might see a joke, fail to understand it is only a joke and believe that is acceptable behaviour. The next thing they know, they got slapped with a suspension for what the other user got away with.
While a suspension for something when the user was only joking might sound unfair, it is far less likely that someone else may think it is acceptable if they see a user get in trouble for the post.
Also, you might be surprised to find out how many users were only joking when it wasn't obvious even to the support members that are native English speakers. :P
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And what is unacceptable about begging a user to make giveaways? Because that is what the joke does. Although the joke does not even beg, it demands, which makes it even more a joke. So even if a moron saw the joke and thought it was acceptable behavior, they would not be slapped with a suspension for begging users to make giveaways.
If begging for giveaways is against the rules then the FAQ and Guidelines have to be updated.
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I'm explaining why jokes typically aren't accepted, not why a specific joke isn't accepted. People can obviously still joke about most stuff here, but topics like begging are something we will come down on.
And really, if someone popped up and demanded others make giveaways for games they want to enter (especially expensive titles), that would be unacceptable in my opinion. I've seen a user make a topic demanding someone make a private giveaway for a $60 new release and give them the link. They believed that since they weren't expecting it was straight given to them, that it was somehow fine. I would hope no one else would think there is nothing wrong with that.
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Still, we are not responsible for the ignorance of other people. If someone doesn't know English well enough to detect a joke or sarcasm, that's their problem. We should not be held accountable for it. Let them face the consequences, who cares if they will be slapped with a suspension? That's what support is for. You can try to prevent rule breaks from happening, but not by punishing people who are not breaking any rules because they could be inspiring people to break rules. That's just wrong. That's like blaming TV and video games for mass shootings.
I personally don't see a single problem with allowing people to beg for games at all, but since the rule of the site is to not beg for games, I see a big difference between that and begging for giveaways. Your example is very specific, but what if someone made a thread begging people to make a public level 0 giveaway for a game? Their chances of winning such giveaway would be very low. So even though they would be indirectly begging for a game, their chances of getting that game would be almost impossible, so they wouldn't really be begging for it, they would be begging for a chance to get it.
And really? The price of the game has influence over the begging? So if I beg someone to give me a free game, that's ok?
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Actually, there are two points in the Guidelines related to solicitation.
- Do not beg users or developers for keys or gifts, whether in comments, or chat....
...and ...
- Do not ask users for payments or donations for any reason....
While you are not responsible for the ignorance of other people, we Mods like to deter such people from jumping into the pit you have laughingly marked "escape hatch." Given the choice between putting up one warning and suspending ten clueless users plus a troll, I'll choose the warning. True, the warning may not prevent people from making mistakes (the troll will get himself intro trouble, regardless), but I feel it's worth a try.
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And neither of those two points relate to solicitation of giveaways. Giveaways are neither keys nor gifts nor payments nor donations. At least not directly.
The problem is that by choosing to give a warning, you suck the fun out of it. If you truly want to prevent users from being suspended for those reasons, maybe you should create a separate awareness thread. That way you don't kill the jokes. Or even better: talk to your boss to improve the welcoming experience of new users with the presentation of the FAQ and the Guidelines.
By the way, this comment raised a question for me:
Do not ask users for payments or donations for any reason.
Is that not regarding giveaways only? Or are all of us userscript creators on SG who put up links for donations in our scripts breaking rules?
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The problem is that by choosing to give a warning, you suck the fun out of it
I agree that the warning "sucked the fun out of [that joke]." I decided that clarity of what was and wasn't permitted on the site was more important than protecting the joke. You disagreed. At that point, you had several options, one of which was to voice your disagreement in a civil way and move on (perhaps to another joke). You chose otherwise.
Is that not regarding giveaways only? Or are all of us userscript creators on SG who put up links for donations in our scripts breaking rules?
The prohibition is generally treated as inclusive. As far as I am aware, the Mods consider links buried in a javascript (or somesuch) to be an optional feature of the script. They are not required to run the script, and nobody seems forced to use them. In such a context, you could consider them negligible. This is a far cry from posting "give me X," or "do Y because I asked you so" in the forum or comments section.
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I do apologize for the aggressiveness. I tend to overreact and say a few regrettable things when I'm stressed. It's something I'm working on improving about myself, but I don't always succeed, and when I see the damage is already done.
links buried in a javascript
I was thinking more of cases where the donation link is present in the discussion thread on SG.
This is a far cry from posting "give me X," or "do Y because I asked you so"
Yes, I know. I was just wondering because I had never really paid attention to that guideline before, and wanted to make sure that I'm not breaking any rules by having a donation link for the script.
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I can't figure out how could it be more obvious that we were all joking :/
"P.S.(I'm only joking.)"
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I'd love to be super-tier someday.
Not on this site though, I mean an actual hero irl
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I don't know how she maintains improvised traipsing for so long.
I like how she walks by Spiderman at one point. What kind of mall is that? :3
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How can I be a celebrity if I don't even have a real name? insert sad emoji
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And the Initials inside "Initials", does it create an endless loop?
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Hi, I'm Nudiustertian. You may remember me from such giveaways as "what, Portal again?" and "can I enter with only three games on my wishlist?" I believe this qualifies me for a spot on the S-list. HAHA S FOR SURPRISE GIVEAWAY SUCKERS
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Also Pulitzer Prizes. But you have to be careful about what you go for.
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So, who do you think are the site's A-list, B-list, C-list and D-list celebrities?
It's just a dumb thread, so don't take it seriously :)
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