Have you ever felt angry because of SteamGifts?
Complaining that games aren't worth full price is silly. People didn't pay full price.
Like oh no, I'm only getting 15% of the value for a game I paid 15% of the value for (most recently with Hard Reset and Dead Island remakes).
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Never Alone was for 3,74€ and you get 2€-sth CV :) But a matter of fact we receive more CV than we pay most of the times. Except people who gave away non-bundled game receive even more CV for the same amount of spend money :3
Adding a game to bundle list after a year is nonsense for.me though cos everybody who wanted to ezploit the system already did it and after the year they even might be not active anymore so it affects mostly people who bought it for "full price".
Yes, yes, we shouldn't care about CV. We should enjoy giving itself. But the fact is we do care about others CV by setting level restrictions while we encourage them to not care about their CV. They should enjoy giving itself but we don't do this ourselves by counting people's ratio. In other words if CV is.not important let's remove it :)
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Well, at least they count for something. Lots of pple have multiple games worth 0 because they were removed from the store.
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Good old Sims Medieval
Why didn't I buy a copy for myself? D:
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Or early access games that switched to F2P on release
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Which is ridiculous. They had value at the time they were given away. Why not apply the last known price so these people get the credit they deserve? I've been waiting for almost a year for a DLC for a cancelled F2P game to get its price back. It's frustrating. In my case it was only a $3 DLC but I'm sure that others have lost more for the same reason.
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What's the point in buying better games
giving nice games to people instead of bundle trash? :3
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nah. i'm not that selfless. or rich. besides...
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i don't think anyone here is rich, or else they would just buy everything they need and skip giveaways.
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they need or want? because I tend to be frugal about buying games - I want a lot of games, but in reality I need less because realistically I have already enough games to play right now.
I actually come here for cool topics in the discussions and for the community. The forum is quite self-regulating and purges all sorts nonsense away (at least in my opinion)
BTW not rich
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So, before it's been bundled it's a nice game and the bundling makes it trash?
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when people pay $1 to get 4-6 games, they aren't given away because the ga creator is generous, it's usually trash games no one wants.
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Yet those trash games that "noone wants" easily get 500-1000 entries if no restrictions are set.
Not everyone has to have an expensive AAA game to enjoy themselves.
After today I learned to take things from with a grain of salt (no offense).
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people want anything if it's free, even if it doesn't have cards they would just enter to +1 their libraries (yes,it's that sad).
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Whatever. so you actually want to claim there aren't any good games just as fun as fallout 4 that have been bundled (what isn't these days) and you define as trash.
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of course there are, just like AAA games that are worse than a DH game.
and yes, my definition of "trash" will be very different to another person's opinion.
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And that is your right. and i think alot have a different opinion then yours on that.
But some people do try within their sometimes limited reach, and for you to just say they give away trash, a bit disrespectful.
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what that logic, 99% of people here are also disrespectful to users that give away ubosift games since they always talk crap about them.
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it's simple:
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most bundle giveaways are so called "trash" (meaning they are leftovers, and probably not very good games). i think the steam user review scores reflect that very well. ^^
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that doesn't mean all bundle giveaways are trash. i gave away lots of copies of Super Hexagon, and i absolutely love that game. so in that case i didn't give away trash, i have away one of the best games on steam, regardless of its bundle status. still, most of my bundle giveaways are what Mullins called trash. ^^
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no disrespect happened here, as far as i am concerned. bundle trash is just some funny word that got kind of common on the forum. doesn't mean every bundle giveaway is considered worthless or anything like that. if someone contributes to the site, that's awesome. no matter if cheap bundle games or 60$ AAA games.
:)
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How about duplicates of already owned awesome games that have been bought before being bundled?
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Bundled is still bundled trash, one has to be consequent offcourse.
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how is that relevant? if the game is good, it won't turn into crap because it's $0.01 or free.
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Ok let's check your game library then in games you played for over 50 hours which means you clearly enjoyed them and I assume you do not consider them trash.
Borderlands 2 - 566hours - bundled
Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War II: Retribution - 370 hours - bundled
Borderlands - 159 hours - bundled
Dragon Age: Origins - 149 hours - bundled
Fallout: new Vegas - 142 hours - bundled
This war of MIne - 136 hours - bundled(if we count the HB montly)
Dead Island - 85 hours - bundled
Defense Grid: The Awakening - 74 hours - bundled
Mad Max - 69 hours - bundled(again only if we count the monthly)
Shadowrun returns - 67 hours - bundled
Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine - 66 hours - bundled
Supreme Commander 2 - 63 hours - bundled
Legend of Grimrock 2 - 54 hours - bundled
So excuse me if I fail to understand your reasoning, am I misunderstanding something?
