I am considering to upgrade-renew PC before the end of year. And as I am currently with i5-4570 (almost 10 years old) and DDR3, even going for a budget option (such as the i5-12400 at below 200 money, with motherboard for it at around 100), that would still be a significant upgrade. But, since I will likely get a 12th gen Intel Alder Lake CPU anyhow (which all support DDR4 and DDR5), such as at least the 12600, I am wondering about going for DDR5.

Like, even if the market relaxes somewhat for DDR5 to become cheaper, it is extra cost. However, SSDs have become quite cheap, and reusing my 1050Ti (4GB) in the new rig would still be good enough for some time (with the games I play in regard to backlog and such), so I would not be looking at much expense in that regard - and getting at first just 16 GB of DDR5 SDRAM is an option too, even if a single stick would not make full use of CPU's dual channel thingy.

What do you think? In my case that extra spending wouldn't be at the cost of food or going into debt for, but some perhaps up to 200 extra is still money I could be spending on e.g. more than 10 bundles from Humble, or well, going for a higher tier of CPU instead, such as i9-12900 (if I wouldn't otherwise in regard to funds - but going for cheaper i5-12600 and for DDR5 now would save money in regard to not needing a new motherboard later, at which point i9-12900 may be quite cheaper).


So, long story short, may it be a smart choice to go for DDR5, with being set in that regard for years to come, as I can then easily upgrade CPU and GPU later without throwing out motherboard at that point if I would want to improve RAM too? With me playing among other open world games and RTS by the way, which would seem to make use of better RAM bandwidth and transfer rate.

Or is the smart choice rather to make use of the soon perhaps even lower prices for DDR4 SDRAM and motherboards, which are still plenty good for years to come, even if it means throwing out motherboard and RAM in a few years if I upgrade to DDR5 then?

1 year ago

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Should I go for DDR5 SDRAM incl. motherboard, instead of DDR4?

View Results
Yay, go for it.
Nah. DDR5 may be nice, but quite a shiny luxury as of now and in near future.
Why not spend even more on a new console for less features?
I don't really understand much of what is said here.
You know, I have been wondering about that myself.
I am here just for the eventual drama.

DDR5? DDR5? DDR5?...
I think DDR5 was something very different from what each memory company said....
EETimes - Comparing DDR5 Memory From Micron, Samsung, SK Hynix
Therefore, "hardware compatibility" or "compatibility" issues, as they were called in the old days, may arise later.

It is advisable to skip or expand to the maximum extent possible now.
Things in this area will not be cheap until next year or later.
Even as a strategic commodity now, semiconductors are being reconsidered, and the plan to make them cheaper may be postponed indefinitely.
Therefore, it is advisable to either skip or maximize the expansion that can be done now.
I said the "similar phrase" twice because it was important.

1 year ago
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Yes, there are variations. I wouldn't worry about incompatibility as such though, as the differences are about performance-specific points (and price), and not about whether this or that DDR5 can be used for this or that DDR5 mainboard.

1 year ago
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skip the ddr5 mate, it's not worth the extra cost, all gimmicks, no matter how fast, it's like 1% actual real world faster than ddr4, by the time ddr5 matures, you are most likely having Intel/Amd on new architectures, thus a waste of money for the motherboard as well.

Also, you'll get lower performance for older games on ddr5 compared to ddr4, due to optimization.

1 year ago*
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In case of DDR4 v. DDR3, the first-gen DDR4 wasn't really better than high-performance DDR3. The thing though is that high-performance DDR4 isn't exactly cheap neither. E.g. looking at

  • G.Skill's Trident Z5 DDR5-6000 32GB, and
  • Crucial Ballistix Max RGB DDR4-4000 32GB

the DDR5 is noticeably more expensive currently, and not really better performance to be had for gaming (particularly in regard to that so far games usually do not make full use of such large amount of RAM to begin with). But the price difference is not what I would call huge.

