yeap, there a lot of bugs on this website, if u want close your eyes and dont see them - its your problem
ill beter solve problems, or u think i have close eyes too?
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It's a shame some people in this thread haven't seen all of his films.
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I'm level 2 without spending extra money. I get given keys a lot and most of the games I've given away are from bundles I bought that had games I already owned.
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If you buy a bundle for one or two games I still wouldn't consider the rest of them as free but I get what you mean. But I'm aware that even without spending money at all is is possible to level up for example using sites like Tremorgames. However OP suggested a slightly different approach in an old topic and then claimed he just wanted to point out a flaw in the system after people got pissed. If you want to know more I think Lugum linked a few of his old threads on page 2. They make up for a quite funny read ;)
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You my friend, just made my day!
Welcome to my whitelist
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Have you seen his other movies?
What real time strategy is rly goot to play
Banned on steam forum of Payday 2
Steam annoying me
Problem with my car
For the people that haven't seen his previous movie!
How to get lvl10 without spending money in few days
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I've seen them all but his debut film is still my favourite. I spend way too much time watching movies ;)
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I don't have a problem with my car so money to spare.
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If you have money to fix your gas tank then you must have enough to buy sixteen copies of Bad Rats.
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I make them buy the games and then I ask them to give me the games. It's even better.
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but you bought the SG gold membership monthly edition.
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Me personally I give here because I like it here and the people, I've won games it felt good to win and have something new to play so I just paid it forward make someone else smile give then some fun for awhile. Like yourself I don't have much to give but I still like to because of the people here which is weird cuz I really hate people.
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I would understand if you would say "Why do you give away games instead of giving money to homeless people?", but you're talking like you don't give a damn about the others. xD Anyway, why not give away games? There are some people that don't have money to buy games and I'm making giveaways for them. It feels great to help the others. When you make someone else happy, you become happy too.
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I was secretely hoping to see that comment here...
Thanks for the little bit of dream ;)
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Kudos, till this very day I haven't understood if you are a troll or not.
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It's about morality. Servers like this could not exist without the givers. Fortunately there are some mechanisms which give the givers the possibility don't feed people who don't contribute anything so it's not just feeding unknown people but something like cooperating with people like you.
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i work hard, i have expendable income, i buy bundles so i have games that i already own, might as well give it to someone else
and some occasions i buy 4 packs just to give 3 away to my close friends if they dont want them, i think of giving it away here in the form of fun forum giveaways(puzzles and years back i used itstoohard quizzes WITH CV locks because i dont like rewarding leechers and dont like rewarding those who dont participate in the community
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What better way to spend your money than to put joy in someone's heart? :)
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also pls answer: u giveaway games only here or bye games to your friends too
i have 2 friends, one of them have a little free money and always bye 2 game for himselves and for friend to play coop. This in only reason
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Yes, we buy games for our friends too. But why all these questions? :B
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coz its wierd for me spend money to unknown people
maybe coz i dont have free money :(
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So, you would never give money to a homeless person? If you were in his shoes, would you like it if nobody would give money to you?
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there r different homeless people, i see a lots of them neer church and after day they sit to own car and go away,
and i dont have even a bicucle, so who must give money?
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Hahaha, what are you talking about? xD Of course there are some beggars that actually have money (I've seen some people like that), but most beggars don't have money. So, why not give them money? Because you prefer to eat bbq meat? :P
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u know, there r was situation on market: some oldman bye chiepest chocolate and some fruits before some of holiday, on cash he dont have enouth money to bye all of it. I gve him a little - coz this old man is real, he rly need money. and oll og baggers who sit on church on subway and other plases - i dont trust them
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I know there are some people out there, just like yourself, that don't have the money to buy game for themselves.
As a gamer, all my life I wished to have original games. Original games were too fucking expensive in my country when I was a kid so everyone here was a pirate.
I grew up, got a good job, Steam happened and Sales followed.
I now can give people who don't have the money to buy their own games, like I was at one point, the chance of having them for free.
When on Sale I sometimes spend 5 bucks and get 5 or more games, so really, it's a no-brainer for me.
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we don't have a lot of money at all actually, but the traffic to our website from our SG giveaways helps push us up the search strings on Etsy, when taking into account visitor numbers, so it helps expose our shop to more people - We don't do it for sales from people at SteamGifts though :) Just a visit to the site from them helps in one way or another - perhaps they suggest us on facebook to some of their friends who may be looking for a christmas gift or some such thing - I like to hope every little helps :) - And if not, we like to think that if we give away some games then maybe others will think to do so as well, and steamgifts grows and expands, and gets better (or all of that may be wishful thinking)
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Seriously? I have an Etsy, but I knew nothing about search strings, etc...
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People have many reasons. Some are motivated by concepts of charity, generosity, altruism, and the like. Others are motivated by procuring prestige within SteamGifts or access to high-leveled giveaways. Ultimately, they are all based on some underlying self-interest, whether it is rational or not. It may take a moral form or it may simply be a means of aggrandizing one's own sense of being charitable toward others, thereby bolstering one's self-worth and providing a basis upon which they can tell themselves that they are contributing to improving the lives of others.
Each specific individual has their own rationale for doing so; there may be common traits and trends among them, but there is no single answer to your question. The fact that you prefer to spend your money differently is not only unsurprising, it's the norm. Whether that behavior changes and you begin to spend money giving away gifts on giveaway sites like SteamGifts is something you will find out in due time.
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It's not about convince someone, but I'd say what he said is very reasonable. For everything you do, there will be (and there must be) motivation. Some may be obvious (you eat when you feel hungry), while others not. Whether you like it or not, the connection will always be there.
Talking about morality, things/matter (or whatever, my English is not good enough to find the right word to use) doesn't have an attribute called good/evil, right/wrong. It's the men who decide that. They are so good at it, that they don't realize the process was actually happening in their own mind.
Ask yourself, if you did giveaways really out of nothing, why do you have to defend against the claim that "it's based on underlying self-interest" anyway? You wouldn't have cared. You posted because of your self-esteem, because you need to MAKE YOURSELF THINK that it's a righteous cause. But again, ideas themselves are always neutral, nothing is assigned tag:right or tag:wrong in the very beginning.
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I do support the idea of giveaways. What I'm arguing is, you cannot expect men to be absolutely righteous. No one can say that they do giveaways (or charities) with not a single bit of "impure" thought, or why'd you do this otherwise?
Edit: Ha, I should've known that I can't reason with these people without a brain of their own. Instead of listening to reasons, they just BL me :(
I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. - Evelyn Beatrice Hall (regularly misattributed to Voltaire)
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Just my personal opinion: why do people, especially here in this community, always put people giving away less at a disadvantage? It's the same logic as "shut up you criminal" (although that criminal has the very same right to speak as you do). Just because someone gives away less doesn't necessarily means that their argument is less valid. On the contrary, the fact that you're doing this proves that you're doing giveaways for you self-interest (to make you feel more privileged over other people).
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Oh yeah? Because that is your last line of defense, your "status" over other people in this community?
Leeching or not, that has nothing to do with whether giveaways are motivated by self-interest. Ask yourself:
If you can't think rationally and don't know the proper way to reason, why not just stay away from it?
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^thanks for the warning, very original of you to leech it from my post.
the are two kinds of leeches on sg,
those who are grateful, which it's fine with me. after all, this site is to get free games, can't blame them for not sharing my same way of thinking and sacrificing things they could do or get for themselves to give something back.
and there's also the shameless leeches, which are always angry with ga creators, constantly complaining they get blacklisted, crying about how sg is so unfair, how high-level-elitists leave them out of big GAs with nice games, always so bitter they are treated bad because they dare to speak against the oppressors, LONG LIVE SG WITHOUT PEOPLE THAT CONTRIBUTE!!!
and here's a suggestion for everyone in the second group:
stop biting the hand that feeds you. even a dog understands it.
want to leech in peace? don't belittle contributors when all you do is win. after all, without GAs this place wouldn't even exist.
also, thanks for the blacklist. i love to avoid GAs by people like you.
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I don't mind that most of the games I have gifted have gone to people with bad ratios. With the best will in the world, mathematically not everyone can have a good ratio. And it should be somewhere where people who can't afford games can have a go at winning something.
But I do worry about the mentality of people who have contributed nothing to the site and have won dozens or even hundreds of games and who still moan that the site doesn't favour them. I have no idea how much free stuff these people feel they are entitled to before the site is sufficiently 'fair' towards them.
Quite aside from the level 0 and level 1 users who sometimes pop up who have won more than myself or many other high level users who complain that the site is biased in favour of elitist high level users. Or the folks who own three times as many games as me on steam who say they can't afford to make giveaways. And so on and so forth...
I can understand that not everybody is in a position to give away a lot of games but plenty of people still find other positive ways to contribute. Or at least manage not to tell people to 'eat a bullet' in return for their free stuff.
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Yes, you are confused. No, you didn't say anything about any of those things.
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It was a reply to Mullins and was referencing previous serious issues that I have had with several others (but mostly Nokkenbuer). I don't necessarily agree with you but I wasn't making accusations against you. I'd have had no issue replying to you personally if I was doing that.
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I told MuIIins to go eat a bullet because of their snarky retort, shadow-blacklisting me, and oblique defense of BrianFarnet's indefensible action. I have zero interest in MuIIins' giveaways, so it has nothing to do with their giving away "free stuff". At least present my position fairly if you're going to present it at all.
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You are somebody that I have had quite reasonable conversations with before now, but also somebody who I feel has previously been unacceptably rude. I've got mixed feelings about you and I'm the first to admit that 'unacceptably rude' is a matter of opinion and that you might not agree with my assessment. I don't really want to start a fight but I'm not really prepared to put up with much of your crap either.
But if you are wondering where I personally draw the line then I really don't think snarkiness or blacklisting are anywhere near justification for telling anybody to 'eat a bullet'. And I really don't see how I am 'presenting your position unfairly'. Feel free to point out what specifically I said about yourself that you feel was unfair and I will attempt to address it.
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I'm a very curmudgeonly person, especially toward those who are hostile at me. I don't recall ever being hostile toward you, but that's because you've always been civil with me. Like I've explained many times before, I'm only ever intentionally hostile to reciprocate previous hostilities. I have no interest in being hostile for the sake of it, nor do I want to be hostile toward others, which is why I strongly prefer civil dialogue. I am consistently treated like shit on this forum whenever I post, however, so I'm oftentimes hostile on this forum, hence why you have noticed my "unacceptably rude" behavior so frequently. If you go back and check every instance of it, however, you'll notice that virtually all of them have only been after someone was "unacceptably rude" toward me, according to my standards.
Why does it matter if the tit is commensurate with the tat? This sort of comparative hostility analysis is, at best, quibbling for the purposes of justifying a collective overreaction. So what if I used a common phrase to express anger and disgust at a person? Why is that such an unfathomably high offense that the community gets triggered and proceeds to blow up the thread with petty drama while blacklisting me over a hundred times?
You stated that I told MuIIins to "'eat a bullet' in return for their free stuff". I have never received anything from MuIIins and, I assume, never will. My actions were due to MuIIins' behavior, not their contributions and any previous relationship I might have to them.
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You may not recall being hostile towards me and I try not to act according to grudges and have had civil conversations with you since - but I still very much feel that you have grievously insulted me in the past. I hate to say it, but in my own opinion I'm struggling to accept that all of your rudeness has been warranted.
