(EDIT March 21st)

Obviously, it's time for me to take another break from SG.

I am dismayed by how little our community cares about Ukrainians and how much it cares about poor Russians living their cozy lives under their oppressive (and criminal) regime. I'm also dismayed, how easily otherwise sensible people fall into russian propaganda stereotype, that everyone trying to oppose rashism must be a russophobe. Which I am not. I am however an anti-fascist, no matter if we talk about folks glorifying nazi war criminals or folks actively or passively supporting Putin's rashism and invasion of Ukraina.

It's hard for me to believe, that if we were talking about September of 1939, when Germany started the WWII invading Poland (or July of 1941, when according to Russia the WWII began), so many of you would as well argue, that sanctions about poor German citizens are unjustified, because they have no way to oppose Hitler and are oppressed by nazi regime, and that they would have no other effect, but to cause uncalled for hardship on those people, many of whom are opposed to their regime.

If that's, how you see the current situation, then you are either supporting Putin and rashism or there is something really messed up in your thinking. For all I know, in all those years nazis never got even close to getting 50% national support in 3rd Reich, and now most of you are willing to fight against oppressive sanctions directed against innocent Russians, when according to every source, when the invasion of Ukraine began, well over 50% (probably close to 65-70%) of russian citizens have supported Putin's war. Also, well over 50% of them believes, that after dealing with Ukraina, Russia should deal in a similar manner with "the threat posed to it" by, among others, Poland, Moldova and Baltic States. Because, according to rashism, Russia has the right to regain their imperial influence on at least the whole territory of the former Soviet empire and semi-occupied Warsaw Pact countries.

A week ago in my town there was a demonstration against the russian invasion of Ukraina, organized by Russians living in Poland. Unfortunately, I didn't know about it at that time, because if I knew, I would be there to support them and thank them. As I will try to support and help any Russian actively opposing Putin and rashism. Actually, if you are opposed to Putin and you want to flee the threat of being conscripted into russian military, if you are able to reach polish borders directly from russian or belarussian territory, I may be able to help you gain a political asylum in Poland. But if you live in Russia or you are a russian citizen, and you are you are not willing to actively oppose the Putin's regime, then in my opinion you are also responsible for the actions of your country, so sanctions limiting your access to any kind of luxury goods (and games are certainly not a basic necessity) are fully justified and in current situation necessary.

This should however never impact the free flow of information. Actually I'm also dismayed by opportunism and lack of courage of publishers blocking sales of their games in Russia. They should never do so themselves. They should have forced Putin's regime to do this, by patching their games with messages condemning russian invasion of Ukraina (like unskippable intro, when you first start the game). But this, ofc, could lead to their games being permanently banned in Russia, while stopping their sales now, they can be pretty sure to be able to resume them shortly. So, yes, a lot of those sanctions in just a PR bullshit :( .

It's true and unfortunate, that I've been imprecise in my OP - it was pretty obvious to me, that I'm speaking about blocking access to GAs, not to discussions. But even ignoring this, maybe my original proposal has also been flawed. Possibly, it could be a better solution not to limit the access to GAs to anybody, but to make it necessary for every winner to agree with a statement condemning the russian invasion before claiming any win. Each time and everyone. But reading the answers in this thread I don't see anyone (sorry if I missed a post or 2) trying to find a better solution to the one, that I've proposed, and except the not so many people, that agree with me, I see almost all the rest seemingly caring much more about not harming the "poor, self-oppressed, innocent Russians", than about trying to help the Ukraina. Unfortunately, my personal reward for the best answer here has to go Glorow.

Sadly, I must end with 1 more controversial statement. To those of you, that have blacklisted me over this thread or will do so (which I fully expected to happen), I have just 1 request: Please, never remove me from your blacklist, because I'm not able to trace and blacklist all of you. Well, all except one person from Ukraine, that probably has totally misunderstood, what I was writing about.

Take care and don't get yourself killed, neither by war nor by COVID. And just make sure, that you will not be ashamed of yourself, when all of this is over. One day, probably in a year or so, when Ukraina is once again at peace and regains all of its territory, and when Putin is no longer ruling Russia, I will be back here, hopefully finding all of my friends here as well.