And if that price difference perhaps decreases somewhat in the coming months, going for the DDR4 would mean to be at the ceiling in that regard, whereas possibly some 100 extra for DDR5 incl. mainboard would mean to be ready to make full use of next-gen CPUs (which may get bottlenecked by DDR4 or not even support DDR4 anymore, as the case seems to be with Zen 4).

1 year ago
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Right now...

DDR5 is just better than DDR4 in pure stats BUT all in all it depends on the prices in your country - if I would have to choose between 16GB of DDR5 or 32GB of DDR4 for the same price I would go for DDR4.

Let say we compare (DDR5) Kingston Fury Beast 32GB 5200 MHz CL40 vs (DDR4) Kingston Fury Beast 32GB 3600 MHz CL18

DDR5 will be better for gaming BUT only slightly. Something like 0.5-2% better.
If you play in 1920x1080 the difference will be depending on the game but will be something between 1-6 FPS but the difference between 120 and 126 or 144 and 150 FPS won't be noticeable especially if you have a good 144 Hz monitor.

I think the price is the most important thing now for you to look at.
There is no point in spending more to get 1% better PC.

1 year ago
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1 year ago*
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Yeah, games are likely to support DDR4 for years to come, so I wouldn't be worried that I'd miss out if I'd go for DDR4. DDR5 is better for CPUs with many multi-cores though, so going for DDR5 with a cheap-ish CPU now (which would easily cover current gaming), that would mean I'd be set to upgrade the CPU later without any additional cost to not have the rig bottleneck it. And at that there is the question of how long new CPUs will support DDR4. E.g. AMD seems to be ditching it already with Zen 4.

1 year ago
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1 year ago
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One way to look at it. Another is that 100 extra now on mainboard and RAM would save the money for it later on. Like when DDR4 RAM and mainboard would cost me 300 now and DDR5 RAM and mainboard 400, the DDR5 sure may be had for 300 in a few years, but that's 600 spent in total for getting DDR4 now and DDR5 then, compared to the 400 when going for DDR5 straight away. And DDR5 isn't just the DDR5, but also way more CPU cores at that, where a lot of the performance increase will be at.

I could do with a better rig in any case, as my current one is at less performance than what gets sold as budget PCs these days. But to just get "the cheapest" every two years or so, that seems to add up a lot, which is why I have been pondering about it.

1 year ago
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I do agree that a tiny bit of more performance is not worth the extra spending. But, if the price difference comes down to perhaps some 100 (Euro here), that would be 100 to set me up for possibly even the next 10 years, instead of being at a performance ceiling with DDR4 and needing a new mainboard if I would want to upgrade to next-gen DDR5 then. And that's why I am wondering whether I may go for DDR5.

1 year ago
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In 2 weeks AMD will announce Zen 4 with availability around July-September. Also expect 13th gen Raptor Lake at the end of 2022.
5800X3D is $450, you need cheap motherboard, cheap DDR4 and it's similar to 12900K with DDR5 in gaming.
With AMD you also get way lower power consumption and lower temperatures. You can use an air cooler with AMD.
12900K vs 5800X3D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XB3yo74dKU
12700KF vs 5800X3D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIXGwvIaWnk
If you go with DDR4 I recommend Dual Rank RAM (4 single rank DIMMs or 2 dual rank DIMMs) and at least 32GB. System is more responsive with dual rank RAM, for example 3200 DR outperforms 3600 SR, so you don't need high frequency RAM to get optimal performance.

1 year ago*
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note that this is I9 vs Ryzen7 not Ryzen9 lmao
Lower tier AMD CPU still wrecks the Intel desktop flag ship :D

1 year ago
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Depends on the benchmark I suppose. According to some the 12900K outperforms the 5800X3D by around 50%, and the 12700KF also does noticeably outperform it, and at a cheaper price at that. Which is why I am looking mostly only at Intel CPUs - which may change though in the next few months, especially in regard to "price-performance value".