Tit doesn't necessarily have to be commensurate with tat, but there certainly is still such a thing as an entirely disproportionate response. And disproportionate is relative - but for many people you were way on the wrong the side of acceptable with certain comments. It may be a cultural misunderstanding rather than malevolence, but it certainly wasn't a 'common phrase' for many people here and you are going to have to accept that in an international community some things are going to be taken literally by many people rather than in a context familiar to yourself.
Also I wouldn't get especially offended by 'the community' just for being blacklisted a lot. I get blacklisted any time I do anything despite having a good ratio, being incredibly sexy, etc - as do many others. Fortunately most of the time it's by people who don't even make giveaways and it means nothing, and the rest of the time it would just feel awkward to win a game from somebody who hated me anyway. Either ignore it or never draw attention to yourself by posting.
And I clearly did not state that you told Mullins to eat a bullet in return for their free stuff. I was making broad references to the behaviour of several individuals whom I expected Mullins to be familiar with. I didn't name you or make any specific claims against you. I apologise if you feel that I was implying accusations against you but that was not the case.
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You wonder why I said you don't know how to properly reason?
Did I ever said that I'm not grateful to GA creators? No, all I said is "giveaways are motivated by self-interest", and the reason for me to say it is, that every act of every human, comes from self-interest.
Admiting the imperfection is not shameful in itself. However, knowing that you (and me, and everyone) is imperfect but still trying to cover up and deny that fact is, to me, shameless.
P.S. The blacklist for you didn't come from replying to me, it comes from you calling someone "stupid piece of trash"
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For what purpose? What did I do to you? We haven't even interacted once, to my knowledge, so why are you retaliating in a fight that isn't yours?
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First things first, why I blacklisted you: because you insulted several other members of this community. I don't have to enumerate them, do I?
Why do I retaliate? Because I share your opinion, I want it to be heard. But I can hardly agree with the way you are arguing.
And by the way, most of my giveaways are for China only, because of steam's gifting restriction. BL or not, why would you care anyway?
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They also insulted me, and they actually initiated hostilities, too. I take it you blacklisted them all, as well, or are you being inconsistent in the punishment you're meting out? Moreover, why blacklist me at all? It doesn't solve anything, it doesn't correct anyone's behavior, and it only worsens relations between us. For example, I had you whitelisted for your statements above, but removed you when I discovered you blacklisted me. Since you're so opposed to retributive justice, it seems rather odd that you'd blacklist me ostensibly as a means of achieving retributive justice.
I care because blacklisting usually indicates damaged or negative relations and I have no interest in maintaining damaged or negative relations with you, so I want to redress any problems we have between us. I will probably never enter into your giveaways, and I'm not even been interested in most of the gifts you have given away, but you blacklisted me and if it is due to some unresolved problems between us, I want to resolve them forthwith if I can.
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This is only my personal opinion, you don't necessarily have to agree with me:
About retributive justice: IMO, I don't consider being insulted as an excuse for insulting someone else. I'd say it's more about getting revenge than justifying things. Do you think any modern jurisdiction will offer you immunity for an act of revenge, when the harm is done already? (None that I'm aware of) In this case, if you really think they insulted you, why not report them and leave it to someone else, a third-party, to judge? Retributive justice is definitely not about getting payback.
As a general rule: I think maybe you can control yourself and behave more politely, even when you think someone attacked you. This doesn't make your statements more correct, but it helps people accept your attitude, and your reasoning. I know it's hard but getting emotional only makes things worse.
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According to your twisted, fucked up illogic, anyone who so happens to have a ratio you don't like (a "leecher") is bad if they criticize how this site works and general trends within its community? What if the person isn't a "leecher" and so happens to be the most generous user on this site? What intellectually bankrupt excuse will you use to evade addressing their criticism then?
Your idiotic narrative about "leechers" is similar to the same sort of pathetic excuses that people use to discredit and dismiss the criticisms and critiques of others so long as they are poor, a shameless attempt at evading criticism by attacking the critic. Rather than actually addressing the arguments themselves, you choose instead to fallaciously denigrate the one making the arguments with the goal of silencing the arguer so that you don't have to face their arguments at all. That is the tactic of a coward who is afraid of criticism, not someone who is ostensibly a rational adult.
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I probably will within the next decade, so don't you worry. Feel free to take your own advice.
Now watch as my blacklists proceed to rise while you, unsurprisingly, continue to get a free pass because in this theater, I'm the bad guy and you aren't.
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Yes, it is true. This isn't even disputable and it demonstrates a profound ignorance of how humans behave to claim otherwise. My "leeching habits" on this site have nothing to do with this discussion, so I'd prefer for you to refrain from such attacks. Seeing as you have already shadow-blacklisted me like a petulant child despite zero interaction between us, however, please do everyone a favor and kill yourself immediately.
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Why should I show respect to petulant children who throws tantrums about some ridiculous "leeching" narrative and insult others based on that narrative, especially when such activities are wholly unrelated to the topic being discussed? BrianFarnet replied for the sole purpose of insulting and shaming me, not to provide any meaningful contribution to this thread or the points I made. The very least he could have done is explained why he disagreed with me and attempted to refute my claims. He didn't even do that. He simply degraded me in public.
Given that you have also shadow-blacklisted me for daring to be disrespectful to an asshole who showed disrespect to me, then you can go eat a bullet yourself. I have zero respect for people who show zero respect to me and I will never be ashamed of that fact. Fuck off.
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wow, you are trully a stupid piece of trash, exactly the kind of individual 100% useless in any community.
just fyi, i blacklisted you long ago for exactly this kind of reply. always so offended with people that refuse to be lectured by a pseudo-intellectual that hides behind "big" words.
keep telling people to kill themselves, maybe one day you will be successful. in the meantime, enjoy your incoming suspension.
then you can go eat a bullet yourself.
already tried twice and failed, maybe third time is the charm. thanks for the encouragement.
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Yes, BrianFarnet was behaving like a petulant child by bringing up my ratio as if that is remotely relevant for the sole purpose of insulting and shaming me. My subsequent hostility is a justified and appropriate response to that behavior, so it is not comparable. Moreover, there is a difference between unprovoked disrespect and being disrespectful in response to previous mistreatment. To equate the two is dishonest and misleading, something only the hard of thinking and cowardly would do.
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And why is that such a problem? Why shouldn't I, or anyone else, say that to someone else who was hostile without provocation and treats others as if they're beneath basic respect? What, is it really so much better to say some other insult or phrase that doesn't refer to the unspeakable and unthinkable act of suicide? Don't be silly.
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Bringing up your ratio isn't equal with personal atack such as that. Why would anyone should respect you with your attitude combined with your ratio? You basicly calling everyone giving something away selfish without contributing much and you expect to people respect it? I don't mind ratio things much but if you aren't giving something you can't expect people to respect you for it. It's that easy. Telling people something like that is basicly admiting that you have no excuse and still be disrespectful toward who does it. At least the guy who opened the thread is honest about it unlike you.
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Are you really quibbling over whether the tit is roughly commensurate with the tat according to some arbitrary and undefined standard? I despise it when someone brings up my ratio because it is the arguably the single most immature and petty thing someone can do on this site. Anyone who does so will be met with extreme hostility from me because I consider it to be behavior which automatically disqualifies them from any and all respect.
Perhaps someone should show respect to me because I'm a human being deserving of basic respect regardless of whether my ratio is up to whatever arbitrary standards you use to prejudge others? Why should I only receive respect if I meet those arbitrary standards of yours and spend my money in order to do so? You're basically admitting that this whole giveaway business isn't about generosity, but that it's a hustle by elitists to browbeat others into spending their money under threat of blacklist and public humiliation for being "leechers". If the only way for users to be treated like they are more than subhuman trash is for them to present sacrifices to the giveaway gods of this site, then the site and everyone on it can go fuck themselves. That's not a giveaway site based on altruism and generosity or whatever bullshit ideas people pretend to uphold on here; that a site based on the notion of self-aggrandizement and flaunting one's wealth by giving away to the filthy rabble, which one can then abuse as "leechers" when they dare to accept and can't afford to give away gifts themselves.
You don't know why my ratio is like that. You don't know that I'm so poor that I can barely afford rent or food, much less video games for myself and doubly so for the people on this site, which seem increasingly composed of elitist ingrates like those above. You don't know that I'm too disabled and lacking in opportunities to get a job, and thus cannot even hope to earn the money in order to be charitable. You don't know that I would be charitable if I had the money, though I'd probably actually spend my money on helping those in need rather than giving away overcharged digital licenses of mediocre games on a giveaway site.
You don't know that, and yet it seems like people like you have no problem with assuming that my ratio is the way it is because I'm some "leech". That's the sort of reactionary conservative stupidity I'd expect from the useful idiots who vote for Republicans or Tories or whatever their country equivalent is elsewhere, not on a giveaway site that is ostensibly about charity and altruism.
No, I said that people give away ultimately out of self-interest, not because they are selfish. Learn the difference between the two. I don't know what incoherent point you were trying to make in the final three sentences, but I have not been dishonest this entire time. I have been authentic and candid to the point that I've been blacklisted multiple times within the past hour for daring to express my sincere thoughts and feelings. To accuse me of dishonesty is ridiculous.
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It always was, though it's probably very unwise for me to be so open about my personal information. I'm not sure why you doubted it. I grew up in the "upper slums", so to speak, of Houston. Right now, the Texas economy isn't good, as is the case for the U.S. in general. Additionally, the welfare I'm able to receive isn't much because Texas, being a deeply conservative state, isn't too fond of giving welfare to "leeches" like me, despite how it's the only means of subsistence I have and I have no way of providing for myself at this time.
Come to think of it, that's probably why I am so hostile toward perceive elitism and slights about me being a "leech". Being poor, disabled, and living in a country and state whose principal narrative about people like me is that they're lazy "leeches" who are inferior by virtue of that quality can really take a toll on how much a person can tolerate being accused of that, especially without provocation. That entire narrative has been effectively internalized by people like me. The last thing we need is to be told it by some jackass on the Internet, and when it happens, it can be explosive.
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sigh The decent person and the true asshole in me fought a little over how to respond to this.
The decent person in me is still a bit sceptical, but won.
Good luck in finding a more stable way of sustaining yourself apart from state welfare. I'm sitting out the rest of this conversation chain.
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I doubt I will. Given the economic prospects of this country and the direction it's going, let alone the world economy, it'll only get worse from here. My optimism only extends to what is possible, but not to what is likely. Regardless, thanks.
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Even though I have my not-so-great opinion of the average American and their mental capabilities (or the utter lack of), I have little doubt that the USA will always finds its way as a collective to prosperity. Sometimes through hard work, sometimes through exploitation, manipulation, but they somehow tend to find the ways to greatness.
(Unless they put enough idiots in the Congress and Senate to start a war with China.)
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I don't think this really has anything to do with the capabilities of this country, to be honest. Capitalism is dying and it's beginning to spin out of control. Whatever capabilities this country may have, not even it can prevent the internal contradictions of capitalism from leading to its self-destruction, especially when capitalism has already abandoned the United States. This isn't just my opinion; leading economists and those up top are concluding this as well.
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You are not a "human being deserve basic respect" after your first replay. Also I didn't read your whole comment and don't care what you think. But saying your sincere thoughts and feelings are telling people to go kill themselves are beyond help and seeing what you write to others made me shadow blacklist you. Just saying.