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if the game is good, it won't turn into crap because it's $0.01 or free.
i don't understand what you mean?
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Yeah, that's the problem, me neither xD
Lemme sum up what I got from the earlier comments, tell me if I got something wrong. Your original reply was "giving nice games to people instead of bundle trash? :3" which got some reactions defending bundled status cause "not all bundled games are crap". In which you reply that if a game is good it won't get bundled or end up a freebie? Or are we specifically talking about low cost tiers and freebies?
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Bundle trash --> trash from bundles. Not just every bundled game.
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Yeah that's what I'm trying to understand, what's the criteria of "bundle trash" in this discussion >w<
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Digital Homicide, shit games that were obviously pushed past greenlight, games with only russian reviews and curiously only negative english reviews, and personally I think that around 90-95% of Indiegala Monday bundles' games. Unoriginal, unoptimized games without a trace of new ideas.
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No argument on those lol
But this is what confuses me:
when people pay $1 to get 4-6 games, they aren't given away because the ga creator is generous, it's usually trash games no one wants.
There's multiple examples of games in $1 tiers that are at least decent if not good(mostly Humbles).
The latest SquareEnix one for example had The Last Remnant and Murdered there. Borderlands was also in $1 tier if I'm not mistaken. the Walking Dead S1 & back to the Future in the Telltale bundle, Strider on the Capcom bundle etc etc
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i find it lame to give away "trash", like digitalhomicide bundles, 99% greenlit stuff and those simulators that are only good for idling cards. that's not generous at all, it's just a way to get rid of games and increase cv.
and yes, i did it in the past, so i'm also blaming myself.
i have nothing against bundles, especially when nice games get bundled (ie: borderlands, telltale games).
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Ok, that was exactly what was confusing me lol. The quoted sentence above was too vague and implied,at least as I read it, that all low tiered bundle stuff are crap but I see that's not the case.
I can see where you're coming from but still I disagree :3
Even the crappiest game can be used in trades. If your standards in what you accept are low ANYTHING can go. So even if it is bundle trash given away it's still something given away. If it's ONLY bundled trash that gets given away when that user clearly has the ability to do more then yeah, we agree :P
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i have nothing against bundles
Lmfao. I may have peed myself a little just now.
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I don't know about those games specifically but most of the time, when games go on the list "prematurely" it's because of some price glitch in a non region locked store page. A prime example I remember was this pack that due to a price glitch was insanely cheap in New Zealand(no region lock) for a short time. Like a dollar cheap. That day.. I cried a bit ._.
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I cried because I was buying it for someone else. I only had a few to sell.
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I was pretty fucking angry about Never Alone counting as "bundled" before as well. It was due to IGN Prime or something like that basically giving out the game for free, which is why it got added to the bundle list. X
One year after it happened.
But yeah, like you said, nothing we can do about it.
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I get angry once in a while on stuff here too, but usually it's just because people are jerks on occasion and some days I get saltier over it than others.
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There's no reason getting angry at Steam Gifts, the system works just fine as it is right now.
Would you prefer people exploiting the CV system with nigh-free games that give high CV value?
Steam Gifts user, on the other hand... while most are nice people, there're some that just seem to be here to piss others...
Obviously, I'm not talking about you, your thread is weird, but perfectly acceptable.
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Actually the system is not fine as many people, including myself, agree with OP. There's no reason why SG can't remember the date you made your giveaway and compare it with the date it became bundled. If your giveaway was made before the game got bundled you should retain full value for the game. If it was made on or after it got bundled then it gets 15% value. That would be FAIR.
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I thought I read that once a game gets bundled it retroactively affects previous giveaways. Guess I was mistaken.
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What you read was that games are being added to the bundle list with a slight(or in some cases big) delay and will retroactively affect giveaways created after that date(the date it started being considered bundled, not the date it was added to the list).
If for example a game gets bundled on May 9th there is a time slot while it's still not in the list. Let's say it gets added there on the 15th. So every giveaway created for that game after the 9th will retroactively switch CV to bundled. However everything before the 9th still gives full CV.
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Is it? I'm genuinely curious, because I also seem to remember reading statements to the contrary. In any case, the FAQ suggests that changes to the bundled games list applies retroactively. (Though I suppose it doesn't mention how far back it applies.)
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Though I suppose that might be in reaction to bundles that existed before the giveaway, but not added to the list at the time of the giveaway.
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Correct. :)
That's why it's best to compare to deal sites and steamdb for pricing history, before posting an unbundled game. Of course, nothing helps you catch on to price glitches or other exploits unless you happened to hear of them... but one could mostly argue that's due to the fault of the exploiters, not a fault of staff.