1 year ago
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Zen 4 will exclusively support only DDR5 apparently. And that's part of the reason why this thread exists, since when the by some proclaimed "best CPU/GPU maker for gaming" is saying to ditch DDR4, that's quite a stance there. On the other hand, CPUs such as AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D, which don't support DDR5, may get a lot cheaper quick.

1 year ago
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I'd go with 2x 16GB ddr4 instead (32 total) @3200-3600Mhz.

1 year ago
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Fair enough. Not sure myself yet though. DDR4 certainly good for years to come. But e.g. AMD's Zen 4 will reportedly support DDR5 only, so jumping in on DDR5 already would leave me with simple upgrade options later on, whereas going for DDR4 would mean to be at the ceiling without being able to upgrade if I am not going to pay for a total new set that supports what will be available then.

1 year ago
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You are looking for performance in the wrong place. Better go for a Ryzen CPU. Even IF Intel can get to the same performance, which they don't by far, the AMD CPUs consume way less energy.
DDR4 is more affordable just make sure to go 3200MHz, also check if mainboard and CPU support more than 3200MHz if you wanna go higher. Also go at least dual channel on memory.

PS: good guy AMD uses the same AM4 socket in mainboards across CPU gens, while Intel changes it every 2-3 generations.
With AMD you can gear up later on on the same mainboard.

1 year ago*
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Now if every AMD build I've done didn't shit out within a couple years while this Intel box has been running almost continuously for 10 years...

1 year ago
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I still have my self built AMD computer from 12 years ago and it works perfectly fine.
Can happen to intel too. But AMD has come a long way since then. After a decade of being inferior they upped their game ridiculously high and they are dominating Intel since 2-3 years. I can understand you are sceptic so I'll just recommend you to research thoroughly.
Read through detailed reviews of people that test the hardware from any possible angle.

1 year ago
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I hope this is the case, really! I'll definitely look into AMD in a year or two when I have to do a fresh build, they always offered more value just in my experience way less reliability so if they shored that up, better for us all!

1 year ago
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Due to prices haven't updated my build, so I'm still sitting on an older AM3+ socket AMD processor.
Will be about 10 years now... no problems whatsoever. So personally can't complain about AMD either. I will probably look at AMD build for myself as well.

Did an AMD build for work with Ryzen 9.. been about a year and works flawlessly

1 year ago
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Depends on who you ask or on how it is measured I suppose. E.g. looking at a comparison of i5-12600KF with Ryzen 9 5950X, the i5 wins it by a bit, and at around half the price at that.

And if AMD's exclusive support for DDR5 with Zen 4 is indicative of how they will roll now, there is not likely to be many more AMD CPUs that would fit in with a DDR4 mainboard. Which is why I am considering going for DDR5 straight away, as DDR4 won't leave me with many simply upgrade options later and I would have to go for a full new set then for an upgrade. A DDR4 rig sure cheaper in the short-term though.

1 year ago
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better 'worry' about gpu than ram. ddr4 is the way to go rn, especially if u go with ryzen+crucial sport lt and oc ram

ddr4 wil be still alive for long time, as we have deficit of pc components

1 year ago
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DDR4 will sure still be around for some time. AMD is ditching support for it with Zen 4 already though.

In regard to GPU, in my view I can save more money there by holding out a while until upgrade.

1 year ago
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and reusing my 1050Ti (4GB)

Why do you need to upgrade your CPU if you are reusing that card? It will be a huge bottleneck unless you need a better CPU for anything else that does not make use of the GPU.

1 year ago
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Yes, it would become the bottleneck in the new rig. A bottleneck I can easily live with for some time though, particularly as I still have some games in backlog, but also since a significant GPU upgrade would set me back 400 at least (and would not necessarily run at full potential in current rig), while the price may drop there quite some within a year.

1 year ago
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Yes but I still don't understand why do you need to upgrade the CPU only. It is more than enough for that card, some people are using cards like the 2060 or even the 3060 with a similar CPU. I mean, if you need a better gaming performance and you have to choose between a new GPU or a new CPU, in your case it is better to upgrade the GPU.