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Oh, so now I'm a subhuman? Thanks for proving my point. If you don't care what I think, then fuck off and stop wasting my time. "Just saying."
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So when somebody insults you or in any other way disrespects your person, your opinion or your habits, you absolutely must show him that you're at the same (or even worse) level and insult back? Is insulting people that satisfying to you?
I'm not in position to judge you, your ratio or your opinion, but to me you did respond with an insult to something that was not even direct insult itself, so you're not really better than the guy above. The question is, will you now respond to my neutral response with hate and insults because I don't agree with your opinion, or will you try to take it neutral and notice that majority doesn't agree with you, possibly hinting re-evaluation of your recent actions.
Act in the same way you'd like others to do.
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What's the alternative? To just acquiesce to the abuse and shrink away politely as I'm being publicly humiliated and degraded by elitist snobs who think they have a prerogative to mistreat "leechers"? I have an intact spine and I don't take kindly to people mistreating me, so I respond with hostility in kind. I gave up on trying to be "nice" to people who treat me like shit long ago because it's cowardly, it doesn't work, and it accomplishes nothing other than making me look weak and submissive. I'd rather be hated by many as a rude curmudgeon for defending myself and showing that I don't tolerate such mistreatment than to take it like an impotent eunuch with a penchant for masochism.
I completely understand that my behavior is unseemly and exceedingly hostile. That is intentional. I honestly don't care if it makes me look "worse" than the other person, since I consider such judgments to be an unfair attempt at distracting from the misconduct of the one whose hostility was unprovoked and shifting the attention to the person who responded in due kind. The purpose of my behavior is to express my anger and to show unequivocally that I do not tolerate being treated as some subhuman simply because of my ratio.
If I knew of a better way of handling these instances which I considered effective and which I felt didn't emasculate me in the process, then I would use that method. Perhaps I'm just socially unequipped for these sort of interactions, since I am not good at de-escalating hostilities, especially when the hostilities were unprovoked. I prefer to express my anger and make it known that I don't tolerate being talked down to, however, than to roll over and hope that next time, I'm not kicked harder.
EDIT:
Act in the same way you'd like others to do.
The same applies to people like BrianFarnet and Mullins. If they didn't want to receive hostility, they shouldn't be hostile. They already initiated the hostilities; I'm simply standing my ground. If they were never hostile, I wouldn't have been hostile toward them, just like I'm not being hostile toward you because I haven't detected any hostility from you. I'm fine with, and prefer, to maintain civil dialogue and amicable relations, but I don't extend that to those who refuse to extend it to me.
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The same applies to people like BrianFarnet and Mullins
I never said that I share their opinion, or agree with them.
If I knew of a better way of handling these instances which I considered effective and which I felt didn't emasculate me in the process, then I would use that method.
How effective insulting is? Does it make the other person afraid of insulting back? Does it logically prove your point of view, or makes the other person re-think their actions? Is it really that effective? Because to me you lost your patience and lost the battle against very simple and poor sarcasm. You got triggered. Even the worst internet troll would call it a grand success, so how exactly your method is more effective?
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I never said you shared their opinion or agree with them, either. I'm simply pointing out that the same is applicable. Please don't take it as a personal slight; that wasn't my intention.
How effective insulting is? Does it make the other person afraid of insulting back? Does it logically prove your point of view, or makes the other person re-think their actions? Is it really that effective? Because to me you lost your patience and lost the battle against very simple and poor sarcasm. You got triggered. Even the worst internet troll would call it a grand success, so how exactly your method is more effective?
The efficacy to which I referred is not necessarily about dissuading my interlocutor from such behavior. Is my behavior effective at signaling to everyone that I don't appreciate such mistreatment and degradation? I think so, even though my own behavior is unseemly. Is it effective at avoiding a situation and reputation wherein I'm viewed as acquiescent to being mistreated and abused? My guess is yes, despite it developing a reputation of me being a curmudgeon (which is preferable to me). Is it effective at showing others that this ridiculous "leecher" narrative is in no way an accepted and indisputable part of this site's culture? I'd say yes, as well, even though I fall in that "leecher" category.
In my opinion, there is no good and reliable way of handling people who initiate hostilities, not even ignoring the troll. Due to that, it's more prudent for me to decide how I want to shape the outcome of the exchange for the audience. Which is more important to me: not being on blacklists and not having a reputation as a curmudgeon; or not giving this rdiculous "leecher" narrative a free pass, not allowing others to talk down to me, and not having a reputation as a pushover who people can talk down to without retaliation? I choose the latter.
Maybe my choosing that, or how I view this whole issue, is a sign of social ineptitude on my part. I have tried handling these issues in different ways, however, and they always left me more dissatisfied than how I handle them now, not to mention feeling completely inauthentic to who I am and how I really think and feel. There is no clear winning in such situations, so I just have to choose which loss I prefer.
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As if that snarky reply, coupled with your shadow-blacklisting of me, doesn't count as the initial provocation? Fuck off already.
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should i have announced the blacklist with fireworks and 10 threads filled with giveaways instead?
oh wait let me fix it
see? NOW you have the right to get offended.
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At this point, I can only assume that you're literally a child, or you are so blinded by rage that you feel compelled to shout down from your illusory throne abusive epithets at me, all of which much better describe you than me.
Third time's a charm. Give it a shot. Final response.
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Oooo I smelled drama ... what is really the point of this discussion ???
Also Nokkenbuer from what you said until now I can deduct that you see the world as black and white which by my humble opinion it is not but hey I may be wrong PEACE :D
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Then your "deduction" would be categorically incorrect, which is very telling about your ability to assess my worldview.
There is no real point to this entire discussion, aside from me defending myself from the manufactured outrage and conniption fits that users are throwing because I dared use a common phrase that people use to basically mean "fuck off" in response to unprovoked attacks by another user. All I did was respond to the OP and BrianFarnet came in, out of the blue, to take a potshot at me. I told him to off himself and everyone proceeded to give BrianFarnet a free pass for his indefensible misconduct to focus on dogpiling me for having the temerity to tell him to off himself. Overall, it's just further proof to me that this community is a toxic hellscape of some of the most despicable people I've ever had the misfortune to meet online.
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"Then your "deduction" would be categorically incorrect, which is very telling about your ability to assess my worldview." This tells a lot about you, my deduction was not meant to be perfect and maybe even correct , then it comes this : "which is very telling about your ability to assess my worldview. "so with different words because what I said you already categorized me as not having the ability to assess (not that I have because I don't know you ), this is why I said about you that you see in black and white (supposition , don't know you yet) and with the answer that you gave me and all the answers that you wrote I can say that I was not so far from the truth but as I said I may be wrong only time will tell :D
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No, I simply implied that you have demonstrated thus far an inability to accurately assess my worldview. Your reply just now only reinforces this assessment. I didn't make any absolute assessment of you, despite the ridiculous and unsubstantiated narrative you're trying to push about me.
Stop trying to guess my worldview and rationalize my responses as confirming it. It's silly.
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I will stop " guess my worldview and rationalize my responses as confirming it" when you will stop using words that you may or may not know the meaning of . And if you know the mining of those words it is even worse because you just demonstrante the need to be apart of those elitist that you say that you don't like which is ironic.
" I simply implied that you have demonstrated thus far an inability to accurately assess my worldview." - which is a no brainier because that remark was more a bait to see what you would say :D
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I am using those terms completely accurately and I understand their meaning just fine. I use those words because they are a part of my natural vocabulary and I want to express myself as accurately, clearly, and precisely as possible. It has nothing to do with any form of "elitism". Whining about my vocabulary only suggests that yours isn't particularly developed.
By the way, use > to quote text. You can read more about comment formatting here.
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I know about how to a quote text , I just don't want to use it , simple as that but hey thanks for the advice :D
"I am using those terms completely accurately and I understand their meaning just fine. I use those words because they are a part of my natural vocabulary and I want to express myself as accurately, clearly, and precisely as possible. It has nothing to do with any form of "elitism". Whining about my vocabulary only suggests that yours isn't particularly developed."
Or are you just using the more ambiguous therms to fill more secure in the same way that you used this : "Whining about my vocabulary only suggests that yours isn't particularly developed." , by "demonstrating" that I am on an inferior level of formal language that you , which may or may not be the case , you know you don't only have to know the meaning of the words but also the context.
If you would have studied communication(not a big specialist here) you would know that worlds are only a small part of comuni cation , and gestures , context , language ,canal and other elements are more important . So even if you use those pompos words to expres yourself if the one that listens doesn't get the information it is all for nothing . To know when to use those words is it maybe more important than to know the meaning of all those words.
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Yes, because making a fool of one's self by using extremely large text (as if that even makes sense) and calling me a "stupid" and "useless piece of trash" is surely not indication of an extreme anger being vented, right?
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No one called you stupid or a piece of trash or anything similar until you started telling people to kill themselves. Neither the original reply to you or MuIIins first reply is worth getting angry about, especially when written online. Those replies might be slightly looking down on your opinion, sure, but they are in no way offensive or rude. Unlike your reply telling them to die.
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BrianFarnet's degrading remark was offensive, rude, and unacceptable to me. That is why I responded in the way I did. MuIIins' shadow-blacklisting me was the principal cause for my hostility toward MuIIins, not MuIIins' snarky retort, which was just a minor irritation. Seeing as MuIIins was effectively siding with the indefensible behavior of BrianFarnet, however, I simply told MuIIins what I also told BrianFarnet. Like I said above, to treat my choice of saying "go away, I don't like you" as if it's so unspeakably bad is at best quibbling and overreacting.
Why is nobody getting on BrianFarnet's case, or MuIIins', despite how their behavior was at least similarly as reprehensible, if not more so due to the unprovoked nature of their hostilities? It's quite telling of how this toxic cesspit of a community is that it gave both of them a free pass and decided to bitch instead about my use of a naughty phrase that hurt their fee-fees, even though they initiated hostilities and without justification.
The absurdity of all this baffles me.
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Now, what's so bad about shadow-blacklisting? Do you really expect everyone to have a discussion about it "just in case" the issue might be solved? What if they already knew that there'd be no way that the blacklisted person could talk their way out of the blacklisting, should they still waste time on such a useless discussion? I don't see the point in that.
You honestly can't see the difference between telling someone that you want them to die and simply telling them to shut up or go away? I would have no problem with people telling me to "shut the fuck up" or "get the fuck out of here you fucking idiot" or similar rude and offensive things, but I draw the line when they tell me (or others) to die. That is in my eyes something unexcuseable.
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I have a problem with the blacklisting system itself; my use of "shadow-blacklisting" is simply my way of highlighting the cowardly and insidious way that the blacklisting system causes social problems within the community, in much the same way "shadow-banning" does elsewhere.
An improvement over how interactions which lead to blacklisting currently occur would be for users to openly state when hostilities are mounting something to the effect of: "If you continue this behavior, I'm going to blacklist you." I think that sort of candor about blacklisting would actually serve as a potential means of de-escalating conflict, since it would open up communication about the perceive misconduct itself rather than leaving it unspoken so that it could fester without being addressed. Most users would probably like to avoid being blacklisted, so they would take the threat as an opportunity to repair relations. If they don't, then they'd be blacklisted anyway.
I'm used to communities wherein extremely hostile rhetoric like that is commonplace, so I sometimes forget about the norms of this community and operate under those more familiar norms here. To me, "kill yourself" is basically the equivalent of saying "you're as good as dead to me, so go away". It was my mistake to not account for how much more tame the norms are here compared to elsewhere.