=================

(Original, unedited post)

As long as SG does not block Russian and Belarusian residents and there is no final peace treaty between Ukraine and Russia, all my GAs will be region restricted, with possibility to enter them form Russia and Belarus blocked. If any of the groups, that I'm in, will find this unacceptable, I will suspend my membership in that group.

We should be helping victims of this war. Not only Ukrainians, but also Russians and Belarusians, if they are persecuted for opposing the war.

We should (and we do) accept women, children and elderly refugees from Ukraine, but also accept objectors from Russia and Belarus, if they are fleeing military service or danger of being drafted there.

At the same time however we should apply sanctions against Russian and Belarusian nationals, as long as they are in their countries or as long as they do not unequivocally condemn the war, while living abroad. Mostly we do. Not many of us would argue, that a Russian athlete should be allowed to take part in an international competition, just because that person possibly does not support Putin and is against the war. It's very sad, that we have to make someone not only uncomfortable, but possibly break their dreams, but that's the only way in which we can not only protest, but also help those people oppressed by their regimes, to free themselves.

I know, what I'm talking about. I'm from Poland and I have lived through this. In 1981, after "Solidarity" has been crushed by the communist regime declaration of Martial Law, we were subjected to very strong sanctions. Vast majority of folks, that were trying to actively oppose the government, were not only supporting them, but even asking for those sanctions to be expanded. Protests against them were coming from those, that were the government's supporters, and from significant part of those, who decided to care about their day to day life, and not about any principles, freedoms and folks arrested and imprisoned. But with time results of those very sanctions have actually made them more active. If those sanctions have not been placed and maintained for a long time, in 1988-1989 most likely we would not be the first country to break out of the Soviet camp.

Sanctions are not only the only message of condemnation, that Kremlin can't suppress for a prolonged time, but also a tool to turn those, that are passive, against their government. And usually, most people are passive, as long as they are reasonably comfortable.

Hearing, that we are not at war here (meaning SG, as it's been later explained), I can only see it as a way to preserve our own zone of comfort by avoiding taking the stand, that we easily can. I'm convinced, that SG should join the sanctions and block Russian and Belarusian residents for as long, as there is no final peace treaty between Ukraine and Russia. As long as it doesn't, I will apply those sanctions to my GAs. I hope, that I will not be the only one doing so.

Sadly a very cheap potato train, lvl 2, 1 week, minor bot protection in the link (all games are from Fanatical Dollar Chronicle Bundle, nothing more left in my reserve after the recent still running Cakeday train).

And sorry to my Russian and Belarusian friends here (not really sure, who you are, I rarely check nationalities here, even if shown on Steam profiles, but sure some of you are from there). I can only say, that I hope for Putin to be overthrown and for things to be back to normal in a very short time. Because, if this doesn't happen fast, then the new Cold War will last for a long time... possibly till the end of mankind, as we know it :(.

Freedom and Victory for Ukraine!

2 years ago*

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What do you think?

View Results
SG should join sanctions, and until it does, I will restrict my GAs accordingly.
SG should join sanctions.
SG should not get involved, but I will restrict my GAs.
OP should be banned/suspended/BLed for posting this discussion.
Potato...
Potatoes (sure, thanks, but next time could you please get those of a bit better quality?)
This thread is pointless, nothing here, that I would be interested in :( .

Frankly, I don't care, I'm not in the mood for games anyway. Do what makes you feel better. If you think that discriminating all Russians despite their political stance is the way to go, then sure, punish us as you see fit. I'm tired of arguing. Sometimes an illusion of action can be therapeutic indeed.

2 years ago
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I'm truly sad reading your reply, and avoiding any further, possibly awkward, discussions, I can only wish you all the best.