1 year ago
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Well, some people may use e.g. RTX 2060 with 4 CPU cores, but they are bottlenecking the GPU with the CPU there, as the recommendation for RTX 2060 is 6 cores. It does somewhat depend on the game/s played though, but it isn't all just about the GPU. To name an example, playing a huge map in a 4X-game with many AI opponents? GPU could go on vacation and would be barely missed.

So, in my case with a "either-or" spending situation, it would seem a waste of money to spend some 500 or more on a new GPU that I couldn't make full use of currently. And that's why I am looking "only" at CPU "right now", as the rig should be plenty good then to properly carry even next-gen GPUs.

1 year ago
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Depends on the game, but generally the bottleneck is in the GPU. Of course there are CPU dependant games, but it is not the norm.

https://www.gpucheck.com/gpu/nvidia-geforce-rtx-2060-super/intel-core-i5-4570-3-20ghz/

There are lots of videos on youtube with modern GPUs running well with your processor or a similar one.

1 year ago*
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I don't find the price point is good for DDR5 at this point in time, the slight advantages you "might" get from it wouldn't justify it. The fact it's more expensive to get 16GB DDR5 than 32GB DDR4 is a huge issue, as 32GB of 3200 would give you much greater performance than any 16GB DDR5 kit you get.

Based on what I see available on newegg for my region right now too, I feel frequency/timing ratio's could still use some improvement as well. Though the higher latency of DDR5 shouldn't cause any issues, especially given the data rate, extra performance out of them would be nice.

In the end, with a good CPU, GPU, SSD/NVME and DDR4 3200-3600, you'll crush just about any game. Take the savings from not getting DDR5 and invest them into a better GPU if anything.

1 year ago*
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Performance-wise it sure isn't much a difference these days. But going for DDR4 I wouldn't save that much money to be able to do a significant GPU upgrade from that saving, as the GPU upgrade would be some 400 at least . Whereas going for DDR5 rig as next upgrade, that would cost a bit extra, but also make the rig quite future-proof (as in not considering upgrade to DDR5 later and that money saved then all in for GPU only).

1 year ago
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If you buy a new hardware iteration you always pay a premium as early adopter. DDR5 with terrible timings isn't necessarily better than DDR4 with fast timings.
Amount of RAM for gaming 16GB and 32GB for video editing in Dual Channel mode(you'll probably leave more performance on the table if you run DDR5 RAM in single channel than you gain by the newer RAM compared to DDR4 in dual channel). Overall performance of a system is much more affected by CPU, GPU , SSD and don't forget a quality PSU and mainboard.

As you want to keep your 1050Ti for the time being I don't see how an upgrade of CPU, RAM and/or mainboard would improve performance noticeably. Best investment for now would be a fast NVME SSD probably(installed on adapter card in a mainboard slot).

Edit: Consider also improving your monitor eg: 144Hz IPS or better

1 year ago*
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I'm guessing he's processor throttled at this point; I also have a better video card than my processor can take advantage of in a lot of cases (and this changes from game to game, mostly optimization issues)

1 year ago
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Yes, and DDR3 also isn't helping performance in games expecting a bit higher standard to be able to run smoothly in every aspect.

1 year ago
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As Naniwa points out, at this point splashing out some 400-500 at least for new GPU, I don't think my current rig would really carry that properly (even aside from the question about PSU wattage), so that would seem a bit of a waste of money.

SSD is certainly likely to improve some matters, so no doubt about getting a good performance boost there, and I may get one even before anything else.

1 year ago
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I had to solve a similar dilemma as I wanted a new computer to play the latest games with decent settings. As a stopgap measure I bought a gaming laptop last month for a grand(6 core CPU, RTX 3060, 16GB RAM, 500 GB NVME Gen3 SSD, 144Hz IPS panel) which performs well at 1080p.

Right now GPU prices are still ridiculously high and I wasn't willing to spend a small fortune for the components of a gaming desktop.