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"I'm used to communities wherein extremely hostile rhetoric like that is commonplace, so I sometimes forget about the norms of this community and operate under those more familiar norms here."
I really don't believe this excuse. Frankly, you should realize that by creating a condescending explanation of why everyone here creates giveaways (I actually agree with your post for the most part) you are opening yourself up to being called out for leeching (which you are). Perhaps you should spend a little less time thinking about how to talk down to others and more time thinking about which community you are actually taking part in because "he hurt my feelings and other communities are mean" is a pretty weak excuse for telling anyone to kill themself no matter how you try to spin it.
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If someone interprets my original reply as condescending, that's their problem. I did not intend that in the slightest and I deliberately constructed my reply to be neutral and uncontroversial. As for "leeching", I reject the very premises of that narrative, so "leeching" to me doesn't exist on giveaway sites as far as I'm concerned. No, I didn't expect for someone to come out of the blue and take a potshot at me about my ratio just because I gave a reply to the OP about why people give away on SteamGifts. That seems like a rather unfair thing to expect someone to themselves expect.
What I'm saying is that I'm more used to that sort of extreme rhetoric due to the communities I have primarily frequented online, so I carelessly used it here in a moment of anger at an unprovoked slight without considering how it might be interpreted by those reading the exchange. If you don't consider that to be a satisfactory explanation, then too bad. That's the best explanation I can find for why I said that. What explanation would satisfy your undefined standards?
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I wasn't clear with my point so allow me elaborate. Perception always outweighs intent regarding communication and your other posts suggest enough intelligence where I'd think you would know that (which is why I find the "wrong community / I didn't mean it like that" hard to believe). Go back and reread your initial post from the perspective of an average SG user; I understand your point is neutral but my initial reaction after reading your post was "this one is about to get called out if his ratio isn't positive" followed by a laugh when that's exactly what the post below it did. If you can't see how the explanation "it serves their own interests on some level" would seem like a condescending answer to the question "why do you give away gifts?" from a SG users perspective, I'm not sure how much further I can go with my point.
I actually find your explanation completely satisfactory and even empathize with your story and how it garnered the reaction it when you were called a leech; what I didn't find satisfactory was most of the arguments and condescension that followed. Just like I can understand why you would get that upset at being called a leech, I can understand why everyone thinks you are a giant asshole for your response. I guess my point is that you shouldn't have been surprised that someone called you out after your first post, you shouldn't have been surprised at the reaction to "kill yourself" post, and maybe you should hit the pause button and consider the medium, context, and audience of your posts next time so you don't get so much flak.
Lastly, if you reject the premise of leeching why get angry when someone calls you one?
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Maybe I'm just naïve, but I'd like to think that the average SteamGifts user isn't such a hypersensitive reactionary that they would take my rather uncontroversial point of people doing things because it satisfies something they desire as some personal slight that demands an immediate ratio check to determine whether the individual is a dirty "leecher". That is the sort of behavior that I would honestly expect from a literal child or someone who is not very bright. I'd prefer to not think of the average SteamGifts user as that, since that's unfair to this community (despite the overwhelming evidence), so I expect more from this community. Perhaps I should stop doing so and it's my fault for expecting higher standards from a community that has only proven otherwise.
Yes, I completely bungled this entire thread, while BrianFarnet conveniently gets completely let off the hook the entire time and even gets defended when anyone besides me deigned to acknowledge his initial contribution. It's as if he never replied and I simply told a nonexistent person to off their self. I'm fine with admitting where I messed up; I've done so multiple times. What I'm not fine with is everyone has decided to dogpile me and treat me like a literal subhuman, like almost every single time I participate in a thread on this site, and focus on me and my conduct without contextualizing it in the larger discussion.
The only thing that genuinely surprised me was BrianFarnet's initial potshot and the complete silence about his potshot by everyone except me. I expected some flak for my behavior, since I always get some, but nothing on the magnitude of what this thread became. I have been blacklisted by over 50 people due to this thread alone.
Lastly, if you reject the premise of leeching why get angry when someone calls you one?
For the same reason why a black person might prefer to not be called a racial slur by a racist even though he or she rejects the premises which inform the racist narrative of those slurs: the narrative still exists and others accept and promote it, even though I might not personally consider it credible.
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I blacklisted you. Feel free to do the same. I don't really care. There I'm not in the shadows anymore. I stepped into the light.
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Why did you? What motivated you to blacklist me? After all, I don't recall us interacting at all, nor have I been hostile toward you whatsoever. Whatever your rationale for blacklisting me may be, it seems predicated on participating in a fight that isn't yours.
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I blacklisted you ages ago from the looks of it, because I checked. Probably has something to do with your attitude. Easier ways to get your point across.
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Why does my attitude matter to you if it's not directed at you?
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Why do you insist on telling people to go kill themselves? My blacklist is my blacklist, if someone is spouting out hateful rhetoric, even if it's not directed at me I'm allowed to blacklist them so that they don't win my games. It's a free country.
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I do so because I'm angry and such expressions are, to me, the apotheosis of such anger. It's the most powerful expression of disgust toward someone. I rarely mean it literally, of course, just as I didn't mean it literally with BrianFarnet. It was my way of saying "with that behavior, you're as good as dead to me" in a more hostile way. Is it a nice thing to say? Of course not, and it's obviously not meant to be. It's an old habit I picked up from over a decade of being in more surly communities. I'm not proud of such behavior, and oftentimes regret it, but it is nevertheless something I do. Hopefully, I don't in the future, but I doubt that.
I'm not questioning whether you're entitled to do so and it's fallacious to use such arguments as a justification for your doing so. I didn't ask whether you are entitled to blacklist me for my behavior (which you are) or whether this is a "free country" (which it isn't). Such statements are usually used by someone after they did something bad as a way of excusing it, so it's rather suggestive that you'd use them now. In any case, you still haven't answered my question: why does it matter to you?
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You need some anger management classes, or you need to take yoga, or breathe or something. I dunno pet a kitten, or hug a baby or something.
Also, no. I told you why I did something, because I can. That's the crux of the matter. I didn't shadow blacklist you, I didn't do anything of the sort. I Blacklisted you because you're an ass. It doesn't have to be directed at me for me to say that behavior is unacceptable. Which quite frankly it is.
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Anger management classes cost an exorbitant amount of money. If I can't even afford rent and food without help, much less gifts to give away on this site, then how do you expect me to pay for classes from some mediocre counselor to rehearse the same generic course for hundreds if not thousands of dollars? People don't get help in this society because they need it, only if they can afford it. That's how capitalism works.
"Because I can" is not a reason or set of reasons explaining and justifying your action, only an affirmation of your ability to perform it, nor did I even ask for you to provide any such rationale. I simply asked you why it matters to you how I behave if it's not directed at you. The best answer you have mustered thus far is that the acceptability of my behavior is not dependent on who it is directed at and the reason why you consider my behavior unacceptable is, I gather, because I'm apparently "an ass", whatever that means. What, then, can I do to redress this problem and have you remove me from your blacklist? Is that even an option? If not, why not?
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There are plenty of free services for people if you know where to look. Whether you are religious or not, at some church they have Councillors who would help with this thing. Also a quick google search offered plenty of suggestions including looking up the National Alliance on Mental Illness. Seeing if there is a chapter near you that offers anger management classes and maybe they have a suggestion.
This is my community as well. Someone acting belligerently, being rude and combative is problematic. There are plenty of people with differing opinions, who I can get along with so long as you're not combative, rude and or threatening. In fact we might not agree on anything, but there are ways to talk about things like that. Who cares if someone calls you a leech. I could give a fuck if you called me an elite son of a bitch either, but telling someone to kill themselves because you were mildly offended shows that they don't have a problem, you do.
You have anger issues, get them figured out and maybe when you're a slightly happier person, good things might come your way.
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Those services remain unavailable to me, especially when I have no means of transportation.
Have I been "belligerent", "rude", or "combative" toward you? No, I have not. Yes, I was that way to others, but why was I? Perhaps it's because they were initially hostile toward me? Tell me, have you blacklisted them as well? What does that accomplish toward resolving this issue? It doesn't correct my behavior or anybody else's. It may provide an outlet whereby you can momentarily vent your frustration (which is itself telling) and spitefully deprive me of an opportunity to enter your giveaways (which probably wouldn't have happened anyway), but that's it. No solution, no justice, just punishment for the sake of it.
You're drawing a completely arbitrary distinction between my behavior and the behavior of others in this thread. So what about what I said? It's offensive and rude and all that stuff. I get that. The same applies to their behavior. Are you responding the same way to them, or are you being inconsistent in the punishment you're meting out to the community's bad actors?
If I had such anger issues, I wouldn't be responding to you civilly despite your rather harsh criticisms of me. The fact of this very dialogue being so civil contradicts that assertion. It seems to me that you're just trying to rationalize punishing someone who you yourself are implying is too incompetent to control the very behavior for which you are punishing them. Wouldn't that very incompetency also entail an absolution of accountability for that behavior, since clearly it is out of my control and I'm unfit to be held responsibility for such things? At the very least, wouldn't that entail leniency, especially since I wasn't even the one who initiated hostilities? Your failure to even contextualize my conduct suggests that you're more interested in sticking it to me than actually addressing this issue. That sounds more like you are the one with thinly-veiled anger problems, not me.
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Uh. I'm always fine, I'm not here cursing in your face, I'm not angry, I'm just me. You're not really a blip on the old radar when I have other things to worry about. You asked me a question I replied. You may not like the answer, but the way I see it. This is a community, and yes there are people in every community that we avoid. Whether you're a racist, a guy with clear anger issues or simply a person who likes to dress up as a clown.
Look, you don't know me. But let me tell you something, I was walking down the street talking to my muslim friends and this person called them a Sand n--r this wasn't directed at me, they weren't saying it to me. I was offended all the same.You don't have to be the one insulted to feel empathy, or at the very least annoyance and anger at someone's rudeness and callous words.
I like Mullins. We may not be personal friends and I've probably never said much to her and we probably don't agree on a lot of things, but I like Mullins and I'm allowed to get annoyed on someone's behalf. You may not like my attitude but I haven't been a dick to you, I haven't gotten angry with you and I haven't been insulting.
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The same applies with me to you. You're trying to portray yourself as markedly different from the demonized caricature of me you're trying to push, but all you've done is show that your characterizations of me have been wrong and your attempts at differentiating yourself from me have failed. You're not really giving me, or anyone else, good reason to believe that I'm the horrible person with debilitating anger issues that you want to portray me as being.
Your vague post above has accomplished nothing. It didn't answer any of the questions I asked or furthered any resolution between us. It was just a defensive rant whose purpose was to differentiate us using a contrived narrative about me that isn't even accurate (and it failed). Are you going to answer the questions I asked and work toward resolving any disagreements between us, or not? If not, then it's awfully ironic that the evil bogeyman with anger issues is the one trying to achieve conflict resolution while you, the ostensibly civil and decorous gentleman of this community, refuse to do so.
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And I take great solace in the fact that my poverty and activities on this site irritate elitist snobs such as yourself. Please do continue to inform me whenever my mere presence induces a conniption within that vacant skull of yours; I truly do appreciate it.