I say mostly, because the system could be reworked to be more responsive and clear in places.
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Man, that's the exact way it's happening, giveaway counts as bundled if it was created after the bundle/reason for bundling (deep discount) started. One would think you know this after your time on the site o.O
OP didn't state in the original post that the bundling happened because IGN Prime was giving it for subscribers, and because of some security leak or stuff TONS of accounts got registered, and still getting the games. I've seen a guy giving the IGN prime free games each month, ~50 copies.
The bundling was legit and a good decision.
The problem is that this happened like a year later, so while cutting back the abuser's CV, it also affected everyone who gave away the game during that one year period.
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I say, it is easy enough to spot the exploiters, just suspend them, and let the rest of us live in peace.
edit: I often traded tf2 keys for ign prime cd-keys, so no where near 95% off.
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Like I said, the system was flawd, and people registered ten thousands of accounts, resulting in a massive number of free games. Your trade for TF2 keys has no relevancy to the discounts and bundling at all.
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Yes, but the bundlelist counts for the many people that got a game on discount, not a handful of people that got most of the copies.
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it doesn't work fine, it's just the best we have... yet
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thus far, for now, until we get a better option, at the moment.
Yet is an adverb, and you're leaving it without a verb to associate with. Aside from being poor grammar and awkward sounding, it makes it sound like it has unlisted things that are bad about it that you are refraining from mentioning (or even that you think the condition will worsen), rather making it sound as though you expect it to be supplanted by better options in the future.
:)
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"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
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Posting that will get you blacklisted by a lot of people, when I wrote a similar comment I got on many, many blacklists.
I completely understand and agree with you. If I were to give away games because I wanted to increase my CV level, I'd just buy a bunch of 0.20€ keys from G2A and give them away. Why go through the trouble to buy, for example, Dark Souls for 5€, which is a game that a lot of people would love to get their hands on, if I can buy over 50 Why So Evil 2 keys for 0.15€ a piece.
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yay, thank you! I'm glad someone understands me :3
and I don't really care about the blacklists. if i blacklisted every person who somehow disagrees with me, no one would be able to enter my giveaways
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Me neither, don't care much about being blacklisted. It just goes to show how a lot of people will blacklist you for speaking out against the bad bundled game giveaways, because you seem ungrateful. One of the main reasons why I don't give away games frequently is because while I can get a game I want ppl to experience for 5€, I'll get the same amount of CV, or even less than someone who gives away 0.20€ games.
In essence, if you want a higher CV, you'll have to give away cheap games. Higher value for money.
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Maybe a visit from spacedog will cheer you up
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yeah it happened to me too with never alone. suddenly it counted as bundled after a few weeks of having full CV. So from now on i won't buy game with like 75% off because pretty sure they're cheaper in russia.
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It actually was NEVER at a price point to be bundled. (edit: UNTIL it was in that one humble bundle)
Just someone used fake/stolen credit cards to buy them in mass (probably less then 200? what is the # cut off point to be considered "free/bundled"? 10,000 copies?*) and the site they got the cd-keys from, NEVER revoked the game keys. (thank god).
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It's not something I personally care about I just do GAs to do GAs, but I can see your point if it's something you pay attention too it's bound to get annoying. The CV system isn't perfect but how would you change it?
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this is why I just GA bundled games. U don't need to worry if the game be counted as a bundled game later
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Steamgifts does seems pretty harsh when it (unjustifiably) retroactively changes the CV of a game. It has never happened to me, but I don't care about CV or levels, but I feel your pain. I think you have a right to be upset in this case.
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Well I gave away Brothers and I didn't know it was bundled, these things happen :P
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You should never give anything away and just leech like me.
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Oh well, I know how you feel.
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Never Alone was bundle because it was given away free on IGN prime April 2015
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i never liked the contributor value system, especially once it became criteria for entering giveaways.
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I like to think of it the other way around. I'm quite sure some giveaways I have entered wouldn't have existed in case there wasn't a possibility for the giveaway creator to limit to CV ratio and such. I've read giveaway descriptions where the creator specifically stated they bought those games to celebrate generous people on Steamgifts. That leads to more giveaways, and future public giveaways for the same games will have less entries (since some people have already won them from the extra giveaways) and hence better chances for those who enter the public one.
I like to give away a few extra games each time I win something, I'm sure many do the same thing, so winning one of those giveaways may create even more giveaways that would never exist if it wasn't possible for the original giveaway creator to make the restricted giveaway.