1 year ago
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GPU upgrade still on the table for me. But will have to wait, while in the meantime all curious about the prices for Zen 4, which some say will come with a 24-core CPU.

1 year ago
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Are you not using an SSD already ? What ? I'm not reading this right ? The SSD brings the BIGGEST difference in a system. Put an SSD in a 20 year old system and it will fly. Put a hard drive in a 5950X/12900K system and it will crawl like it's a 20 year old system and I'm not even joking. It will take 5 seconds just to right click on desktop, on latest hardware. SSD is the most important factor of a system responsiveness.

My windows on NVME SSD got corrupted (modified some registry settings) so I installed windows 10 on a 1TB hard drive, then I copied important files from Windows partition to other drive. The Windows on the hard drive was such a pain, so slow, but I had patience.

You don't need an ultra super mega expensive SSD to experience what an SSD can do, any cheap SSD can show massive improvements over a hard drive. SSDs have 0.01 miliseconds in access time, sometimes even nanoseconds with Intel Optane, hard drives have 20 ms.

1 year ago*
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My system drive is actually on a SSD (which is why I wasn't in a rush to get one, particularly in regard to prices), but it is a bit older one with only some 55 GB, so no space there for game files.

1 year ago
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As Orono said above, wasting your money on the latest hardware for only half of your build and neglecting your GPU is silly. Also, if you're not running SSD already, that's even more of a concern.
Worrying about DDR5 will be the least of your performance issues.

1 year ago
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Yeah, I am aware that the GPU would be quite dated in a new rig. But in terms of facing a "either-or" spending situation, in my view going for components other than the GPU makes more sense for me right now, as a newer GPU wouldn't seem to be running at full potential with the current rig, and the prices may drop there more sooner than what the case may be e.g. for 12400 CPU - meaning that I may save more by holding out a bit for a significant GPU upgrade than what I may save by waiting to get the CPU etc. upgraded.

1 year ago
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1 year ago
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:)

1 year ago
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If you are happy with your current performance, why upgrade?
I just upgraded from a i5-4670 to a 5950X recently, but only because I wanted better performance for certain 3D art related tasks. For games the Intel 4000 series is still fine 95% of the time unless you're aiming for 120fps or higher.

1 year ago
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Fair point. My current rig would certainly still be good enough for some time for most games or even all games (albeit not at full details in some cases even at 1080p), and still have some to play. Which is why I am in no rush to upgrade. But as I am not much a type to spend thousands of hours in one game only, there are games I may be interested to go for a playthrough in and have been putting it off, such as Watch_Dogs 2 to name an example of a bit demanding game despite being some years old. And when upgrade/s make/s it way more likely to be able to run that smoothly even in 1440p, there's that.

1 year ago
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for now ddr5 is expensive and doesn't offer that much of a performance improvement. better wait maybe another year for that.
you could blow your money on a mid-range AM4 system with something like a ryzen 3600 or 5600 / 5800x 3d and add 16 or 32gb of ddr4 and you will be good to go for years to come.

but a 1050 ti is really kind of bad today.
at the same time a friend of mine followed my advice and bought himself a ryzen 3600 based system a year (?) ago and he is still using his old 1050 ti in there as well. not exactly what i would have done but he is happy with it so why not use what you have already.

1 year ago
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Yeah, a setup like you describe will sure be good for years for gaming. But DDR5 isn't way more expensive. E.g. looking right now at 32GB of DDR5-4800 at 220 Euro, while 32GB of DDR4-3200 is 124 Euro. And the 100 extra wouldn't give me noticeable performance boost from the DDR5 compared to DDR4, but a DDR5 mainboard can carry e.g. a 24-core CPU, which is a whole different matter there about performance.

And GPU upgrade also on the table. But with my 4-core CPU, e.g. RTX 2060 wouldn't run at full capacity, so it would be like driving a luxury sports car on a dirt road. Which is why I am looking at CPU and stuff around it first, with me not likely to go for anything below 8 cores even with a DDR4 setup though, both in regard to CPU performance but also to have rig smooth enough even for next-gen GPUs.