If people don't want to engage in a civil dialogue with me, then perhaps they shouldn't respond in the first place. BrianFarnet responded to me; I didn't initiate any conversation with him. I was simply replying to the OP and answering his question with my opinion. Likewise, you responded to me. If you didn't want me to respond, then do everyone a favor and shut the fuck up. Similarly, if you're so intimidated by big scary words that people with developed vocabularies use, then I suggest you go someplace that better suits your reading level, such as the KidzWorld forums. This "pseudo-intellectual" (big word!) will continue to use his natural vocabulary with pride, and will continue to provide thorough replies impenitently (big word!), so you'll need to either learn how to cope with such a personal tragedy or get the fuck off this site.
My behavior has not violated a single policy or rule on SteamGifts, so it would probably be best if you didn't burden the support with a frivolous report just because you're mad that I hurt your fee-fees. Feel free to report me, though, since nothing I have done is in violation.
If someone actually commits suicide because a stranger on the Internet made a passing remark about doing so after that person showed unprovoked hostility to the stranger, then clearly that person was likely going to do so anyway. I am not responsible for the actions of others. Perhaps if you and BrianFarnet were respectful toward me, I would have reciprocated (big word!) the decorum (big word!), like I have been consistently shown to do in the hundreds of times I've replied in the SteamGifts forum to other users. You fucked up, and you treated me like I was unworthy of basic respect, so don't be surprised when that behavior is reciprocated. If you don't like that, then don't act that way.
I don't believe for a moment that you have attempted suicide, nor is your pathetic attempt at guilting me for my previous response going to work. Perhaps if you weren't so insolent and hostile toward others, you wouldn't experience such hostility toward yourself.
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She says "classy" and you go off on a rant telling her to kill herself? And you call her childish?
A truly worthless individual, both to this community and, judging by your anger issues, the human race as a whole. Oh, and I didn't shadow-blacklist you. I just plain blacklisted you months ago for being a completely worthless jackass.
I'm now bumping this to let others know what a jackass you are, so they can decide if they want to "shadow" blacklist you as well. :)
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Mullins also shadow-blacklisted me. Since Mullins was supporting the indefensible conduct of BrianFarnet through their actions, I gave Mullins the same suggestion I have to him. Yes, it is childish to make a snide, sarcastic retort in a conversation of which you aren't a part for the purposes of provoking someone, only to proceed to talk to them like they're a subhuman or a slave when that person dares to respond with hostility in kind.
Take the same advice I gave to the "worthless individuals" above for the same behavior you're putting on display now. I don't care in the slightest that you blacklisted me, since you're too busy circlejerking with other elitists by creating high-leveled mediocre games that I couldn't enter to win (and don't care to win), anyway. Congratulations on accomplishing nothing. Quite the example of something a "worthless individual" would do.
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damn, why do you and mullins bother?
i mean, he either doesn't care, or he gets a kick out of this.
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i figured ;)
sadly, i don't use BL, otherwise he is a perfect example for one
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A pity, too, since you were on my whitelist. Good to know that I can safely remove you from that now.
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Time for bed son. The internet will still be here tomorrow.
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Am I talking to you? No, so get lost. If I need a shadow-blacklisting coward to give me some unoriginal retorts, then I'll be sure to call on you. Until then, stick to circlejerking with your fellow elitists.
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and what should i do with that information.
you berate others for their easy fingers on the lists, yet you do the same.
i don't use either.
have a great day sir.
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I never said I was going to blacklist you. I was simply disappointed that you would blacklist me, since I thought we were on amicable terms. What you should do with that information is to consider why I might do that and whether you want to change what happened.
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So that those select few could get the opportunity to win the only trash I can ever afford. This isn't difficult to understand, pissant.
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but as you can see, the S-M-R-T one does a perfect job on his own.
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You want a reply to remind you about this later? Can do.
Thought the thread could use some music too. Shadow-blacklist Qu'est-ce que c'est
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Not a favour to me , telling people to kill themselves because they have an opinion , that it is not the same as yours ? Who is the pedulant child here? I try not to enter in this kind of "fight thread" but reading such kind of things trying to show that you are a really mature human being make me lose my nerves...If you want RESPECT , first you have to do is to be respectful. I didn't see any insult until you first started doing it. People BL others with reasons or not , but to tell them to kill themselves for that ? WOW, what a human being.. And I don't care if you care about it or not BUT "I'M ANOTHER PEDULANT CHILD THAT IS BL YOU IS THAT WHAT REALLY MATTERS TO YOU IN LIFE , In fact that's what you are showing telling people to kill themselves for Blacklisted you. Shame on your behaviour.
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I told BrianFarnet to off himself because he spoke down to me like I'm some subhuman who's beneath contempt for daring to have a ratio that isn't to his liking. I don't care if he has an opinion, and I'm fine with him expressing it in a civil way. In fact, I prefer that! So don't be disingenuous or dishonest; this has nothing to do with BrianFarnet expressing his opinion and everything to do with his unprovoked hostilities toward me. The petulant child is obviously BrianFarnet in this situation, since he replied for the sole purpose of insulting and demeaning me without any provocation. My response was justified given his abusive behavior toward me.
I was respectful in my initial reply. Where in my original post, which was directed at the OP, was I disrespectful? Like I said and showed above, I am respectful toward others only if they reciprocate that respect. The moment they stop, I will as well. If you had bothered to read the discussion above rather than vent your anger at me, you would already know that.
You're treating me as if I am the one who was disrespectful first, and was hostile without provocation. No, that was BrianFarnet. You are either knowingly distorting the events of the above exchange, which any half-intelligent dimwit could scroll up and see for themselves, or you are so furious that I would dare be rude to someone who treated me like shit that you feel compelled to chastise me, as if I care about whether you approve of my actions. It's obvious that BrianFarnet insulted me first. There is no excuse whatsoever for you to accuse me of firing the first shot.
Go wag your finger at someone who caves to social pressure and cares about social acceptance. I don't. I'm not interested in being socially accepted; I gave up seeking that long ago.
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What are you even saying? At least be coherent if you are going to try to slight me.
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If English isn't your native language, it may be useful to state that so that others (such as myself) can understand that any unclear statements from you are likely due to a language barrier and not incompetence.
In any case, I think you misunderstood what happened here and you are choosing, rather unfairly, to focus on my behavior rather than contextualizing it within the larger discussion. What my behavior rude? Of course it was. But why was it? Was there any previous mistreatment, or did the victim of my hostilities victimize me with hostility first? Was my behavior unprovoked, or might it have been in response to unprovoked hostility from someone else?
If you just look at my behavior, of course you'll conclude that I was hostile and rude, but that is hardly the entire story and it's intellectually dishonest to treat it as such. If you want to understand why I acted the way I did, read the thread above and ask me about it if you need to. Simply chastising me for my behavior, as if I'm necessarily in the wrong here, is pointless and only provokes further hostilities.
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She sees the fact that you told someone to go and kill themselves as being inexcusable, which I tend to agree with. Would you like it if someone really did it?
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I don't particularly care. It's not my life and it's not my responsibility. Such remarks aren't usually even seriously meant, and are often used in the place of other insults or remarks which all serve the same general purpose of "go away, I don't like you". To act as if "kill yourself" is particularly worse than "go play in traffic" or "fuck off and die" or "get the fuck out" is, at best, quibbling and overreacting. Perhaps if BrianFarnet wasn't an elitist who likes to talk down to others without provocation, people like me—who don't take kindly to being talked down to by elitists—wouldn't be so hostile toward them.
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You won't win any arguments in this thread no matter how much you try to outwit your opponents on this thread. One thing I can deduce is that this is about more than just being insulted. Take my advice and stop trying to 'win' this 'fight'. It won't help you feel any better, rather have the opposite effect.
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You're probably right, but the drama has already started. Even if I stop now, it's out of my control.
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Take into account that she isn't a native English speaker. This tit for tat exchange won't accomplish anything. All I can foresee is this escalating with inevitable bans. So please think about what you say, what possible repercussions every sentence has. You seem to be emotionally motivated to defend yourself even though it won't affect the views of any of those you are currently in conflict with.
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Where did you get the idea that she isn't a native English speaker? I doubt a ban would occur, unless the moderation proved irresponsible in their power, because I haven't violated a single SteamGifts rule or policy.
This is all theater and right now, the audience thinks I'm the bad guy. Why disappoint the crowd?
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You think that was an insult.... Well wait till you read mine...
Well kid, once you grow up and enter the real world, you'll discover that what BrianFarnet said was not an insult at all and that your reaction so his post, and Mullins, telling them to kill themselves, is acting like a... no I wouldn't even call you a child.. I think your own words are perfect... you are subhuman.
Just because someone insults you, does not mean you should tell them to kill themselves. You first need to become human, and then you need to grow up.
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You completely bungled that attempt. Thanks for proving that you're an elitist who sympathizes with the same sort of reactionary views as literal fascists, though. Such individuals should be lined up and shot. Feel free to extrapolate that statement and apply it to yourself.
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I'll give you the same piece of advice again. Please stop. That comment is probably going to be the one that breaks the camels back. I would advise you to be the bigger person and try to repair what damage you have done through continuing this.
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What, do you have a problem with people being openly hostile to fascist rhetoric? Don't tell me you are a fascist apologist, that the very group who wants to exterminate people like you and me should be protected because of some abstract nonsense which, in effect, rationalizes protecting the very people who have a physical agenda against you and all those you love?
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I'm referring to the 'Such individuals should be lined up and shot' comment. Again it seems that you have problems outside of this forum that you are venting about. What makes you sure we have anything in common? You have no idea what my race, religion or gender is.
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Because fascists have a physical agenda against the vast majority of demographics in the world, so the probability of you being a potential victim as well is exceedingly likely. My comment was strictly referring to those who believe the same sort of reactionary views as literal fascists, particularly the belief in an objective social hierarchy wherein the lowest are considered subhumans. I am not typically a violent person, but reactionary ideology is where I draw the line.
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I consider you subhuman because you are telling people to go kill themselves, after they have made comments to you, that are not insulting or not very insulting, yet somehow you consider them so insulting that you have to tell people to kill themselves. Its like the set a cross on fire on your lawn, or screaming the nword at you.
That is the only reason why I consider you subhuman. Its not because of your race (which btw is what fascists think) its not because you hardly give anything, its not even because of you calling people names. Its not even because I think you're an ass.
Its because you told people to kill themselves.
I have no idea how you make it in the real world, you are filled with so much vial hate, I wouldn't be surprised if you end up in jail for beating someone because they accidentally bumped into you.
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So just because I said a naughty phrase you don't like, I therefore should be disenfranchised of all my human rights and protections and treated as below that of a human? Do you understand what a subhuman, something below a human, is considered in this society? Property. You are effectively saying that I might as well be the property of someone else, the same way slaves were because they were deemed "subhuman". If you consider that appropriate, then you are a threat to humanity and should be treated as such. That isn't simply saying something offensive; that's espousing an ideology predicated on the dehumanization of others such that it is morally acceptable, according to that ideology, to own or exterminate them as desired. That goes far beyond any rude expression I could ever say.
That naughty phrase you hate so much for some inexplicable reason is not even remotely comparable to cross burning or racial slurs. The only thing comparable presented thus far is your fascist classification of another person as subhuman, which is in fact the same sort of thinking that cross burners and racists use to rationalize their beliefs and actions.