2 years ago
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Your sad reading a response from someone you want to punish and wish them the best. Very weird. I dont see your logic. Every time I see these types of banning something from Russia, especially athletes, it's next level idiotic and just plain discrimination. But, you do you. Continue your pointless discrimination against people who aren't responsible for this so you can feel better and say you "did something" when in fact you did nothing and just went after users who arent responsible for this invasion. I am happy to see that the majority here dont think like you, which is great. Punish those who deserve it, not the next best thing so you can pretend you did something to end the conflict or help those in need.

2 years ago
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This. As I read how paralympics got shamed by a few countries forcing to discriminate those from russia and belarus I cried. It's a lost day in humanity. Those who need the solidarity the most are now abolished and excluded the most in favor of questionable solidarism with the war victims.

2 years ago
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A bit of an unfortunate place to wish you this, but happy cake day! :)

2 years ago
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Thanks.

2 years ago
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First I want to say I agree with the sentiment of your post. The Russian political elite are the bad guys, not the common people.

That said, from what I understand Russian athletes are not banned from participating, but they have to play under a neutral flag. The only bans are for those who are openly showing their support for the invasion of Ukraine.

2 years ago
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Nah, they are all banned in most sports. The athlete from your article would have been banned too starting with March 7 but that sports event happened before the ban triggered.

But I'll be honest, I support Russian athletes being banned when they represent Russia. Like the national football teams for the world cup etc. I totally get why opposing teams would refuse to play against them.
And the ROC should already have been banned before the war, just for their extensive doping program.

2 years ago
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Its sad we live in a two-faced double standard world.

2 years ago
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I doubt of your sadness because on your other comment you said "Russia is just following NATO/USA's footsteps of invading other nations xdd"
https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/XMzvK/dont-bully-russians/search?page=2#xxWAqRU
You seem very pleased of the situation.

2 years ago
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+1
I'm not in the mood for games either. I'm not in the mood for anything, really.
This is getting ridiculous, even the pool is biased, but if it will make you feel better — go for it.
Region restrictions, BLs, suspensions, scripts for hiding comments from Russian users — whatever you manage to came up to.

2 years ago*
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I've always respected you as a user. And that hasn't changed now. ;)

I don't really think that community websites should be preemptively banning Russians. The people still need to be able to communicate with friends in other countries. Maybe it's their only way of staying sane with all this.

If some guy started posting a bunch of propaganda threads and making a nuisance of himself, THEN ban him. No one wants that. But they shouldn't ban people just because they're from those countries. I don't see that being fair.

2 years ago
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I know what you feel, bro

2 years ago
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Nah, pass. Lots of people try to escape/cope with reality by playing videogames, me included. So I'd feel bad to take that away from the innocent Russians (like the Possible Psycho above) who are against the war.

That being said, I do "sanction" the pro-facist Pootin lovers (along some other toxic users (they tend to sanction me too, so easy to maintain)).

2 years ago
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This is a site for giving away gifts, not sanctions.
And quoting a wiser man from a video game:

In your haste to save the world, take care you don't destroy it

If you want to make a political entity out of SG, it will cease to be what it is. And in time ,it will inevitably break apart due to differences that we all, quite ironically, share.

2 years ago
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If you want to make a political entity out of SG, it will cease to be what it is. And in time ,it will inevitably break apart due to differences that we all, quite ironically, share.

Couldn't the same be said in much stronger voice about the idea of Olympics? And yet even the The International Olympic Committee has not remained silent.

2 years ago
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They shamed themself and make it a nonsense political commedy show.
Flags banning = okay
People banning because false country = total shame.

2 years ago
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+1

2 years ago
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If mods think that this thread should remain we frankly should end all sorts of moderation. This is just the kind of toxic development that I already expected based on the previous threads.
Whoever can't live with Russians winning their giveaways shall use the given restriction options but only idiots would suggest that all should be bound by their Russophobic standards.

Edit: Turns out that the reaction in this thread was actually a positive surprise. I expected a further escalation, after OP and others already pushed their war rhetorics previously.