1 year ago
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more like ddr5 scam, price is not worth it now, let the technology develop and the prices will drop

1 year ago
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It is already developed enough to be able to support 24-core CPUs (for end-users), if such will be part of e.g. the Zen 4 line-up. And if a bit of extra spending makes it possible to make use of one of these, there is that argument. Sure no direct need for it for casual gaming for quite some time though.

1 year ago
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i didnt even know dance dance revolution made a 5th game

1 year ago
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If you're building a budget or price/perf sweet spot build then you absolutely shouldn't be getting DDR5 because it will cost 4x more than the best DDR4. Yes, cheaper DDR5 exists but you will get much worse performance with it compared to cheaper DDR4.

Given your GPU, the price difference of DDR5 alone would get you a nice GPU upgrade. Just stick with DDR4 and put the $300 saved into a future GPU upgrade now that the GPU bubble is mostly deflated.

By the end of the year things will change, both Raptor Lake, Zen 4, Ada Lovelace, RDNA3, and Intel's GPUs will all have launched. So it'll probably best to wait at least until the end of the year for all of that. I am also using Haswell (4790K) and have been waiting on Zen 4 before I upgrade.

1 year ago
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When comparing the cheapest DDR4 with most expensive DDR5, some 300 price difference would be too much for me to justify the more expensive build for. But I didn't find anything about cheapest DDR5 being worse than the cheapest DDR4, all while a DDR5 setup makes it possible to consider even e.g. a 24-core CPU (some have mentioned as part of the Zen 4 line-up), which is likely to outperform any DDR4 setup by a lot.

Not going to shop soon anyhow, more like October or so.

1 year ago
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Thank you everyone for your input. Unless a reasonable DDR4 setup will be a bargain, I will likely go for DDR5, even if it means saving up a longer time for it.

You see, it is correct that DDR5 as such doesn't offer noticeable performance improvement in gaming these days. But, aside from the issue of there not being games yet to actually make full use of it, what DDR5 makes possible is a lot more CPU cores. E.g. current top Intel Alder Lake CPUs (and e.g. Zen 2 used in top performance consoles), they have 8 cores. Whereas with DDR5, the next-gen CPUs (for end-users) are moving towards 24 cores, which is likely to be quite a boost in performance.

And aside from possible performance gains e.g. in current 4X-games, for gaming this means a possibly huge jump specifically about physics. In example, footage of Unreal Engine 5 graphics is nice. But when you look closely, it is quite static, with situations, such as a wall caving in, using pre-set animation. On the other hand, a lot more CPU power makes it possible for game developers to be like: "Realistic behavior of individual hair strands on a characters head, based on environmental factors including wind? Why not? And making it fun to jump in water puddles, as the CPU helps to calculate how the water will realistically splash? Why not?" - as GPUs sure are capable of depicting such already, but the calculation of realistic behavior of all them details, that takes a lot of computational power.

Of course, this will still take quite some time until it gets made full use of, especially depending on when next-gen consoles move on up there (as consoles are usually the technical standard around which modern games get developed). So for years not likely to miss out with DDR4.

But I'll get a new base setup in some months anyhow. And when right now 32 GB DDR4 RAM and mainboard would cost me some 300, and a DDR5 setup some 400, my reasoning is that the 400 will last longer to be on top of technical specifications for gaming (in that regard) and also easily carry next-gen GPUs, like 5 years at least perhaps, whereas a DDR4 setup may start falling behind in 3 years or so (specifically in regard to the whole CPU core issue).

I will reevaluate later though, particularly when Zen 4 will become available in September apparently, which may possibly lead to older DDR4 components getting sold a lot cheaper - where it would sure seem silly to not make use of a reasonable DDR4 setup for some 100 when DDR5 setup will still be at some 400.

1 year ago
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