It also motivates users with the "give back to good contributors" mindset to do their giveaways outside of groups. There are some groups where there are lots of giveaways made by and for users with high CV ratio, but these are kept from the public by being in groups. If some users decide they can reach out to more by doing forum giveaways with similar CV requirements (but without the need to be a member of those groups), isn't that a good thing? Complaining might make them prefer sticking to their groups instead of reaching out to the public.
Don't be angry about giveaways you can't enter, be happy that people keep on contributing to the community, regardless of level/CV. There are loads of giveaways for each type of member, I've seen lots of giveaways that limits upwards too - max level, max number of wins or max won CV.
I'm not overly positive nor negative about the CV system. It's ok, it works, I don't mind - but - my guess is that if we would remove the CV system entirely we would see users who would stop giving since CV seems to be a high motivational factor. I don't think we would see users starting to give more because we finally would be free from the shackles of CV. ok, maybe ambidot
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ok, maybe ambidot
That should be the new sg tag-line. Much like "in bed", we'll just randomly throw it at the end of posts.
I can't think of anyone in my contacts that wouldn't likely get a smile out of that!
ok, maybe ambidot
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I know, it's frustrating. Also, an unfortunate side effect is that for some people this may also deter them from giving away non-bundle games.
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this thread title reminded me of a song and reminded me I miss energy 92.7... I Hate This Part (Digital Dog Club Mix warning, it is dance music with convenient lyrics
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Give gifts because you want to give, not because of silly internet points.
You should assume that every game will eventually be in a bundle somewhere, or a game will be reduced in price.
Only the first couple of levels here are really effected by this. If you are someone who keeps giving your SG level will rise.
This isn't a pissing contest. So go ahead and remove the tape from the floor and put your pecker back in your shorts.
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It stops being "silly internet points" the minute it has real measured consequences, which is exactly what CV has, since everyone's using level restrictions in their private GAs, most groups based on minimum level and a lot of public GAs. Getting better chances at all of those means they have actual importance for people who want to win games (which, I'm sure, describes 99.99% of SG users ok, maybe ambidot).
Read the OP again - the rant doesn't arise from a "pissing contest" mentality, just simple consequences.
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Nah, sorry but your wrong here. It is always silly internet points. This rant is posted at least once a month. Always crying about how they aren't getting enough pats on their back for what they gave. Doesn't matter if it is CV here, Reddit karma, or special flair from your favorite message board; it is only important to those that need to see how great they are. And as far as giveaways behind SGTools so what? The same game will be given out over and over again by others. Because, frankly if a level 6, like the OP or yourself, really wants a game that is locked behind a level 7 giveaway; you could just buy it and not worry about leveling up.
Most of the giveaways are for level 0 on this site. If you think that being left out of one because your level isn't high enough boy are you in for a shock when you find out about group and/or white list only giveaways.
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lol, what? XD
I don't want pats on my back, I don't need to be praised, I don't really care if senpai notices me. I want the system here to be fair. It isn't, so I'm angry. That's a perfectly normal reaction.
It's not just silly internet points. The contibution value system is here to encourage people to give away more. But it clearly doesn't work well in its current form. And yes, I'm butthurt because someone changed the status of the game after a year. Retroactive application of law is prohibited in civilised countries, hmmm, I bet there's a reason behind that.
Oh, and last thing, I can't hide my pecker because I don't have one. How do I win now? :/
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senpai never notices me.. :'(
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I've checked my Real CV stats on sgtools tonight and guess what? Lego Batman Trilogy, Unreal Deal Pack and Never Alone are bundled! (bought Never Alone on Steam and gave it away BEFORE it was in HB Indie Bundle 16).
So none of the games above have been bundled at the time I gave it away. Nor have they had 90% off. I assume it has something to do with russian ruble (damn you, Putin!) and how prices in Russia convert to USD. So, basically, we have to suffer because russian currency is weak. Cool.
I don't really know why the bundle games list even exists. I mean, if I plan to give a non-bundled game away, I always check the list. But what for? I might find the game I gave away among the bundled ones even months later (of course I'm not talking about giveaways created seconds after the bundle starts, I get it, no one sits in front of the computer all day, waiting for new bundles to appear, so the list can be expanded).
When you spend some money on a game and you get 15% RV off it you might feel cheated. What's the point in buying better games, when you can pay $1, get six mediocre games and the result will be the same? Sometimes I feel the need to give away something nice but the system here is really discouraging.
Perhaps I should just start buying region-locked gifts from Russia for cents, then create region-locked giveaways. It would be as fair as the way I'm treated.
Having said that, I don't expect anything to change; I know it won't. It's just a rant, I'm mad and I felt like letting off some steam (no pun intended).
Have a nice day everybody
sneaky giveaway, who would've thought
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