What fascists believe is an ideology of identitarian supremacism reified in a social hierarchy whose existence they consider just and natural. That can take racialized forms, as in Nazi Germany; or it can take strictly nationalist forms, as in Fascist Italy or Nationalist Spain. A racialized conception of fascism is neither necessary nor even prominent in fascist ideology outside of Nazism and its white nationalist variants. Just because you aren't considering me subhuman based on race, the fact that you seriously consider me subhuman at all is indicative of a predilection to fascist ideology.
What matters is whether I considered BrianFarnet and others' comments to be insulting and the degree to which I consider them as such, not you. That isn't because I'm special, but because the issue has to do with my response; therefore, what matters is the rationale behind my response, which necessarily includes how I assessed that to which I was responding. Your personal assessment of their comments in that determination is as valuable as a car mechanic is to a Congolese child.
Your position is simply untenable and you, remarkably, outdid me in stating something so ineffably and indefensibly detestable. But of course, it will go neglected because in the theater of this thread, I'm the antagonist and this crowd isn't particularly sympathetic to one.
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No, I'm telling BrianFarnet to off himself because he talked down to me, insulted me, and pushed this ridiculous "leeching" narrative, all without any provocation or relevance to anything I said. I can only assume you aren't mentally handicapped, so the only other conclusion is that you're being intentionally dishonest for the purposes of furthering a false narrative about me.
I'll gladly reciprocate the blacklisting. I have no respect for elitist snobs who think they are better than others simply because the inconsequential numbers on their profile are close to each other than mine are. Such individuals are clearly insecure about themselves and use this site as a vehicle for self-aggrandizement, often under the pretense of altruism or generosity. Get lost, supercilious snoot.
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You keep bringing "elitism" up when there's been one single comment about your ratio. Anything else is about you being a jerk.
Sorry for "shadow blacklisting" you months ago by the way, I didn't know I should send you an official notice.
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You are aware that "elitism" can mean more than the technical nonstandard definition of caring about SteamGifts ratios, which you apparently think it means, right? The elitist behaviors above include treating me as if I'm inferior because of me having a ratio that is not up to their arbitrary standards, using my ratio against me multiple times (not just once), literally telling me that I'm worthless or subhuman because I don't take kindly to being treated as inferior, and other similar instances.
I would like to think that users have the courage to inform another user that they're being blacklisted, if only to open up dialogue about potentially resolving the issue without having to resort to that. I use "shadow-blacklisting" to highlight how cowardly and capriciously the blacklist system is used, where users secretly blacklist each other without even attempting to resolve the issue. I understand that possession of an intact spine is rare nowadays, but that doesn't excuse such craven conduct.
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Again you bring up ratio yourself, when I don't care at all about it. Had you created thousands of giveaways, I would still think the same of you.
There is nothing to resolve with you, every time I see you posting on the forum, it just comforts in my decision to blacklist you.
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I'm obviously not talking about you, then, when I'm talking about elitism and caring about ratios. Not difficult to understand.
The blacklist system was the single worst decision that the SteamGifts administration has ever made. The solace you take is in a system which is slowly rotting and destroying the very community you "support". If you derive comfort from such conditions, then that is a mightily strange way of showing how much you care about SteamGifts.
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OK, well what does this have to do with elitism for example ?
Ah, I don't have the same opinion as you about blacklists, thus I don't care about SG. If it wasn't for it, I'm not sure I would keep creating giveaways because someone I absolutely despise might end up winning it.
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It wasn't his response that was elitist per se; that was a rational conclusion of inspecting his profile, which are almost exclusively high-leveled giveaways for a tiny minority of fellow high-leveled users.
No, I'm saying that your commitment to SteamGifts is, in my opinion, inconsistent with your support for the blacklist system because the latter is destroying the very community to which you're committed. It's very telling, however, that you would stop creating giveaways simply because someone you despise might win it.
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Good for you, your last no-restriction giveaway was almost 4 months ago, buried under a massive quantity of giveaways which are either high-leveled or restricted to very limited groups. You may have done "plenty" of low-leveled giveaways in the past, but it's obvious which groups to whom you prefer to cater and associate.
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So you have a problem with my ratio of high to low giveaways?
Chucks a hissy fit and tells everyone to kill themselves.
Final response.
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No, I have a problem with how your giveaway activities clearly indicate a complete and total disinterest in actually giving away to the bulk of the SteamGifts community, including the bottom majority which are most desperate for games. Your giveaway activities are analogous to a wealthy capitalist speculating on the stock market rather than investing it into the greater community: your goal is self-aggrandizement and association with a shrinking minority at the top, not with providing to the mass of people below.
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Oh, you again? Can't you play nicely with the other kids just once?
/rolleyes
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Stop saying it's detroying the community like it's a fact.
Numbers of created giveaways doubled right after the feature was introduced and kept growing since then.
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I specified the community for a reason, as in the social relations between users and how they manifest in the forum. The giveaway volume may continue to rise, but that doesn't mean the community is in healthy shape, anymore than a boom in the stock market indicates a healthy society. I have noticed more hostility on the forum ever since the implementation of the blacklist system, as have many others. You may not have, especially since you aren't the victim of those hostilities on a regular basis, but I see no reason to believe that the blacklist system has improved the quality of, and relations within, the community whatsoever. If anything, it's done the opposite.
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Yeah I'm sure everyone was getting along and being best buddies before. Blacklists themselves aren't the problem, it's people whining about being blacklisted. Finding myself being blacklisted has never prevented me from having a normal conversation with someone.
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But of course, it's the victims of the blacklist system who are the problem, not those who victimize others with it! Don't be ridiculous. The blacklist system disrupts social cohesion by providing the userbase with a means by which they can punish each other without any restrictions, leading to an increase in tensions and animosity between users, particularly between elitists (who are usually high-leveled users) and everybody else.
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Poor "victims", they cannot enter some giveaways, when clearly they should be entitled to. What a punishment.
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Well, okay, despite what happened previously (and me not really agreeing with a lot of things), and despite telling myself to stay out of this…
…if nothing else, this particular one has to be given to Nokkenbuer: the blacklist system inherently has a lot of unnecessary drama and friction coded into its very nature.
(So is whitelists, but to a much smaller degree.)
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yes, better to get rid of white/blacklists so people focus even more in group giveaways.
wait, i have another revolutionary idea to get rid of elitism.
let's scrap the lv and cv system!
I'm sure the site will be flooded with giveaways and people will love each other entering GAs with 15k entries each.
surely nothing will go wrong if we remove these elitist features. \o/
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That's obviously not what I meant. If you're just going to intentionally misinterpret what I'm saying to make some stupid point that doesn't even refute what I said, then go back to "supporting" this rotting community and stop wasting your time with a "leecher" like me.
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I tell you what.
If you leave the site and never come back, I'll make all level 0 giveaways for the remainder of my stay on SG. You would be contributing to the community in a huge way by leaving, and at the same time providing chances for lower level users to win a few more giveaways. You'd also be helping me get over my "elitism".
The best part, you would be contributing without buying or giving away a single game. So it's a win for everyone, right?
So, the question before you is ... how generous are you?
My bet's on the fact that you're just a greedy prick with an excuse for everything, though. ;)
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I don't believe you for a moment, since you have consistently proven yourself to be an unrepentant degenerate and shameless troll. My refusal to accept your offer is because I don't believe you for a moment and I owe this community nothing, especially when it's filled with, and I am almost constantly abused in the forum by, despicable ingrates like you. That's not greed. That's mistrust and hatred.
How about you create those giveaways for everyone anyway? How generous are you? Or are you just a "greedy prick" who doesn't give a shit about anything other than self-aggrandizement and have no interest in giving away to people who probably can't afford games for themselves—you know, "leechers" like me?
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It's not an excuse, imbecile. It's an explanation of why I wouldn't, principally because I have zero reason whatsoever to believe a contemptible person like you. If you knew a compulsive liar who has always mistreated and swindled you, and they promised you to do something if only you satisfy this and that condition, would you believe them? Would you accept the offer? Oh, but they said that if you don't agree, it'll only prove to everyone that you're this or that negative quality! Give me a break. These sort of games may work on children and the rest of your peers, but they don't work on me.
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I think everyone here knows I'd do it (including you). ;)
Also - considering I've never lied to you nor swindled you, doesn't that make you the only liar here, calling me both? ;)
At any rate, the offer will stand. Please feel free to take me up on it.
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I doubt that, and most importantly, I don't.
What I did was called an analogy. I wasn't saying that you swindled me, or even that you're a liar. I recommend you work on your reading comprehension skills.
This is going nowhere. Final response.
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i actually believe you would do that.
check the winners for offense ofcourse
well done ;)
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As if Tzaar would actually do it. You aren't fooling anyone.
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I've had the priviledge to getting know him a bit better. To the point I'd vouch for him actually delivering on his promises. But that opinion comes from another elitist snob...
Being lazy, I'll write my responses to the subthread in one place. Sorry for that
First, I'm not in the minority of native english speakers. Thing you should assume about everyone in global community unless proved otherwise. There is whole big world outside of Texas and most of it doesn't speak english
do everyone a favor and kill yourself immediately
You should not be surprised of the community reaction after those words. Phrase is usable with not literal meaning only among people that know each other, and even then it needs context (usually non-verbal). You on the other hand are known (at least for me) as, so to speak, "professor Nokkenbuer giving lectures". One that picks obscure words known to maybe 5% of population because they carry the exact meaning he thinks of. Why do you expect the phrase you used to be interpreted differently than literally? Think about it
Last but not least few quotes:
I don't particularly care. It's not my life and it's not my responsibility
Additionally, the welfare I'm able to receive isn't much because Texas...
disrupts social cohesion
So you want cohesive community, voluntarily taking responsibility for others (you) but you don't wan't to return the favour? Rhetoric question I think...
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English is the second most spoken language on Earth and the first second language on Earth. It may be a minority, but it's the common language in much of the world and on this site. For that reason, it's not unreasonable to assume someone can speak English competently when on an English-speaking site, especially when they were speaking passable English just moments before. I don't need to be condescendingly reproached about the fact of there being a world outside of Texas; I'm well aware of that fact and wish I was there rather than here.
You on the other hand are known (at least for me) as, so to speak, "professor Nokkenbuer giving lectures". One that picks obscure words known to maybe 5% of population because they carry the exact meaning he thinks of. Why do you expect the phrase you used to be interpreted differently than literally? Think about it
Fine, I see what you mean. What I meant when I said it was basically, "if that is how you're going to treat me, you're as good as dead to me". Of course I didn't mean it literally; I hardly know enough about BrianFarnet to even begin to make such an assessment.
It's probably unfair for me to expect the community to detect flippancy from someone who is generally the opposite of flippant and usually criticizes it, however, so that was a failure on my part. Obviously, this community isn't as open to the sort of verbal hostilities that I'm used to, either, since the bulk of my historical forum activity on the Internet is on fora where that sort of extreme rhetoric is commonplace. Again, my fault for forgetting that the norms here are much more mainstream and significantly toned down from those within which I normally operate.
So you want cohesive community, voluntarily taking responsibility for others (you) but you don't wan't to return the favour? Rhetoric question I think...