2 years ago*
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2 years ago
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If my opinion is because I'm a player so I don't want to get into politics, we all agree for sure that the war is going on in ukraine but it's all politics, russia and ukraine will definitely lose their citizens due to this war but i (maybe we ) can only help through prayer and the acts of help that we can do. And don't ever judge people from Russia because their country attacked Ukraine, if you want to hate Russia, hate its leader (Putin) don't ever equate all Russians have the same thoughts as their leader (Putin)

2 years ago
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That's a lot of words for pure slacktivism. Meanwhile Russians opposing their regime are risking years in prison. Good job, you saved the world.

2 years ago
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2 years ago
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Sanctions on Russians? first put sanctions on USA and NATO countries for invading and killing millions in Iraq, Somalia, Jordan, Afghanistan, Vietnam, Bosnia, Bolivia Syria. They committed the same atrocities that Russia is committing today.

2 years ago
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+1, invading other countries is bad, but if anyone deserves to be sanctioned for it, it's the world bullies - the USA and their allies.

2 years ago
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IF we look at the facts and figures its USA/NATO that pushed Ukrainians for this war and then dumped them in the middle of war. According to USA/NATO ''u are with us or against us'' you can't stay neutral.

2 years ago
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Strange, I didn't hear Ukraine saying anywhere " We will war with Russia"

Ukraine hasn't been dumped in the slightest.
*1.7 million Ukrainian refugees taken in by NATO countries.

  • You could make an easy and quick list of all the countries that have sent support in whatever form.
    Personally I like those Javelin missiles and Turkish drones that almost have a 100% "your tank is death" kill count.

Maybe if Russia wouldn't be so evil then all those countries wouldn't be coming over asking to join NATO Alliance....
And yes I say Russia, not just Putin because every country gets the government that they deserve.

2 years ago
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But they said to Ukraine that in case of Russian invasion NATO/USA will send its ARMY.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pK4Nu_K41fM

2 years ago
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Highly doubt that. Ukraine is not a member of NATO and is not covered by article 5 of the treaty.

Zelensky publicly calling for direct intervention or a no-fly zone lately is a propaganda / negotiation tactic. I highly doubt he expects or ever expected these requests to be met. But it's still useful to ask for these as it puts pressure on NATO members to send more military aid, introduce more sanctions on Russia or whatever.

2 years ago
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I have watched your video and no where does it say that NATO will send its army.
Also I am pretty sure that NATO never said anything of the sort due to Ukraine not being a member of NATO.
Lastly, NATO is not ready or willing to fight a war now, the cost of conventional warfare is just to great especially with the pandemic which came before. (ask Russia)

And as Paganfears explained, it is useful to ask for it but if he is a smart man ( and I am sure he is) he isn't expecting to get any of it.
A no fly zone would instantly mean WW3.
Most of the West is at the moment fighting a proxy war in Ukraine against Russia by providing them with all kinds of necessary equipment whether it is lethal or non lethal.

2 years ago
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FJmf-ZROL4 watch the whole video and you will get my point.

2 years ago
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this guy is talking about the "deep state". this is entirely opinion.

2 years ago
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There are plenty of neutral nations. Even some strongly Western-alligned nations are neutral militarily. Your claim is laughable. It's even funnier because you are from Pakistan. A country which is allied / has good relations with the USA and still had no problems acting directly against US interests, like with harboring and arming the Taliban. International politics are a lot more complex than you make it out to be.

And Ukraine didn't need pushing. They are neighbouring a nuclear superpower that already occupied a part of their territory and instigated a separatist civil war in another. At that point if anything it was Ukraine trying to flee into NATO's arms for protection against Russia. Maybe it was not a good decision but they probably were not ready to let go of those territories.

Also NATO didn't dump Ukraine. They are arming them, providing aid and accepting millions of refugees. What did you expect? A direct confrontation with Russia which would quite likely end with nuclear annihilation?

2 years ago
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First of all do some research USA created Talibans to counter Soviet union in Afghanistan and secondly watch these videos its not an Pakistani channel saying anything against Russia or USA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzgPJeYZaOU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FJmf-ZROL4

2 years ago
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This is my last attempt as you don't seem to know even the basics. No, the USA absolutely didn't create the Taliban. It's a totally false claim that anyone can check easily.

The USA funded and armed the Mujahedeen warlords that fought against the Soviets. So did Pakistan. In fact most of the US military aid into Afghanistan flowed through Pakistan who played favorites among the warlords and had their own agenda. After the Soviets left and the goverment they backed was overthrown the Mujahedeen warlords tried to set up a power sharing agreement and coalition goverment. The Pakistan.backed Hekmatyar refused to participate and started a civil war. The Taliban emerged during this civil war. Most you could claim is that the US' Afghanistan policy in the 80s fostered an environment in which the Taliban could emerge later. That's very far from creating them. Claiming that Pakistan created the Taliban would be closer to the truth but even that is not quite true.

2 years ago
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You dont get it? or you dont want to understand??? Mujahideen are the Talibans. Its the same thing. Later the same Mujahideen/Talibans were used by different countries to defeat USA and NATO forces in Afgahnistan. USA/NATO's plan backfired.

2 years ago
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There's no freedom of speech? Hypocrites blacklisting me like i care about it? ahahaha won nothing in 5 years given away more games than i won so do as you like. Hypocrites what about Palestine and Kashmir? no one talks about it.

2 years ago
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I could simply link you the Wikipedia article on the Taliban, but I'll do something better:
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/p5ltmh/what_caused_the_mujahideen_to_schism_into_alqaeda/
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/pi2srf/the_claim_that_the_cia_funded_the_taliban_in_the/

Read the replies on these topics if you want to broaden your knowledge on this topic. Or ignore it. Whatever.

And for the record I didn't blacklist you. Maybe others got annoyed by your whataboutism.

2 years ago
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whataboutism

2 years ago
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Nope. Indiscriminately bullying people is nothing more than a blind witch hunt.

2 years ago
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If I happen to do any giveaways anytime soon, they will be completely region free like they've always been. I'm not about to treat all the Russian people like they're enemies, when they're not. Treating them all like the enemy, will simply make them become the enemy.

2 years ago
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+1

2 years ago
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+2

2 years ago
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+3

2 years ago
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+4, and that's pretty much how this war started anyway. Putin saw NATO's bases get closer, and closer, and closer... Sure he overreacted, but everyone takes turn overreacting and we see how this is going so far...

2 years ago
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+5 Fuck Putin, of course. But think of some Russian guy that went to a protest for peace today, was beaten up by the riot police, then he comes home feeling lucky because he would have gotten 5 years in prison if he was arrested for protesting the war, and sees this thread. You are basically saying Putin is right and the west hates Russia

2 years ago*
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+6
I completely agree.
I don't look at where people come from. That's the nice thing of the internet. You can meet people with the same interests/believes/... and just have fun with them without having country, religion, skin color, ... be an obstacle.

People don't chose where they are born, just as they don't chose their skin color or which people they love. So I don't see a reason to discriminate towards them because of something they don't have any control over.

2 years ago
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+7

2 years ago
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In the end, most of the sanctions are either counterproductive (cause only the innocent citizen of uninvolved countries have to pay them, for example the problem around natural gas) or senseless (like blocking all people from Russia and Belarus or removing Russian teams from videogames, like EA plans to do it).

You won't reach anything with that, except discriminating innocent people from Russia and Belarus who aren't supporting the war in any way ... And why? Simply because they are born and they live there.

2 years ago
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Don't think there will be many agreeing with you on this one. SG never closed it's doors to "bad users from some region". Not to mention it would be easy to avoid with VPN. And user region on SG is not always accurate.

Personally even when I wholeheartedly support Ukraine and condemn Putin&co - what average Russian person has to do with it? They are suffering years of propaganda like in North Korea. They will live in economy where you can't afford to buy bread because of Putin imperialistic dreams. They go straight to jail if they dare to protest.

From what I understand sanctions are supposed to make people revolt there. But Poland and Russia are not really comparable. In Poland we were sanctioned from within and revolted against oppression. Russia is sanctioned from the outside, which only fuels Putin's propaganda.. If you feel like you're unjustly punished by external enemies it's hard to oppose government that is supposed to "fight with external oppression".