You're contextomizing my statements, which you know is unfair. The first statement is specifically about suicide. It's not my responsibility to monitor my every activity out of irrational fear of the extremely unlikely happenstance that I'm talking to an imminent suicide victim because it is not my life and not a life whose continued living is up to me. This is completely different from the social responsibility that greater society has to its people, especially when the system within which that society operates fails to provide those people with the means of helping themselves. I do want a cohesive community, but my acquiescence to abuse won't help achieve that. It's not contradictory to want a cohesive community and still be affected by, and caught up in, socially disruptive activities as a result of the community lacking any social cohesion.
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Sorry for the late reply, landline suffered in the storm and it took me a while to setup temporary gprs link
No. You cannot expect language competency on par with native speakers from the majority. English is todays lingua franca but it can hardly be called proper English. Most of the time it is limited to most basic vocabulary and only primary meanings of words. No nuances, tertiary meanings, idioms and so on.
Indeed, Texas remark was not in good taste, but yours other comments activated the "we(Americans) are the center of the world" stereotype (and being an evil cat, I'm expected to be mean ;)
norms here are much more mainstream and significantly toned down ....
I can only feel sorry for you if you are forced to operate in such hostile enviroments (or wonder why do you keep on being active there willingly). SG is not particualry rainbows and unicorms, politcally correct place neither is harsh, free for all. Just a normal, civilized space.
Mmm, how about if I put it this way: "I won't oppose cutting down welfare programs out of irrational fear someone might lose roof over his head or be hungry. I'm not responsible for their life nor wellbeing".
If you don't care about others problems/needs and consequences of your actions on others, don't be surprised you are treated the same way. Want caring society taking responsibility for others, act as if you were part of one - there is no other way around.
On a side note, death wishes, used outside of circle of friends are, well, death wishes. Not very far from rhethoric used by nazi-like groups, the only difference being single target instead of ethnic group
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No. You cannot expect language competency on par with native speakers from the majority.
I didn't state otherwise. Read what I said. I never stated competency "on par with native speakers from the majority", merely competency in English, presumably such that it is passable.
Indeed, Texas remark was not in good taste, but yours other comments activated the "we(Americans) are the center of the world" stereotype
Then you grossly misinterpreted my statements, and that seems to reflect more on you than me.
Mmm, how about if I put it this way: "I won't oppose cutting down welfare programs out of irrational fear someone might lose roof over his head or be hungry. I'm not responsible for their life nor wellbeing".
At this point, I'm beginning to think you're being intentionally fallacious. No, that is not a comparable statement. Like I stated above, there is a fundamental difference between individual responsibility in a relation between two people and the social responsibility a society has to its people. Moreover, poverty-induced homelessness or hunger as a result of cutting welfare programs is not an irrational fear in the slightest. That is a documented fact and the unanimity of credible statistics support it. If you're going to try and twist my words against me, at least try to use an example that is comparable and makes sense.
If you don't care about others problems/needs and consequences of your actions on others, don't be surprised you are treated the same way. Want caring society taking responsibility for others, act as if you were part of one - there is no other way around.
Again, there is a fundamental difference between being individually responsible for whether someone commits suicide and being socially responsible for the welfare of others. Suicide is a decision someone makes, and thus it is their responsibility and theirs alone. Being deprived of welfare programs is not their decision, so it is the responsibility of those who make that decision, namely society. No, I don't need to "act as if" I'm a part of a caring society in order to want a caring society, nor is that even an effective method at achieving one. What complete nonsense.
You are trying to compare and equate two fundamentally different scenarios in an attempt at contriving a flaw in my position that isn't really there. If you're going to seriously equate saying a naughty phrase to a stranger on the Internet with cutting welfare programs for the poor, then this conversation is through.
On a side note, death wishes, used outside of circle of friends are, well, death wishes. Not very far from rhethoric used by nazi-like groups, the only difference being single target instead of ethnic group
Once more, you are trying to equate my passing remark using a naughty phrase with the physical agenda and ideology of Nazi groups. Those are, yet again, not comparable. It's clear that you're not trying to have a fair and civil discussion; you're more interested in insidiously demonizing me and fallaciously distorting my position in the hopes that the audience wouldn't catch onto it and go along with your rhetoric. That's pathetic and I refuse to entertain such dishonest attempts at discrediting me. Don'y expect another response.
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Then it is misunderstanding which proves my point. We do attach different meanings to the "competent" word. For you it's basic/entry level skills, for me one notch below expert. Translation barrier at it's best.
On top of that goes cultural barrier adding another level of misunderstandig. To give you an example, for me the word black doesn't carry any emotional load, yet, for Americans it often does and since I've learned that I take particular care when using it to not be misunderstood.
This work both ways of course, but what I've noticed, native speakers tend to forget about it and assume that when someone speaks their language better than "Me Tarzan,you Jane" he is understood as if by fellow countryman.
This is how I currently see you after over a year of yours postings I have been reading. Your way is the only right way, anything different is wrong and/or immoral. This in itself is not wrong, but I also have strong impression that you are not willing to change any of your opinions nor accept the fact that different views can be eqully right as yours (not to mention admiting you may be wrong).
... What complete nonsense ...
Interesting, very interesting. Please explain to me how it would work, because I cannot imagine having caring society formed up from "I don't care" type of individuals. Unless you think society is something external an totally apart from individuals or you are the only one with "I don't care" mindset
The scenarios are different and taken to extemes on purpose. You chose to focus on differences, labelling them fundamental (in your opinion) therefore invalid and not worth your time. Be it so. Or maybe it's my limited communication skills to which I admit.
I'll try once more, maybe this time it will be clearer
When every individual cares only about consequences of his words and actions for him, his family, his friends and nobody else, in that particualr order, society formed by them will be exactly the same. Society is not an external entity, it doesn't have any responsibilities by itself. Ask yourself a question, if whether I will live or not is mine and only mine business, not yours, why should I care how or where you live? After all it is your choice to continue living in conditions available to you. Do you see the logic? The ultimate consequences of yours "I'd don't care about" mindset? It only need one small step at the time, today suicidals, tomorrow disabled.
Ehm, again, nazi example is taking things to extremes. But do you really think it is that much difference between wishing "I want you dead" when wearing armband with svastika on it or without it? A wish is a wish, one that I don't see any excuses for and don't care about whether it is motivated by racial hatred or not.
What irks me more, you don't see anything wrong in it and keep on defending it
I don't care what audience will think of you. I don't even care much what audience will think of me. I felt I should write what I think and I did it as best as I could (which probably was not very good nor clear, but whatever). I don't have to play a game to say what I think of you. I can say it straight in your face. I think you are pretty selfish and self-centered as a gyroscope. If you expect I'll call you a leech you are wrong, you don't fit my operating definition of that term. Try harder for that. You were not BLed before and won't be now (as you already checked) - again you don't fit my criteria. Yet.
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It's not an excuse, especially when you prove it so openly like you have just done. Maybe you are mentally handicapped, since a troll would actually be more clever than to misuse my own statements on me (which aren't even applicable to me) and to be so oblivious about the clearly elitist behavior you're demonstrating.
In any case, I'm not going to waste my time with you. Final response.
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Gifs are seldom this accurate and on-point. But they're great when they are. :p
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In my language theres a nice word for people like you: 'Weh' or in Highgerman roughly 'Opfer' which roughly translates to 'victim' but in an oversensitive way.
Btw.. i dont see any reason to respect you for beeing a human. Respect needs to be earned and is nothing you get for just beeing 'there'.
Oh.. and just for my stupid self.. can you please tell me where i find the shadow-blacklist function? Read the FAQ but didnt find anything about it.
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Respect beyond the basic respect you allot to all people is to be earned. To act as if respect must absolutely be earned is absurd. When you meet someone new, are you a utter asshole to them until they earn the right to no longer be disrespected by you? Of course not. You give them a certain basic respect until their actions modify that attitude.
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no. thats not respect. thats just 'not-beeing-an-asshole'
if you decide for yourself that indifferent behavior is respect... thats really sad...
as you like dry analysis of human interaction:
if a human beeing meets another one, without interacting they both decide on their appearance what kind of person that other is. based on communication this then may differ.. but its not without reason called "first-impression"
you might abstract that i respect their right of privacy or their right to speak or anything like that.. but that has nothing to do with 'respecting the person' aka their 'self' (sorry dont know whats the scientific english expression.. ) .. i might respect their archetype if their visual appearance might indicate that... but... not the person.
as you define your persona on the web through what you write (and a little bit the avatar ;P) thats the only thing that reflects your 'self'
if that is a real reflection of the person whos writing that is another thing...
concluding...
i know an english saying: sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt
might help you getting over thinking about someone maybe implied something..
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I'm using "respect" here to refer to a value that is assigned to people in varying degrees of intensity. Interestingly enough, "basic human respect" has been roughly defined elsewhere, so I'll just refer to it. It doesn't matter, though. It's pointless to quibble over the semantics so long as you understand what is meant.
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Telling people to kill themselves, even on the internet, is unacceptable behaviour to me, and makes you the immature one in this discussion.
Leeching habits could be relevant as they c/would create cognitive dissonance which would colour your perception of the situation. Telling people to kill themselves is never okay, so you calling someone out on the relevance of their remark is one of the worst 'pot calling the kettle black'-scenarios I've come across in a while.
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I'm not interested in your finger-wagging. Wag at someone else, such as BrianFarnet for his initial hostilities.
Leeching habits could be relevant as they c/would create cognitive dissonance which would colour your perception of the situation.
That makes no sense whatsoever. Complete word salad.
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Okay I'll ELY5.
Cognitive dissonance is a thought process that takes place when you are presented with different opinions from your own. Your brain disregards evidence that does not support your own opinion. It has been happening to you throughout this entire discussion. You are not consciously aware that this happens. You could have googled the concept, just saying.
Your habits on this website could affect your opinion on this particular topic, even if you claim that they do not. You might not even be aware that it's the case. So, them mentioning your ratio was relevant in this discussion, if only as background info.
And I'll wag my finger at whomever I fucking want. In this case, I'm wagging it at you because nothing warrants telling people to off themselves. Do you talk to people like that IRL too?
And since you seem to make a fuss about shadow blacklisting, I rarely blacklist anyone, but you have definitely earned yourself a spot.
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That's not what cognitive dissonance is. What you're describing is closer to cherrypicking, confirmation bias, or denialism. You could have googled the concept, as well, in which case you'd discover that cognitive dissonance is something much different from what you just described. What you described, despite not being cognitive dissonance, has indeed been happening to me this entire discussion, but I am not the one suffering from it.
Sure, my habits on giveaway sites could affect my opinion on this particular topic. It probably does. And? That doesn't excuse BrianFarnet's unprovoked potshot about my ratio. If it was really such an important factoid, users can check my profile for themselves (and subsequently shadow-blacklist me, as most do). There is no reason why a random user should attempt to publicly shame, degrade, and obliquely insult me by bringing it up, though. And no, it isn't relevant to the specific topic being discussed. It's "background info" and just that, but it's not relevant to anything I said or anything the OP said.
Yes, I do talk to people in-person like this, if they treat me like shit.
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Confirmation bias is a form of cognitive dissonance.
Source: took a year of psychology classes before switching majors.
Edit: even on the wiki: "(...)is confronted by new information that conflicts with existing beliefs, ideas, or values."
And I feel bad for everyone who's ever talked to you.