Imagine west being like "we won't send newspapers to Poland, for poles to have objective source of info, let's crush them some more!", "let's stop to broadcast radio free europe to Poland, removing their source of info will make them revolt faster!". This would actually make people in Poland see west as an enemy, just like communists were.

Guess only thing you will get from this are some trolls and blacklists. Don't see a reason to make forum thread to say you won't make GAs for specific users because of x. Blacklists people that you don't like, that's a reason BL were introduced. And limit GAs as your own protest. People you "target" won't see your GAs to see the message. Majority don't check forum.

And imagine what person that lives in Russia may feel when they oppose Putin, still have access to SG, and see in the forum that they should be disconnected from it for reasons beyond their influence. It's bad enough that Russia may decide to cut outside internet from whole country.

View attached image.
2 years ago*
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propoganda is everywhere. Americans have been told since childhood that we Russians are the world's evil. and we have a pet bear. I can send you a bear cub if you want XD of course I'm kidding. the bottom line is that everyone is capable of lying, but not everyone can admit it

2 years ago
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I know it well, some in Poland have deep grudges against both Russia and Germany. Some are serious about it. Most just repeat jokes pointed on Germans or Russians stereotypes.

Obv "Russia is the enemy". Germany is kind of enemy because as much as they had war on our territory - they are also rich country where it's nice going to work. But if you'd ask in Poland who's better ally - Germany with who we share border or USA that is across the ocean - a lot of people would say USA.

2 years ago
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You can do whatever you want for your GAs, even restricting them to Vatican and Sealand only if that's your wish. I don't really make GAs anymore (lots of reasons for that) but if SG did end up enacting sanctions against Russian users, I definitely wouldn't enter any GA either until those sanctions were lifted. You want Russians to revolt against Putin? Well give them hope for a better future instead of treating them like they have the plague.

2 years ago
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As site is their choice...for me...I don't hate russians or Belarusian but I DO HATE this f*** war (many reasons) that's why I don't know what to choose

2 years ago
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I think you are wrong on the way but you are free to follow the path you want

2 years ago
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OP, this is clear discrimination. Please delete this thread.

Welcome to my blacklist.

2 years ago
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Cold War is boring I personally prefer Nuclear one

2 years ago
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No.

IF a user does something bad, like posting a bunch of pro-Putin propaganda videos, then ban him. But this is a community website. I don't agree with taking this away from people who might need a sort of mental break from reality.

If you want to restrict your GAs, I think you are free to do that, but it feels kinda wrong to punish people here before they do anything. SC was one of the places that saved my sanity while I was going through so much IRL and I still am.

I called out some pro-Putin crazies earlier and got a slew of blacklists. It's okay, they'll do the job for me.

2 years ago
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Dear OP, you can do what you want with your giveaways. But banning all users from Russia and Belarus is not the right way. This will not stop the war.
Instead use SG to talk to them (if they are still able to see reason) and show them what is really happening. Ask them to spread the truth within Russia and to protest in the open. Putin can not arrest 40 million people (or whatever the number of people against Putin in Russia is).

2 years ago
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I'm sure this scares the crap out of Putin and will stop WW3...
I mean, I agree this war sucks, but fostering hatred between Russians and the rest of the world like that... that won't solve things.

2 years ago
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Dude, what can the people do? They can't even oppose Putin without risking jail time or worse.

2 years ago
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2 years ago
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2 years ago
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I met Russians and Ukrainians, they are nice people. I wonder why someone from outside want to create a huge hatred between these people. Maybe for the money?

2 years ago
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I like your profile picture =3

2 years ago
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Thanks, it just popped up in my avatar list and I changed it.

2 years ago
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Instead of restricting every Russian or Belarusian user from my giveaways I simply blacklist the obvious Putin trolls. There are wonderful people in those countries that don't deserve to be sanctioned only because they were born in the wrong country. Especially on a website like steamgifts.

2 years ago
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+
As someone from Syria, I agree
Assad regime is shit, but that doesn't mean all Syrians support it

2 years ago
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