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I have never once heard the assertion that "confirmation bias is a form of cognitive dissonance", nor does that really even make sense. In what way is a cognitive bias like confirmation bias inherently a form of cognitive dissonance? Having confirmation bias does not entail the maintenance of self-contradicting cognition or contradictions between cognition and action, only a tendency to prefer information which favors and confirms one's beliefs or claims. That may occur in conjunction with cognitive dissonance and it may share certain general characteristics with cognitive dissonance, and for that reason they are considered to be vaguely related phenomena. The claim that confirmation bias is a form of cognitive dissonance, however, seems to me like more a misunderstanding or poor explanation of the relationship between the two phenomena than a credible assertion. That may have been what you were told in your college psychology classes, but I see no reason to support that classification and no established rationale for such a classification.
Wikipedia's lead on cognitive dissonance doesn't support the notion that confirmation bias is a form of it. All that clause states is that cognitive dissonance can be when an individual "is confronted by new information that conflicts with existing beliefs, ideas, or values" and, presumably, experiences mental stress as a result of a developing internal contradiction, either within their cognition or between their cognition and conduct. Such an experience might involve confirmation bias, such as the agent preferring information that confirms the beliefs they held before that new information was presented or giving undue weight to arguments which support that challenged belief, but that does not mean that confirmation bias is a form of cognitive dissonance, anymore than an oxymoron is a form of cognitive dissonance. Consider the only paragraph in the Wikipedia article on confirmation bias which mentions "cognitive dissonance" (emphasis added):
In this experiment, the participants made their judgments while in a magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) scanner which monitored their brain activity. As participants evaluated contradictory statements by their favored candidate, emotional centers of their brains were aroused. This did not happen with the statements by the other figures. The experimenters inferred that the different responses to the statements were not due to passive reasoning errors. Instead, the participants were actively reducing the cognitive dissonance induced by reading about their favored candidate's irrational or hypocritical behavior. There were strong differences in these evaluations, with participants much more likely to interpret statements from the candidate they opposed as contradictory.
This does not state or imply that confirmation bias is a form of cognitive dissonance, only that confirmation bias can be used to cope with cognitive dissonance.
Your condolences aren't necessary. Most people are amicable or at least civil toward me, so I reciprocate the attitude. Only when hostilities are initiated do I intentionally become hostile, and I do so in order to reciprocate the very attitude they show to me, just like I do when they are civil. The only event wherein I initiate hostilities is when I inadvertently and unintentionally redirect previous unexpressed hostility at someone else, which is a common psychological phenomenon I assume you learned all about in your psychology classes.
Perhaps the facts about me I just articulated can tip you off on why I was hostile above and below and just about anywhere else where I was hostile. It may also suggest to you that perhaps you shouldn't feel bad for the people who's talked to me because those aforementioned facts imply that they were the generally assholes who initiated hostilities, not me.
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I won't get involved with this but I just have to say never ever tell someone to kill themselves. Keep saying it and maybe one day someone will go and off themselves. How would you feel then? Even if someone has disrespected you (on a forum, no less) the fact that you would wish death on someone is disturbing. All I'm saying is if you really feel the need to make a person feel like shit at least use an insult that won't jeopardize their life
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Refer to what I said above. I'm not jeopardizing anyone's life by using one insult over another. Such rhetoric is a dishonest attempt at shifting the blame of someone's actions onto someone else. If someone commits suicide, that's their decision. Don't try to find someone else to blame for their decision.
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You're saying that all those people that have killed themselves due to insults like yours, you're telling me it's their fault. What kind of sick logic is that?
And saying "fuck off and die" or "go play in traffic" is literally just another way to phrase "i wish you would die." But from reading your responses to everyone else's mostly reasonable comments has proven to me that you have no empathy towards others and I'm wasting my time trying to explain to you why wishing death upon someone is a bad thing. It's laughable that you can't grasp that concept
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Of course it's their fucking fault. They pulled the trigger, jumped off the chair, used the razor. It was their choice. To act as if I'm culpable for their actions is complete nonsense. If someone told another person to "get lost" and that other person literally got lost and died in a forest because they couldn't find their way out, is it the fault of the person who said "get lost"? This is how ridiculous your argument is.
Of course I have empathy toward others. That empathy quickly dries up when those individuals behave contemptibly and degrade me in public, though. Clearly, you are too busy spinning this false narrative about me to care about such facts, however, since you're more interested in acting as if insults and hyperbolic declarations are to be taken literally, which nobody seriously does and you're lying to yourself if you believe people do.
What's laughable is your pathetic attempt at demonizing me with your manufactured, insincere outrage about my actions. If you want to go put on a show, join an acting troupe.
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I told you that you see the world in black and white :D ... where the world is mostly gray
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And you would, again, be wrong. Go find someone else to make juvenile assessments about. I'm not interested.
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Be wrong about what, that the world is not black and white or that you see the world in black and white .
" Go find someone else to make juvenile assessments about" , you use often the world kid and or juvenile as an insult , it is a insult to be a kid , I don't think so , or are you implying that a juvenile assessments is something wrong or stupid , do you know that there are kids with IQ's bigger than ours combined or you believe that in the world all kids are stupid then us ?
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You're wrong about your assessment of my worldview, obviously. Using language that refers to someone or something as childish is an insult because it implies a lack of maturity in some capacity. It's not so much a matter of intelligence as it is a matter of maturity.
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"It's not so much a matter of intelligence as it is a matter of maturity." Are you implying that all kids in the world have the same level of maturity as you say , that depends on the individual and the community so you are only using this as a stereotipe which you said that you don't like(lecher for exemple) , this what you use is just a narrow way to view life .
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There is a limit to how mature a child can be by virtue of their neurological development and their lifespan, which only allots a certain maximum possible amount of experiences they could have in that timeframe. It's reasonable to assume that a child is, on average, significantly less mature than an adult based on these facts. This has nothing to do with stereotyping. It doesn't even make sense to say that I'm "stereotyping" children as a whole by using infantilizing language.
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"It's reasonable to assume that a child is, on average, significantly less mature than an adult based on these facts." As you said is "reasonable to assume", meaning is not a fact . And there are adults that just didn't do a lot in their to be more mature than some children that endured a lot meaning that those particularly "children" can be more mature then those particularly "adults'' making your assumption may be wrong
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Fine, then I'll state it more definitively: a child is, on average, significantly less mature than an adult. This is a factual statement and the unanimity of data supports this claim.
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Yep this, I can say that I approve of .
It was interesting our discussion but real life calls PEACE :V
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There are people who've killed themselves over being told repeatedly that they should do so. If you tell someone who's unstable to do it, they just might, which in turn would make it your fault. Sure, you wouldn't be the only one at fault if such a thing happened, but you wouldn't be without blame.
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Refer above. Suicide is a result of when suffering exceeds the resources available to cope with that suffering. It is the responsibility of the person to ensure those coping resources are available, not a stranger on the Internet. If that person is seriously so unstable, then perhaps they should seek psychiatric help or additional coping resources to aid in ameliorating their instability rather than picking fights with strangers on the Internet and engaging in unprovoked hostilities with others. Trying to act as if I am culpable for the actions of others is ridiculous, especially when I am the one being victimized by their unprovoked hostilities.
If someone commits suicide because of the statement of a random stranger on the Internet, then it was only a matter of time and someone's potential involvement in triggering it is more happenstance than anything else. It's not my responsibility to censor myself out of irrational fear of some hypothetical, highly improbable freak scenario wherein an extremely unstable person takes my passing remarks seriously. If you want to chastise someone for poor behavior, go talk to BrianFarnet. His behavior provoked me, and by the same logic you're using to hold me culpable for his hypothetical suicide, he is culpable for provoking me (and thus of his own suicide).
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There might be limited resources to cope with it and many of those actually go to psychologists. Like for example there's youths who have been born in abusive families and get bullied in school while going to psychologists, how much resources to cope with their abuse do you think they'd have? Barely any, and your reply might be the trigger. You can try to argue all you want, but your involvement and fault in the hypothetical suicide after encouraging the person to die would still not go away. No matter if you were serious or not when saying so.
Though as both I and others have said in earlier replies, what they said was not at all any "unprovoked hostility". What they did was giving a fairly neutral disagreeing reply. Sure, they added the leeching part which might've been in a little bit more negative tone. But then again, to be honest the leeching part was relevant in regards to what you wrote since you talked down about the more generous members of this community, basically calling them selfish for giving away games, which was a little bit provoking. Because you do know that being selfish is viewed as a negative trait, right? This makes his slightly negative reply to you warranted, yet you telling him to die is not, it never is (suicide is not a joking matter after all). So the victim here is not you, it's those you told to die.
And no matter whether he "provoked" you or not, you shouldn't tell him to die. If you have to be rude and offensive in your reply, you can go with other routes.
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If someone tells a person to "get lost" and by sheer improbable coincidence that person, who so happens to be unstable or otherwise mentally ill, takes it literally, proceeds to get lost in a forest, and dies by failing to escape to safety, is the person who told that individual to "get lost" culpable for their actions and subsequent death?
Basically telling someone that they're a "leech" is hardly a "fairly neutral disagreeing reply". I didn't "talk down to" anyone. My original post was a completely neutral critique of why people give away on giveaway sites. There is a difference between self-interest and selfishness, which is apparently lost on you.
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That is a blatant case of moral equivalence. You aren't going to convince anyone that telling someone to "get lost" or calling someone a leech is the same as telling someone to kill yourself no matter how you spin it. Perhaps you should just chalk this one up to a lesson in futility because all you are doing is ending up on more blacklists.
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The same fundamental argument applies. If person A tells person B to do X and person B (who is H) does X, should person A be held accountable for the actions of person B in doing X?
I don't care at this point. This community has proven itself to be a cesspit of some of the most immature and despicable people I have ever had the displeasure to meet, so I see no reason why I should worry about being blacklisted. I will be blacklisted no matter what I do, or if I do anything at all, because of the insidious rot that the blacklisting system has brought onto this community. Even if I apologize and beg for forgiveness, I'll probably just be blacklisted more. This community is dead to me because I am dead to this community. Until I'm not treated like shit on a regular basis by this community, and it finally removes this stupid blacklist system, don't expect me to start caring anytime soon.
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And by that same logic, the person—in this case, BrianFarnet—is adding to my suffering by being so hostile toward me, which demonstrates just how little regard they have for me as a person.
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Of course I do. I escalated hostilities in my response to express my anger at BrianFarnet for his unprovoked potshot. So? Are you going to quibble about whether the tit is commensurate with the tat, as if that matters to the greater issues manifest in this thread?
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I've been suicidal, or at least severely depressed and contemplating suicide, for most of my life. Don't talk about my life as if you know it. You don't.
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I haven't assumed anything about you, what are you talking about? You're the only one here making assumptions about the other person, based off zero evidence, in order to further a ridiculous narrative whose function is to demonize and discredit that person.
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who said i'm crazy?!
is that because of the nude selfie i posted?
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When I joined I thought it great that I could win stuff. Won a couple, was having a good time on the site, loving the feeling when I won something. Thought I'd give people that same feeling by starting to make giveaways. It also felt selfish to just take when I'm in a position to give as well.
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Same. Even though all i've given away are bundled games I hope they make someones day or they are just that one game they've been interested in or hunting for for quite some time and that when they win it from me it's a good thing since I always feel good when I win.
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In the Soviet Union you don't give games away, games give you away.
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Because I'm dumb and need to use pro strats like you
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when i have a little free money i come to friends for bbq or beer, on sales we bye same games to play, but i cant imagine why spend money to unknown people
maybe i dont have so much free money and cant understand this, but why?
pls type here your reasons
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